Ukip - why are they gaining support?
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gosub
~#
compounded by Labour's strategy of hammer away at getting Lib Dem votes and don't say anything else that might impact on that.
butchersapron
Bring back hanging
That's the general election - they don't have any such strategy for the euros. Their euro strategy is keep quiet and let UKIP cause trouble for the tories
J Ed
Follow Back Pro Expropriation
This is a weird story, if true it's something for people who welcome state restrictions on speech...
Anti-UKIP blogger visited by police and told to self censor
Buzzfeed link: http://www.buzzfeed.com/jonstone/police-investigate-man-for-criticising-ukip-on-twitter
From the blogger himself: http://axeofreason.blogspot.co.uk/2014/05/you-are-not-allowed-to-read-this-blog.html?m=1
edit: Picked up by the Graunid as well http://www.theguardian.com/politics/2014/may/12/police-ask-blogger-remove-legitimate-tweet-ukip
Anti-UKIP blogger visited by police and told to self censor
Buzzfeed link: http://www.buzzfeed.com/jonstone/police-investigate-man-for-criticising-ukip-on-twitter
From the blogger himself: http://axeofreason.blogspot.co.uk/2014/05/you-are-not-allowed-to-read-this-blog.html?m=1
edit: Picked up by the Graunid as well http://www.theguardian.com/politics/2014/may/12/police-ask-blogger-remove-legitimate-tweet-ukip
Disgraceful.
"Ukip - why are they gaining support?"
UKIP speak about issues which are of popular concern but which due to the prescriptive politically correct climate under which we live people may be too fearful to speak of themselves and which the regulated media and those who follow their agenda do not wish to see discussed. That is why they attract such strong enmity, liberals have become accustomed to controlling the political debate.
UKIP speak about issues which are of popular concern but which due to the prescriptive politically correct climate under which we live people may be too fearful to speak of themselves and which the regulated media and those who follow their agenda do not wish to see discussed. That is why they attract such strong enmity, liberals have become accustomed to controlling the political debate.
butchersapron
Bring back hanging
Hello again. It's cultural marxism isn't it? Seriously - your views are not mainstream or popular. They are are bonkers brevik. No one holds them. You do not speak for the common woman.
andysays
Love and solidarity
I didn't watch the interview, so I don't know what was said or not said in that interview. But are you saying that you know for certain the story in the Telegraph is factually incorrect, ie that Nigel Farage never made any reference to anyone disassociating themselves from UAF's actions, either in that interview or elsewhere?
If this is the case, might it have been useful to point this out when you posted the link?
Otherwise it just looks like you're doing what you do far too often, IMO, which is to throw ill-explained stuff out there, and then attack people when they don't immediately grasp the point you're seeking to make. You still haven't made a coherent point in any of this Farage/Doreen Lawrence/Telegraph business, as far as I can see, you're more interested in having a go at someone for mentioning Diane Abbott.
At your best, you make a great contribution to these boards, greater than most and certainly greater than me, but if you're actually seeking to persuade anyone of your point of view, I suggest you need to spend a little more time and a little more care explaining what you actually mean, and why why you think the way you do. Otherwise it appears that you often care more about "being right" and cunting off anyone and everyone who doesn't immediately agree with you, than actually making a constructive contribution.
And seperate to that, if this introducing of Doreen Lawrence into the story of UAF trying to "silence" Farage didn't come from Farage, do you have any idea where it did come from?
ddraig
kicking against the pricks...
are you oppressed?
why are people so fearful of speaking their minds then, what would actually happen to them?
SpackleFrog
Smash showy bell-bottom pants and sporty haircuts
OH FFS. The story doesn't say Farage mentioned her at all. It says he called on "senior Labour party figures" to distance themselves and she is one. What is wrong with you? Yes, butchers could stand to be a bit more polite occasionally but to be honest it's pretty rude to respond to links people post without taking the time to make sure you've understood them.
butchersapron
Bring back hanging
Hang on - i said that DL was not mentioned. I repeatedly said that. I was right in saying that. Who do i owe an apology to?
The telegraph quite clearly used her to try and associate farage with the racists who hate DL and think her kid was selling drugs and the race relations industry blah blah. That's why i posted the bloody story -as it fitted in with the ongoing debate of the tory media attempting to damage ukip. I didn't attack anyone for not grasping the point of that posting. No one.
butchersapron
Bring back hanging
Anyway, shall we move on - maybe talking about how the DL 'story' shows the barrel scraping we're now into? Maybe how that highlights the lack of connect between the media attacks and what UKIP supporters are thinking - that same lack of a common language i was talking about to taffboy yesterday?
andysays
Love and solidarity
In which part of this post, where you first brought the subject up
or this one, where you appear to assume without justification that Dogsauce thinks/suggests that Cameron wrote the Telegraph article
do you say that Doreen Lawrence was not mentioned?
The first (ambiguous) reference you make to someone not mentioning Doreen Lawrence is here
but it's not clear who you're referring to. Could be Farage, could equally be Cameron.
Here it starts to become clear that you're saying that Farage didn't mention Doreen Lawrence
but still not what your point might actually be.
So I think you owe Dogsauce an apology (though I'm sure you won't agree and won't make one), and I think you ought to acknowledge that you didn't explain explicitly what your point was in posting the link to the Telegraph which you have (belatedly) asserted is incorrect, and hadn't offered any suggestion of from who (and why) the apparent complete fabrication of Doreen Lawrence or anyone else being mentioned by Farage might have come from, until the post I'm now responding to, more than 16 hours after you first posted the link.
butchersapron
Bring back hanging
wtf are you on about. I posted two names in my post. Dogsauce replied by asking "Any reason he picked on Doreen Lawrence specifically" which i thought, given that i knew Farage didn't mention DL, meant he was referring to the last named male - i.e Cameron. I then explained why DL was being dragged into this (a full 2 minutes after my first post on this not your 16 hours rubbish). 5 minutes later dogsauce replied explaining that he meant farage. I then immediately replied by saying that Farage hadn't mentioned her. Then you jumped in.
The only people owed apologies are me and dogsauce for your ridiculous intervention. You totally fucked it up, better luck next time, but where's our apology?
The only people owed apologies are me and dogsauce for your ridiculous intervention. You totally fucked it up, better luck next time, but where's our apology?
andysays
Love and solidarity
So lets see if I've got this right.
You posted a link to an article containing something made up about what Farage said. You didn't bother to mention that it was made up, but because you knew it was, this meant that everyone else should somehow know that, and come to the same conclusion as you about why you had posted the link and what point you were seeking to make.
You then conclude that dogsauce must have been referring to Cameron (he couldn't have been referring to Farage, because you knew Farage hadn't said it) so you have a go at him for being so stupid as to mean something silly he didn't actually mean.
You still don't realise that everyone doesn't see things the same as you, have the same info in front of them as you, draw the same conclusions as you, and you regularly attack people for not seeing things from the same position as you, assuming that just because you see something one way, everyone else should too, not because you've done anything as reasonable as give people complete info, but because you expect them to guess, fill in the blanks for themselves and read your mind to know what point you're seeking to make.
Does this way of communicating work with people in the real world, or do you find there too that almost everyone else is too stupid to see things your way when you expect them to magically know/guess/have some sort of psychic link which will allow them to know what the fuck you're talking about? And do you find that this method of communicating, where you dismiss, criticise and attack people for having the effrontary of not following your line on everything, succeeds in winning many people over to your point of view?
Sometimes you really appear to be completely unable to see anything from anyone else's point of view, either intellectually or emotionally; you end up ranting at what you think people are saying or thinking, because you can't conceive that it's something other than what you assume it must be. You can, of course, simply dismiss what I'm saying but I thought you might be interested in how you can come across...
butchersapron
Bring back hanging
I didn't have a go at dogsauce at all. You fucked this up - totally. Now you're totes making it worse.
SpackleFrog
Smash showy bell-bottom pants and sporty haircuts
Totes eh? That sounds serious.
butchersapron
Bring back hanging
This is serious internet biz SF
SpackleFrog
Smash showy bell-bottom pants and sporty haircuts
This is serious internet biz SF
Shit mate, is sum1 gonna get totes pwned? #roflcopter
andysays
Love and solidarity
I'd rather have Toots than totes
Maybe if butchers took the time to listen to some music and think about what someone other than him is saying, rather than just always fire back the first instant aggressive response he comes up with, he might be a more effective poster...
Is it pronounced toits in Bristol?
Dogsauce
I’ve got Skol but I’m not a Scholar
I think it was the fact the police called round that is at issue - it's not a criminal matter, and the police admitted they had no authority to tell the person to take it down. The account of the incident sounds very strange. Others have highlighted actual threats of violence (including from a UKIP supporter) via Twitter that have not resulted in police action, so what were they doing?
The picture had been in circulation, and the guy posting it (a science blogger) had sought to clarify or back-up the claims with the added detail, so improving on what was already out there, including detailing where claims were not verified.
The picture had been in circulation, and the guy posting it (a science blogger) had sought to clarify or back-up the claims with the added detail, so improving on what was already out there, including detailing where claims were not verified.
I know about the police visit, but the claim this morning seems to be that the image has been removed from FB following legal complaints. considering three of the points have no basis at all, and several of the others are incredibly dodgy extrapolations of stuff lunatic individual members have said, this doesn't seem unreasonable to me.
I've seen people reposting it with the words no surrender this morning. Really.
Borrowing the dodgy propaganda tactics and the language of the far right. Nice one.
I've seen people reposting it with the words no surrender this morning. Really.
Borrowing the dodgy propaganda tactics and the language of the far right. Nice one.
Is legalising marital rape the policy of ukip or any of it's candidates? Erm. No. That's a lie. I think it's dangerous for political discourse to be based on who can get the most lurid lies trending on fb, frankly.
DotCommunist
So many particulars. So many questions.
its not neccesary anyway- a list of their policies as stand is bad enough. As for using 'no surrender' 
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