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Tour de France 2022

hash tag said:
A bit of a worry is the times.
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twistedAM said:
I'm fearing the Jumbo doctor is the key team player. I'm not usually one for conspiracy theories but that was pretty alarming.
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beesonthewhatnow said:
I dunno. They’re either all at it again, or the sport is clean and (known, established) gains in training, nutrition and equipment are as beneficial as they’re said to be.

Either way, I’m happy to just watch the spectacle, it’s been the best tour for years.
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Sadly only saw the highlights. Apart from what's been mentioned already, Froome gone ( to Vuelta), the two riders being squished by motorbikes and cars.
What with the prestart raids and the times being clocked, it is a worry what's going on
www.velonews.com

Tour de France: 'No one wants to go back' to the chaos of the Festina Affair from 1998

Raids appear focused solely on Bahrain Victorious so far at Tour de France, but teams worry of impact of more police action.
www.velonews.com www.velonews.com
 
They're hammering it from the off in a way that hasn't been the case in previous years (generalising). The peloton used to take it easy for chunks of stages which just isn't happening this year. It shows by the way everyone got dropped over the last few k today.
 
Now that the stages are shorter and the top riders are younger I would be very wary of using previous years' times to point the finger. The changes are enormous. Just look at the young riders' jersey...it's redundant because the riders who are eligible for it are winning the yellow jersey. Used to be that nobody was expected to finish the race with a decent time until they had several years as a pro. The technology and money going into youth development must be very, very different. Then there's the cool down and warm down stuff, better sleep because you have your own mattress brought to the hotel.....it's almost a whole new sport.
 
twistedAM said:
Apparently that was a flat stage with one climb which skews that comparison a bit.
Anyway I think more fingers are pointing at Van Aert than Vingegaard, who has been careful with his energy conservation.
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Isn't that a bit... selective? I dunno, it strikes me that there's an element of 'the other guy' to doping criticism at the moment. Jumbo fans will point at UAE and say 'all my respect to Pog, tip of the hat etc, but McNulty is clearly at it', UAE fans 'Jonas respect, WvA is ridiculous though' etc. I think it gets a bit 4 dimensional chessy when you start speculating that specific teams have one rider they've developed a doping programme around... There are just so many factors and what ifs that would spin out from that.

I mean don't get me wrong, would be daft to write off the possibility of doping (e.g Lopez recent news). But I'd echo others who've said they're either all at it or not.
 
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Cid said:
Isn't that a bit... selective? I dunno, it strikes me that there's an element of 'the other guy' to doping criticism at the moment. Jumbo fans will point at UAE and say 'all my respect to Pog, tip of the hat etc, but McNulty is clearly at it', UAE fans 'Jonas respect, WvA is ridiculous though' etc. I think it gets a bit 4 dimensional chessy when you start speculating that specific teams have one rider they've developed a doping programme around... There are just so many factors and what ifs that would spin out from that.

I mean don't get me wrong, would be daft to write off the possibility of doping (e.g Lopez recent news). But I'd echo others who've said they're either all at it or not.
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McNulty is a climber/GC prospect who did one big day and then was knackered yesterday
Then there's Van Aert. There's great pros who try to get in the break each day but can't manage it as it's so hard to do but yet he does it nearly every day, then sprints for the intermediates. gets KOM points, sets the pace downhill and in valleys and then climbs to third place on the queen stage. Either a heap of people are riding crap bikes, wearing the wrong clothes, eating the wrong stuff or he is just something else.
 
twistedAM said:
McNulty is a climber/GC prospect who did one big day and then was knackered yesterday
Then there's Van Aert. There's great pros who try to get in the break each day but can't manage it as it's so hard to do but yet he does it nearly every day, then sprints for the intermediates. gets KOM points, sets the pace downhill and in valleys and then climbs to third place on the queen stage. Either a heap of people are riding crap bikes, wearing the wrong clothes, eating the wrong stuff or he is just something else.
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I'm not particularly talking about the specifics of their performances, more about how the accusations seem to be thrown about on twitter etc. WvA has put on some batshit performances this tour, undeniable. I've missed too many of the flat/hilly stages to have a proper grasp of the details. But where does that get you? that Jumbo - a team that started out with two of the best GC prospects and an exceptional support roster - decided to develop a doping programme specifically based on WvA doing massive work on stages that were unlikely to affect GC contention? Risk it all for the... green jersey? knowing of course that he's one of the most attention-grabbing riders anyway, and likely to be heavily tested (stage wins). As it panned out his work on climbs has undoubtedly been important... the question is whether that was predictable.

e2a: and the dangers to GC of pushing on flat/hilly - stage 15 JV crash, lose Kruijswijk for example.

e2aa: And Brandon's big day (which is either a children's book or porn) was exceptional - man pulled 6.58w/kg for 22 minutes, then 6.2 for nearly 23.
 
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Oh, a flying man.

(guy on one of those waterjet contraptions, a flyboard google tells me)
 
Cid said:
I'm not particularly talking about the specifics of their performances, more about how the accusations seem to be thrown about on twitter etc. WvA has put on some batshit performances this tour, undeniable. I've missed too many of the flat/hilly stages to have a proper grasp of the details. But where does that get you? that Jumbo - a team that started out with two of the best GC prospects and an exceptional support roster - decided to develop a doping programme specifically based on WvA doing massive work on stages that were unlikely to affect GC contention? Risk it all for the... green jersey? knowing of course that he's one of the most attention-grabbing riders anyway, and likely to be heavily tested (stage wins). As it panned out his work on climbs has undoubtedly been important... the question is whether that was predictable.

e2a: and the dangers to GC of pushing on flat/hilly - stage 15 JV crash, lose Kruijswijk for example.

e2aa: And Brandon's big day (which is either a children's book or porn) was exceptional - man pulled 6.58w/kg for 22 minutes, then 6.2 for nearly 23.
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Accusations have been thrown around precisely because his performances every day for three weeks have been batshit crazy whether that's team work or ego work. Quite happy for this to go on as long as he doesn't win any of the three big races (RVV, P-R, WCRR) that are his main targets.
 
twistedAM said:
McNulty is a climber/GC prospect who did one big day and then was knackered yesterday
Then there's Van Aert. There's great pros who try to get in the break each day but can't manage it as it's so hard to do but yet he does it nearly every day, then sprints for the intermediates. gets KOM points, sets the pace downhill and in valleys and then climbs to third place on the queen stage. Either a heap of people are riding crap bikes, wearing the wrong clothes, eating the wrong stuff or he is just something else.
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There is always the chance WvA is a once in a generation biological freak, and really is just that good.
 
I have to say the race has been more interesting this year than I was expecting. I thought pog woukd walk it but been pleased to see he's had some competition. it's certainly exposed the weakness and depth in quality of the uae team. I wonder whether that will result in any interesting transfer action.
 
Fuzzy said:
I have to say the race has been more interesting this year than I was expecting. I thought pog woukd walk it but been pleased to see he's had some competition. it's certainly exposed the weakness and depth in quality of the uae team. I wonder whether that will result in any interesting transfer action.
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That’s going to be hard as not that many star riders are out of contract this season and cycling doesn’t really have big money transfers like football.
UAE already have Almeida but he has his own GC ambitions and a degree of ego while Ayuso hasn’t yet shown as much potential as UAE might have hoped.
Meanwhile Ineos, Quickstep and Bora are all looking for more GC power and the Jumbos have already strengthened with Kelderman next season.
 
Everyone knew this tour wasn’t one for the sprinters, in hindsight should Cav have been picked, as if he’d managed just one stage win that would have been massive?
 
Watched the highlights late last night. Shame for that fella getting caught so close to the finish but thrilling stuff. I love the aerial shots of the peloton flowing through the streets.
 
1927 said:
Everyone knew this tour wasn’t one for the sprinters, in hindsight should Cav have been picked, as if he’d managed just one stage win that would have been massive?
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I would love for Cav to get one more stage win but this really wouldn't have been his race. It must be team first, not rider or sentiment.
 
twistedAM said:
That’s going to be hard as not that many star riders are out of contract this season and cycling doesn’t really have big money transfers like football.
UAE already have Almeida but he has his own GC ambitions and a degree of ego while Ayuso hasn’t yet shown as much potential as UAE might have hoped.
Meanwhile Ineos, Quickstep and Bora are all looking for more GC power and the Jumbos have already strengthened with Kelderman next season.
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Pog is signed up with UAE until 2027 or something isn't he? Wondering how he feels about that at the moment... Cynic in me says 'I suppose the rumoured £5m/year helps', but I dunno... A Jonas-Pog rivalry is I think what we all (including Pog, he almost seems to have enjoyed losing at times) need. Hope UAE can sort themselves out enough to effectively deliver that. Of course who knows what form anyone will be in next year, but have greatly enjoyed this edition.
 
Some of the footage when the TV is following the riders today was exceptional - you almost forget how fast they are going.
 
Assuming G doesn’t test positive for Covid tomorrow is there any rider who has won Le tour, and gone on to finish 2nd and 3rd
 
Probably a stupid question. I know tomorrow is usually a procession and for the sprinters but what would happen if Pog or GT or anyone were just seconds or less than a minute behind, would it be game on?
 
Numbers said:
Probably a stupid question. I know tomorrow is usually a procession and for the sprinters but what would happen if Pog or GT or anyone were just seconds or less than a minute behind, would it be game on?
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Very doubtful, because stage 21 is almost always for the sprinters. Their teams would reign in any breakaway, as would JV if a GC contender tried something. In my thirty years of watching the TdF I can only remember once someone getting away to win - Vinokourov in 2005.

That said, the sprint trains have been fairly poor on those few days where it has been a bunch finish. I imagine Lotto will be particularly targeting tomorrow, as Ewan barely contested any stage finishes.
 
You mean like in 1989 when LeMond Went in to the last day a few seconds behind Fignon and went on to win by a few seconds?
I would hope it would turn into a battle.
 
Numbers said:
Probably a stupid question. I know tomorrow is usually a procession and for the sprinters but what would happen if Pog or GT or anyone were just seconds or less than a minute behind, would it be game on?
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The nature of the stage would make it almost impossible. Any break that threatened anything would just be pulled back.
 
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