Transgender hate crimes recorded by police go up 81%

[spanglechick]

Most trans men I know...

Nor is it all about you.

I have been struck from the beginning, MsB, that you assume a superior intellect over people. You arrived here, not to join our community, but to educate and improve us. And while it’s been novel and broadly positive to have a focus on feminism, your own contribution has been very top-down: instructing us on what we should be discussing, telling us when we are doing it wrong, according to you.

It doesn’t seem very sisterly.

 

[8ball]

When liking tweets is considered a hate crime one has to be wary of these stats

Challenging Thought Crime: HarryTheOwl v The College of Policing

In this case, according to the article, it was not considered a crime, but was logged as a “hate incident”.

I don’t know what that means in terms of stats and their breakdown, but it might be important.

 

[ginger_syn]

The attempts at silencing someone is quite unbelievable.

Total capitulation or be damned

Get over yourselves guys


smokedout and I are managing to discuss Home Office stats even though they called me a nasty piece of work. I think others can get over me flippantly using the term penis people

ETA and I have made it clear I was not including trans women. No outrage needed

Not trying to silence you, just want to reduce the petty name calling and labelling it does everyone a disservice its tedious.
Also outrage is needed given the subject of the thread.
Why is there no banging your head agaisnt a wall emoji.

 

[Pickman's model]

Not trying to silence you, just want to reduce the petty name calling and labelling it does everyone a disservice its tedious.
Also outrage is needed given the subject of the thread.
Why is there no banging your head agaisnt a wall emoji.

 

[ginger_syn]

How would one go about recreating that useful emoji?

 

[Pickman's model]

Probably better all round not to get into a race to the bottom with that sort of language then.

A race to the bottom, very droll

 

[Pickman's model]

How would one go about recreating that useful emoji?

Search longdog smilies, scroll down, link to page 2, top of page

 

[Pickman's model]

How would one go about recreating that useful emoji?

Oh or right click smiley copy image and paste as desired

 

[Athos]

Most Gender Critical people I know make this offer numerous times, but it is just not good enough.

In places where Self ID is now enshrined in law, this happens

Discontinuation of grant to Vancouver Rape Relief shows trans activism is an attack on women

And that's completely wrong. But there is a middle ground. The city of Vancouver has enough money to continue to fund that shelter, and make provision for trans women victims of DV. Surely that'd be the ideal?

 

[purenarcotic]

Both those terms are to include trans men. It’s really important that trans men are included in cervical cancer initiatives. Talking about “people with cervixes” rather than “women” is more polite and inclusive. It doesn’t erase my womanhood if I notice that trans men are being included.

I find it grossly dehumanising. What’s wrong with saying ‘women and trans men’.

 

[Athos]

I find it grossly dehumanising. What’s wrong with saying ‘women and trans men’.

But that'd encompass trans women.

 

[purenarcotic]

But that'd encompass trans women.

Well I don’t think many trans women would be stupid enough to think having a smear test applies to them. And I’m sure we can find someone out there on the Internet who has but there’s all sorts of madness online.

 

[Athos]

Well I don’t think many trans women would be stupid enough to think having a smear test applies to them. And I’m sure we can find someone out there on the Internet who has but there’s all sorts of madness online.

Yeah, i guess. Same way cis women without crevices wouldn't. So I suppose your formulation is probably the best for that application.

 

[JudithB]

Nor is it all about you.

I have been struck from the beginning, MsB, that you assume a superior intellect over people. You arrived here, not to join our community, but to educate and improve us. And while it’s been novel and broadly positive to have a focus on feminism, your own contribution has been very top-down: instructing us on what we should be discussing, telling us when we are doing it wrong, according to you.

It doesn’t seem very sisterly.

I started a few threads. Is that too top down or is it because I refuse to be apologetic for having a brain and demanding that people treat women as human beings and not reflections of male persons.

In no way do I think I have a superior intellect but thanks for the assumption.

Even in being lead astray and admitting I am critical of gender I do not think I have told anyone how to think.

I will put this out there for the record. Anyone can think and believe what they like. However they have no right to impose beliefs on anyone else. I am here for intelligent and mostly respectful discussion. I cannot guarantee either because I cannot control what people discuss.

 

[JudithB]

You don't think working class people concerned about the possible impact of migration on wages are an oppressed class?

Says it all, you moan about identity politics but really it's all you've got.

The post specifically mentioned racists. Are you calling all working class people concerned about immigration racists?

 

[Pickman's model]

The post specifically mentioned racists. Are you calling all working class people concerned about immigration racists?

 

[JudithB]

 

[JudithB]

And that's completely wrong. But there is a middle ground. The city of Vancouver has enough money to continue to fund that shelter, and make provision for trans women victims of DV. Surely that'd be the ideal?

All other services are for women and trans women. This service wanted to be female only to help those whose trauma would be triggered by male presence. Unfortunately Morgan Oger thought differently

 

[smokedout]

I find it grossly dehumanising. What’s wrong with saying ‘women and trans men’.

Because not all women have a cervix, and it's understandable that a cancer charity might use sensitive, and precise language to avoid upsetting or confusing those who have had a cervix removed due to cancer.

 

[purenarcotic]

Because not all women have a cervix, and it's understandable that a cancer charity might use sensitive, and precise language to avoid upsetting or confusing those who have had a cervix removed due to cancer.

I would be interested to see if they asked any of their service users about this. Only because I see a lot of women who have / have had breast cancer for example fronting campaigns calling on women to check their boobs and I’ve never seen any discussion to say that they want to be defined as ‘breast owners’.

 

[SpookyFrank]

The attempts at silencing someone is quite unbelievable.

The amount of noise I hear from ostensibly silenced people is unbelievable.

 

[JudithB]

The amount of noise I hear from ostensibly silenced people is unbelievable.

Nowhere did I say they would be successful Frank

 

[smokedout]

I would be interested to see if they asked any of their service users about this. Only because I see a lot of women who have / have had breast cancer for example fronting campaigns calling on women to check their boobs and I’ve never seen any discussion to say that they want to be defined as ‘breast owners’.

I doubt they asked anyone, it was one leaflet, probably knocked up by someone pretty junior in the PR department who was struggling to fit the words into the allotted space.
People seem very eager to draw even the most trivial things into some giant trans ideological narrative but the usual explanations are often pretty mundane and prior to the internet and social media no one would have bothered scouring all the literature charities put out in the hope of finding some small detail which can be used to own the trans in twitter.

 

[ginger_syn]

A truly depressing statistic, but no surprise given the current political climate



Transgender hate crime rises by 81%

Just a reminder as to what this thread is about as it seems to have drifted

 

[purenarcotic]

I doubt they asked anyone, it was one leaflet, probably knocked up by someone pretty junior in the PR department who was struggling to fit the words into the allotted space.
People seem very eager to draw even the most trivial things into some giant trans ideological narrative but the usual explanations are often pretty mundane and prior to the internet and social media no one would have bothered scouring all the literature charities put out in the hope of finding some small detail which can be used to own the trans in twitter.

I don’t think this has anything to do with trans, I just find the term grossly dehumanising. You don’t. There we go.

I suspect that as we grapple with how to include everyone we will never find a solution that we’re all happy with because that’s an impossibility. I seriously hope we find better language than ‘cervix owner’ or ‘penis haver’ though. I appreciate it will take some trial and error to get there.

 

[Athos]

All other services are for women and trans women. This service wanted to be female only to help those whose trauma would be triggered by male presence. Unfortunately Morgan Oger thought differently

Which is utterly abhorrent.

 

[SpookyFrank]

Nowhere did I say they would be successful Frank

'They' are not actually trying. Disagreement is not silencing, nor is it oppression. It is arguably the single most important weapon against oppression.

 

[smokedout]

It's only 40 pages long mate

Pages 15 to 19 and pages 27 and 28 seemed the most relevant and I quoted from 15 and 16.

What have a I missed?

Figure 2.5

 

[JudithB]

'They' are not actually trying. Disagreement is not silencing, nor is it oppression. It is arguably the single most important weapon against oppression.

I posted something I thought was quite important and did anyone go to the link and comment on it or did they prefer to tell me off for saying penis-haver? That isn't disagreement that's obfuscation and a way to silence debate.

This thread is meant to be about the stats concerning hate crimes against trans women. I have tried to engage regarding information smokedout gave me. They might have gone out, it's Pride in London today isn't it? But my questions have not been answered by them or you or anyone else who appears to be preferring to argue semantics rather than discuss the thread topic.

I am going out now to discuss some climate action - good day for it lol - followed by a street party. I may be back later. Hopefully I will see you and smokedout another time. There is lots to unpick and discussion needs to be had.

 

[JudithB]

Figure 2.5

Thank you! Will take a look before I go out