Transgender hate crimes recorded by police go up 81%
- Thread starter editor
- Start date
InArduisFouette
Well-Known Member
you are an utter , utter clown
begone you transphobic, homophobic, misogynistic waste of skin
SpookyFrank
A cheap source of teeth for aquarium gravel
Who is it you think doesn't know that rape threats are bad, and needs this explaining to them?
Cloo
Banana for scale
Disappointing the number of media sources that have deadnamed her.
Unfortunately, largely due to poor understanding as opposed to overt transphobia IMO, a lot of people when reading/hearing about a trans person want to know 'But what was their name before?' 'I wonder what he looked like as a boy?' - and too much of the media pander to this.
I mean, Jesus, how would a parent feel if their kid was murdered and then the media just decided to used an abbreviation of their kids' name that they never used when alive and went around calling them that?
Unfortunately, largely due to poor understanding as opposed to overt transphobia IMO, a lot of people when reading/hearing about a trans person want to know 'But what was their name before?' 'I wonder what he looked like as a boy?' - and too much of the media pander to this.
I mean, Jesus, how would a parent feel if their kid was murdered and then the media just decided to used an abbreviation of their kids' name that they never used when alive and went around calling them that?
LeytonCatLady
Well-Known Member
I really hate that. I bet they wouldn't demand to know a married woman's maiden name in that manner! I'm cis but go by a shortened version of my full name and find it annoying enough when people go "Yeah, but what's that short for?" Like, you don't need to know what it's short for unless I'm filling in official paperwork. Deadnaming a trans person feels so fucking malicious. What's the point?
RIP Brianna, and I hope whatever universe you move on to treats you better.
Kid_Eternity
Quis custodiet ipsos custodes?
I disagree, they know better so it’s clearly transphobia.
Pickman's model
Starry Wisdom
You've scraped your way beneath the barrel
frogwoman
No amount of cajolery...
That curiosity is basically transphobia though, might not be conscious but it is.
Plenty of people go by their middle names or pick a name for themselves. Unless there's a very good reason why the dead name needs to be publicly known in the media then they should just call them by what they were known as and that's that.
Plenty of people go by their middle names or pick a name for themselves. Unless there's a very good reason why the dead name needs to be publicly known in the media then they should just call them by what they were known as and that's that.
Kid_Eternity
Quis custodiet ipsos custodes?
Exactly.
frogwoman
No amount of cajolery...
I disagree - lots of people change their middle names including as kids, lots of women change their surname to a different surname when married etc. When I meet someone who's married I don't wonder what their maiden name was ...
BristolEcho
Well-Known Member
*oops ignore.
dylanredefined
Not a house elf a tiger
It's pretty much an open and shut case. Loons obsessed with murder found a victim and killed them. Making it a hate crime doesn't increase the sentence.
No one needs to hear a bunch of transphobic shit it it's unnesscary shit.
Kid_Eternity
Quis custodiet ipsos custodes?
Hate crimes are against the law so clearly it being judged as one as well will increase sentencing if found guilty.
SpookyFrank
A cheap source of teeth for aquarium gravel
Probably why we have hate crime laws?
I have reservations about hate crime laws but whilst they exist they should be applied equally to all protected groups. Boy Y's dehumanising language was clearly transphobic and likely to have contributed to her being selected as a victim if that's what happened. The only other person they are alleged to have made serious plans to kill was someone they considered a paedophile. It's not much of a leap to suggest they chose their alleged victims on the basis of some kind of perceived deviance.
Less obvious, but just as important, is that Girl X's fetishy, obsessive feelings about Brianna leading to violent ideation is pretty much a classic example of how transphobic violence happens. Admittedly it's usually men who are violent to trans women because they are uncomfortable with the sexual ambiguity they present and how it makes them feel but there are absolutely cis women who fetishize trans women as well.
I might be wrong but I think the judge has the power to aggravate to a hate crime in sentencing but it doesn't look like that's something the prosecution are aiming for.
Less obvious, but just as important, is that Girl X's fetishy, obsessive feelings about Brianna leading to violent ideation is pretty much a classic example of how transphobic violence happens. Admittedly it's usually men who are violent to trans women because they are uncomfortable with the sexual ambiguity they present and how it makes them feel but there are absolutely cis women who fetishize trans women as well.
I might be wrong but I think the judge has the power to aggravate to a hate crime in sentencing but it doesn't look like that's something the prosecution are aiming for.
dylanredefined
Not a house elf a tiger
It can be read out in court and then repeated and used in attempt at mitigation/ Justification. Crime is terrible enough without need to drag the victim further into the dirt.. Or the cops cos might just have dropped the ball.
dylanredefined
Not a house elf a tiger
To what ? Their already getting life. Life with no desserts? Some crimes are so horrific there is never going to an adequate punishment. This is one . Making it a hate crime changes little. Wether they are homicidal maniacs or transphobic homicidal maniacs is only needed by any professional trying to treat them.
SpookyFrank
A cheap source of teeth for aquarium gravel
Pointing out that the victim was trans and almost certainly wouldn't be dead if she wasn't doesn't seem like 'dragging her through the dirt' to me.
Go back to the OP, recall the actual topic of the thread even though it has been forgotten so many times now. What would happen if we didn't record these crimes as being motivated by anti-trans hatred? How would we even start to try and prevent these crimes if we didn't know why they happened, or didn't even know that they happened at all?
If we don't identify hate crimes as hate crimes, we falsely break the link between hatred and violence. We let the 'non-violent' hatemongers off the hook if we forget the consequences of their ideology and rhetoric.
This is just nonsense. The fact they were transphobic would not be grounds for mitigation, it would be them admitting it was a hate crime and grounds for an aggravated sentence.
A380
How do I change this 'custom title' thing then?
You can’t have aggravated murder. Unlike (some) other offences.
If, or hopefully when, they get convicted of murder then they will get life ( or because of their ages *whatever detention at his majesty’s pleasure is called now) and the judge will factor all manner of things, including transphobia, and indeed any other hatred against any other protected characteristics that may or may not exist but haven’t made the press, into the punishment tariff, i.e. the earliest date of a parole application. This will a matter of record and can be appealed by both sides.
It does seem, just from the media reports - which are guaranteed to be shit and inaccurate, because they always are- that neither are going for a ‘not guilty murder, guilty manslaughter strategy and instead are both mounting a classic cut throat defence against the other. Good luck with that, as they say. But we will only know for sure as the trial goes on.
(* I always try to learn as little as possible about killers when I don’t need to know as I don’t want to give them any space in my head. That’s for the victims…)
If, or hopefully when, they get convicted of murder then they will get life ( or because of their ages *whatever detention at his majesty’s pleasure is called now) and the judge will factor all manner of things, including transphobia, and indeed any other hatred against any other protected characteristics that may or may not exist but haven’t made the press, into the punishment tariff, i.e. the earliest date of a parole application. This will a matter of record and can be appealed by both sides.
It does seem, just from the media reports - which are guaranteed to be shit and inaccurate, because they always are- that neither are going for a ‘not guilty murder, guilty manslaughter strategy and instead are both mounting a classic cut throat defence against the other. Good luck with that, as they say. But we will only know for sure as the trial goes on.
(* I always try to learn as little as possible about killers when I don’t need to know as I don’t want to give them any space in my head. That’s for the victims…)
InArduisFouette
Well-Known Member
1. it will impact on their tarriff ( as i doubt they will get a whole life tarriff due to their age and the fact it wa a single death )
2. it will be someothing which will be an issue at parole/ licence hearings in due course
Puddy_Tat
naturally fluffy
hmm
would you prefer that the fact that if a murder victim is black / gay / trans, and the motivation is racism / homophobia / transphobia, then both are hushed up?
not all that long ago, a victim being black or gay or trans could turn in to a mitigating factor or get a murder charge reduced to manslaughter - the assailant could claim 'i thought that black man was going to mug me' (this one still seems to work in some states of the USA) or 'i thought that gay man was going to proposition me and i panicked' (see 'gay panic defence')
i'm not a lawyer or police or anything like it, but my understanding is that while murder gets a mandatory 'life sentence', there isn't a single 'tariff' before a convicted murderer can be considered for parole, and the judge can take circumstances - mitigating or aggravating - in to account in setting this, in exceptional circumstances setting a whole life tariff.
i have slightly mixed feelings about this - it can arguably be taken as saying that lives taken are not of equal value, which i'm not entirely comfortable with, but are some murders more objectionable than others? (not that i want to turn this thread in to one arguing about sentencing...)
Jennaonthebeach
What would Picard do?
Trans panic defence is still a thing in both UK and US courts.
JimW
支那暗杀团
Isn't the reasoning because it's about the mindset of the killer - a hate-driven premeditated murder deemed more deserving of severe punishment than a moment of anger?
emanymton
A cat politely sat on the flaming gardener.
Can you give any examples of cases where it has be used successful?
A380
How do I change this 'custom title' thing then?
Is it here? Genuinely I’m not being an internet twat, I’m interested but a bit out of date; have you got any England and Wales stated cases, I’d really like to have a read and bring myself up to date.
A380
How do I change this 'custom title' thing then?
The hate crime introduction and increase in sentencing ( in England and Wales ) was driven by two things. 1. That people who victimise others based on a protected characteristic are committing crimes that are more ‘random’ i’e any person who was black, gay, female, could have been a victim so the offender is ‘more dangerous’ . 2.Trying to reflect how society (should) disapproves of people who allow their bigotry to drive their offending.
Similar threads
