Transgender is it just me that is totally perplexed?

[SpookyFrank]

That article is well worth a read, thanks. But I'm not sure of the relevance of Tiger beetles to the discussion

I did not link to any articles.

 

[Sea Star]

No I'm not. I posted as much earlier. There is a huge leap from that to seeing the erosion of rigid sex roles as somehow a 'cure' for transgender people to such an extent that they will no longer desire surgery. And if you talked to some trans people occasionally, you might realise that.

and meanwhile - while they fight the fight to destroy gender (which may never happen - probably won't) trans people are expected to carry on in the boxes we've had assigned to us.

You can surely see here how it is them using ideology to control and marginalise us - not as they claim the other way round.

 

[Das Uberdog]

 

[SpookyFrank]

i don't have an explanation

Yes I know. That's why I've been having such fun with the rhetorical questions.

 

[Das Uberdog]

mumsnet have recognised the issue...
Punching Terfs | Mumsnet Discussion

 

[Jonti]

gender dysphoria is rare too - what's your point?

We were talking of the people at the demonstration. It is almost certain that everyone there had either XX or XY chromosomes.

 

[Das Uberdog]

Yes I know. That's why I've been having such fun with the rhetorical questions.

ah i see, you're some superior godlike cunt merely dallying in the affairs of mere mortals like ourselves.

well, kindly fuck off and let the serious people have a discussion then please

 

[Shechemite]

Yes I know. That's why I've been having such fun with the rhetorical questions.

And yet you've refused to answer my question. Funny that

 

[SpookyFrank]

We were talking of the people at the demonstration. It is almost certain that everyone there had either XX or XY chromosomes.

Almost certain is another way of saying 'not certain' isn't it?

 

[Das Uberdog]

how many cunts are gonna come in here defending the trans activist community widespread advocacy and now usage of physical violence against 1970s feminists before this issue is finlly going to be seen for what it is - a cultural problem right at the root of identity politics culture?

 

[SpookyFrank]

ah i see, you're some superior godlike cunt merely dallying in the affairs of mere mortals like ourselves.

well, kindly fuck off and let the serious people have a discussion then please

We can have a serious discussion when you find something to back up your theory of a dangerous cabal of trans extremists. Something besides a single reddit post.

 

[Das Uberdog]

that's a rhetorical question btw SpookyFrank, just in case you got confused. idiots like yourselves will never see it because you don't actually care

 

[Das Uberdog]

We can have a serious discussion when you find something to back up your theory of a dangerous cabal of trans extremists. Something besides a single reddit post.

that single reddit post now stands next to more than 10 other posts you've ignored

 

[Das Uberdog]

some of which are links to archives of hundreds of individual examples

 

[belboid]

Good thing no one on Urban has ever mentioned taking baseball bats to people who disagree with something.

 

[SpookyFrank]

that's a rhetorical question btw SpookyFrank, just in case you got confused. idiots like yourselves will never see it because you don't actually care

I can't see it because you refuse to show it to me. I suspect that this is because 'it' exists only in your head.

 

[Das Uberdog]

you ask for examples of widespread use of this language and advocacy of violence, it is provided, you just dismiss it

 

[Das Uberdog]

I can't see it because you refuse to show it to me. I suspect that this is because 'it' exists only in your head.

read the thread you fucking dildo

 

[Jonti]

I did not link to any articles.

Lol. My mistake. I just searched on the words heterosomal karyotypes and found this. As you were

 

[SpookyFrank]

some of which are links to archives of hundreds of individual examples

Are they all examples of internet trash talk?

 

[Jonti]

Almost certain is another way of saying 'not certain' isn't it?

Biology is messy. But you know that.

 

[Das Uberdog]

so what we can take from this Frank is that you have had absolutely zero practical experience working with the trans activist community nor with modern identity politics activists... you choose to ignore the numerous articles detailing problems with callout culture, victimization of political opponents and you refuse to join the dots between these things and actually physical assaults immediately precursed by references to this language and from these groups.

shut the fuck and let people who actually have an interest in the world engage in some meaningful conversation please, without constantly interrupting with your adolescent A-level philosophy relativism?

 

[SpookyFrank]

Lol. My mistake. I just searched on the words heterosomal karyotypes and found this. As you were

Heterosomes are your X's and Y's, autosomes are the other 44 human chromosomes. Your karyotype is which chromosomes you have. XX and XY are the most common, but XYY, XXY and X are also observed.

 

[Jonti]

aah, so now we're down from 'all' to 'substantive.' They are different things you know. And when it comes to actual human beings, it becomes rather a lot of people.

As far as I'm aware, the disorder you cite has no bearing on transactivism, or radical feminism.

 

[LDC]

specifics please - not some vague wishy washy high handed view that trans women are second class women and could be excluded at a whim if enough people at the meeting decided they want to.

Oh FFS, I never said anything about second class, nor anything that suggests these decisions are taken 'on a whim'. But nice one for both putting words in my mouth, and insinuating that people suffering from trauma might be deciding to do something 'on a whim'.

I'm going to leave this discussion as it's fucking pointless.

 

[Das Uberdog]

more examples of callout out culture on campus, persecuted by wild identity politics activists

 

[Sea Star]

so - this is the actual tone of what i see on Trans websites - if you're not cherry-picking that is.

This was posted by a trans woman - there's reams of this sort of thing being posted right now. Whoever threw the punch is not well loved by the community right now.

Do you know what you have done?

Firstly, you have hit an older woman. That isn't okay. I don't care how angry you are or how much you believe that she was some kind of oppressor, she is a woman who has been the victim of violence. You did that. The last thing the world needed was another woman who has been the victim of violence

Not only that, but every single person who has ever identified as a terf, gender critical or whatever is now going to hear about this. 4 hours before, it was just a bunch of people meeting up to be a bunch of boring idiots in a room. 4 hours later, it's going to be a footnote on every post about "violent trans activists" for years to come.

So you have made everything worse, you have made the world a little bit worse by creating another woman who has been the victim of violence, and you have given fuel to every person that hates us.

How can you make it right?

Turn yourself in to the police (if that is possible), apologise to the victim and let your face be plastered on every terf hate blog in the world. Right now the higher ups from action for trans health (as in, people that weren't even there) are having their pictures passed around terfdom sites like they are fucking pogs. Your actions have put then in danger. Do the right thing and tell them you are the one who did this and accept the consequences.

Thanks for everything, you COLLOSAL bellend,

 

[Jonti]

and meanwhile - while they fight the fight to destroy gender (which may never happen - probably won't) trans people are expected to carry on in the boxes we've had assigned to us.

You can surely see here how it is them using ideology to control and marginalise us - not as they claim the other way round.

No, the argument that the culture and society have a bearing on gender dysphoria does not rule out individual therapy.

 

[FabricLiveBaby!]

how many cunts are gonna come in here defending the trans activist community widespread advocacy and now usage of physical violence against 1970s feminists before this issue is finlly going to be seen for what it is - a cultural problem right at the root of identity politics culture?

Probably not until straight blokes are accused of transphobia for excluding female penis.

I just read "butch dyke trans woman" on this thread.

In normal speak that sounds like a gender conforming heterosexual male with the "gender identity" of female.

Lesbians with a penis?

That's an actual joke my dad used to make.

Leave that homophobia at the door.

Same sex attracted people 1) exist 2) aren't attracted to gender identities.

Lesbians don't have penises.
Gay men don't have vaginas.

Homosexuality is a sexual orientaion and protected under UK antidiscrimination laws.

This is exactly why sex needs to firmly remain a protected characteristic.

FFS.

 

[iona]

<snip>

In my view, our culture has rigid sex roles that people are fitted into willy-nilly, and this pressure can cause very real distress and lead people to seek medical assistance. Where they feel their body is wrong for them, they are said to have gender dysphoria (a neutral medical term).

All that can be offered is to medically alter the individual patient to fit better into one of the rigid sex-roles on offer. Preferable, might be a social response which allows people to be who they are in the body they were born with.

Just to clarify, what exactly do you mean when you say "sex roles" and how might your proposed "social response which allows people to be who they are in the body they were born with" work?