Weasel Straw strikes again (Pakistani men in Britain see white girls as "easy meat")

[nino_savatte]

Neo-con fucktard, Douglas Murray was on Newsnight last night trying to make cultural & political capital out of it.

 

[Garek]

Yeah but so-called honour killings aren't limited to Muslim communities - are they? A Sikh woman was killed in Greenford in London last year. Her hand was severed and she was left to bleed to death. Honour killings also occur in some Balkan communities.

I apologise in advance for the source
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1228561/Woman-dies-hours-mutilated-street-hand-cut-off.html

Sorry, I was unclear. I was thinking in a more general sense of allowing for the existance of very closed communities within our society, and our reluctance to interfere in theose those communities for fear of it being seen as racist. British society can be tolerant to a fault.

 

[DrRingDing]

Have you read what he actually said in your link - and the back up he received from within some sections of the Muslim community - the C4 news was very clear on this last night and had muslim 'leaders' arguing the same as Mohammed Shafiq and Straw. (Regardless of whether straw's motivation is actually to shore up his own vote.)

You're presuming I'm saying this doesn't go on. It does.

I'd wager that I'm the only one on this thread to have really suffered at the hands of 'traditional' islamic values.

 

[Garek]

I'd wager that I'm the only one on this thread to have really suffered at the hands of 'traditional' islamic values.

Don't resort to trump cards, it looks pretty pathetic

 

[butchersapron]

You're presuming I'm saying this doesn't go on. It does.

I'd wager that I'm the only one on this thread to have really suffered at the hands of 'traditional' islamic values.

No i'm not. I'm presuming no such thing - and it's utterly irrelevant to the point that i made. I'm saying that what you said Straw did ("Trying to tar massive communities by the actions of very small groups") he didn't going on the evidence of your own link.

Oh please. Don't.

 

[ernestolynch]

Because the liberals have appropriated the response from the left. The right see it as their baby.

A strongly militant atheist and anti-multicultural response is what should happen, to prevent liberals like ringsting and nina from presenting a liberal fake-left response.

 

[nino_savatte]

The Chechen president actually approves of honour killings
http://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/b...kadyrov-defends-honour-killings-14208919.html

 

[DrRingDing]

No i'm not. I'm presuming no such thing - and it's utterly irrelevant to the point that i made. I'm saying that what you said Straw did ("Trying to tar massive communities by the actions of very small groups") he didn't going on the evidence of your own link.

He knows exactly what he's doing.

 

[Garek]

A strongly militant atheist and anti-multicultural response is what should happen, to prevent liberals like ringsting and nina from presenting a liberal fake-left response.

Ignoring the tautology I quite agree

 

[ernestolynch]

Could have been worded better but it's time the liberal 'left' fucked off.

 

[pk]

He knows exactly what he's doing.

Do you really believe his comments mean he is a "weasel"?

 

[DrRingDing]

A strongly militant atheist and anti-multicultural response is what should happen

Indeed.

 

[butchersapron]

He knows exactly what he's doing.

Of course he bloody does - you don't appear to though. That is, shore up a socially conservative white w/c vote (as he sees it) whilst allying with leading elements of the Muslim communities keen to get official approval for themselves and the communities they're supposed to represent (as they see it). Two for one.

Any chance you could start doing replies that have some sort of connection to the posts they're supposed to be responses to?

 

[DrRingDing]

Do you really believe his comments mean he is a "weasel"?

Politically cashing in on shit stirring in communities that have enough problems is the actions of a cunt.

 

[Garek]

Of course he bloody does - you don't appear to though. That is, shore up a socially conservative white w/c vote (as he sees it) whilst allying with leading elements of the Muslim communities keen to get official approval for themselves and the communities they're supposed to represent (as they see it). Two for one.

Quite interesting really. Left wing movements --> anti racist --> Labout naturally draws strength from this --> multiculturism --> people now broken up by race into communities --> Labour drawing strength from ethnic block voting.

Apologies for writing it that way, a little hingover for proper sentances.

 

[butchersapron]

Let me get this right ringding, you think the things straw says happen do indeed happen but to talk about them happening is wrong? If so, how then should what you say is happening be dealt with?

 

[Garek]

Politically cashing in on shit stirring in communities that have enough problems is the actions of a cunt.

Yes it is, but that doesn't mean this issue should be swept under the carpet.

 

[DrRingDing]

Let me get this right ringding, you think the things straw says happen do indeed happen but to talk about them happening is wrong? If so, how then should what you say is happening be dealt with?

It should be dealt with by the communities affected. I don't see shit stirring in the media as helping at all.

 

[pk]

Politically cashing in on shit stirring in communities that have enough problems is the actions of a cunt.

I think as former Home Secretary he is in a better position to go public with this than anyone else.

Again, the notion that political gain should be made from child abuse is at odds with the genuine need to address the situation, no matter how uncomfortable it is for those who believe that certain cultural nastiness is somehow compatible with traditional British values.

It will offend the sensibilities of many and will probably damage relations between the white working class and the Muslim communities - but it does need to be tackled. He's not making this stuff up.

 

[Garek]

It should be dealt with by the communities affected. I don't see shit stirring in the media as helping at all.

What, leave it to all be solved internally? Oh great That's always a good thing. Can't see that going wrong at all.

The notion of 'communities' is a false one, and an oppressive one.

 

[frogwoman]

when I was at uni, there were groups of (mostly asian and east european) men who would hang around our road late at night and ask young women (including me on a couple of occasions) if they wanted to go for drinks etc. A mate of mine once decided to go back there just to see what would happen and she said that they went into this room and she saw all of these drugged up teenage girls and young women lying on sofas and loads of people taking drugs. She said that some of them were asleep or didn't know what they were doing - she made a run for it shortly after that because she was so freaked out.

I know that this does happen but pretty sure it's not just confined to one community doing this, right?

 

[pk]

It should be dealt with by the communities affected. I don't see shit stirring in the media as helping at all.

It isn't being dealt with by the communities affected - the white working class communities have no voice to address these issues, and the Muslim communities are scared to upset the applecart by pointing out the failings and serious issues within its makeup.
It has much to do with honour, and is considered something that should not be dealt with by non-islamic law.

 

[nino_savatte]

when I was at uni, there were groups of (mostly asian and east european) men who would hang around our road late at night and ask people if they wanted to go for drinks etc. A mate of mine once decided to go back there just to see what would happen and she said that they went into this room and she saw all of these drugged up teenage girls and young women lying on sofas and loads of people taking drugs. She said that some of them were asleep or didn't know what they were doing - she made a run for it shortly after that because she was so freaked out.

I know that this does happen but pretty sure it's not just confined to one community doing this, right?

Exactly but it won't stop the likes of Gilligan or that cretin, Douglas Murray from claiming that is a unique to Muslim youths.

 

[pk]

I know that this does happen but pretty sure it's not just confined to one community doing this, right?

Albanian gangs are known for human trafficking women into the brothels of Europe, and Baltic states have their own similar issues where underage girls are seen as fair game.

However, the difference is that they don't have large established communities in the UK in the same scale as Pakistani communities.

 

[frogwoman]

pretty sure (in fact i know) that the muslim community isn'tt the only one to do "honour" mate

 

[editor]

It should be dealt with by the communities affected

Why should the families of the abused girls be expected to keep quiet?


(more detail added to thread title for clarity)

 

[pk]

Exactly but it won' stop the likes of Gilligan or that cretin, Douglas Murray from claiming that is a unique to Muslim youths.

Of course it plays into the hands of the neocon scumbags. It's unfortunate but this should not be a barrier to discussion.

 

[nino_savatte]

pretty sure (in fact i know) that the muslim community isn'tt the only one to do "honour" mate

Aye, this is a familiar and very popular myth that honour killings only happen in Muslim communities. As I pointed out earlier, it isn't and the case of the young Sikh woman who was murdered by Sikh men because she had an affair is a case in point.

 

[nino_savatte]

Of course it plays into the hands of the neocon scumbags. It's unfortunate but this should not be a barrier to discussion.

But you make the classic mistake of thinking that this sort of thing only happens among Muslim youths. It does not.

 

[frogwoman]

sadly i've met jewish people with these attitudes too - the idea that non-jewish girls are just for "practice" etc. one guy i met said as much to me once and after a conversation with my dad - who's also jewish btw , he said that he'd met a number of men with these attitudes, and more shocking ones than that over the years.