the sir jimmy savile obe thread

[Pickman's model]

indeed - can we be sure Saville didn't have one too

not a million miles from turquoise

 

[Pickman's model]

not a million miles from turquoise

 

[Favelado]

Looking at those photos, it's amazing that he turned out to be a paedophile really.

 

[Pickman's model]

Looking at those photos, it's amazing that he turned out to be a paedophile really.

looking at those photos it's amazing he wasn't sussed fucking fifty years ago.

 

[taffboy gwyrdd]

Self evident as it is that certain forums and groups are instinctive loons/fantasists etc.
it is also obvious that there has been an instinctive denialism in society about many things.

Consider the following notions:

- International banking practice is systemically criminal and fraudulent, the biggest threat to the global economy and routinely used for laundering the proceeds of massive crime with no care for it's source

- There are strong patterns of child abuse and cover-up in The Roman Catholic church

- Ditto: The media.

- The police routinely lie to the press.

- The Bilderberg Group exists.

10 or so years ago, to advance any of these would have probably incurred a major degree of flaming and comparison to the likes of Icke.

Some people who really should know better have played the role of establishment dupes with the familiar air of the know-all/smartarse. They really ought to be putting a large portion of humble pie in the oven right now.

I didn't think JS was a paedo by the way, I am not one of the "I told you so" gang. It's probably not helpful to discuss individuals anyway.

And all this doesn't mean to say any, or even most of "conspiracist" purports are true.

It does mean people might be slower to resort to reactionary knee-jerk scoffing at the notion that <shudder> some bad and weird things are going on out there.

Instinctive anti-conspiracism is as bad and dangerous as instinctive conspiracism.

Judge each case by it's merits, not by lazy stereotypes and the assumption that one knows every thing going on among the 7,000,000,000 people on this ball of rock.

 

[Favelado]

looking at those photos it's amazing he wasn't sussed fucking fifty years ago.

Er yes, that's what I meant.

 

[Pickman's model]

Er yes, that's what I meant.

could you say what you mean next time?

 

[Pickman's model]

not a million miles from turquoise

it looks like he's got some sort of yellow dildo in his hand, with the business end hidden

 

[Favelado]

could you say what you mean next time?

I reserve the right to be sarcastic without using emoticons for the hard-of-thinking.

 

[Pickman's model]

I reserve the right to be sarcastic without using emoticons for the hard-of-thinking.

maybe so: but carry on posting the way you are and you won't look sarcastick. rather, the well-founded impression that you're rather daft will pervade the boards.

 

[Favelado]

maybe so: but carry on posting the way you are and you won't look sarcastick. rather, the well-founded impression that you're rather daft will pervade the boards.

GR8 POST M8

 

[Pickman's model]

GR8 POST M8

a simple 'like' will do in future

 

[frogwoman]

Self evident as it is that certain forums and groups are instinctive loons/fantasists etc.
it is also obvious that there has been an instinctive denialism in society about many things.

Consider the following notions:

- International banking practice is systemically criminal and fraudulent, the biggest threat to the global economy and routinely used for laundering the proceeds of massive crime with no care for it's source

- There are strong patterns of child abuse and cover-up in The Roman Catholic church

- Ditto: The media.

- The police routinely lie to the press.

- The Bilderberg Group exists.

10 or so years ago, to advance any of these would have probably incurred a major degree of flaming and comparison to the likes of Icke.

Some people who really should know better have played the role of establishment dupes with the familiar air of the know-all/smartarse. They really ought to be putting a large portion of humble pie in the oven right now.

I didn't think JS was a paedo by the way, I am not one of the "I told you so" gang. It's probably not helpful to discuss individuals anyway.

And all this doesn't mean to say any, or even most of "conspiracist" purports are true.

It does mean people might be slower to resort to reactionary knee-jerk scoffing at the notion that <shudder> some bad and weird things are going on out there.

Instinctive anti-conspiracism is as bad and dangerous as instinctive conspiracism.

Judge each case by it's merits, not by lazy stereotypes and the assumption that one knows every thing going on among the 7,000,000,000 people on this ball of rock.

it was the "international bankers'" fault again was it. jesus. just because those rumours appeared on icke's website it doesn't automatically validate everything else he says.

the fact that there was a coverup to protect a rich celebrity doesn't mean that there was a coverup of a banking conspiracy or that any of this shit is real.

 

[Louis MacNeice]

Self evident as it is that certain forums and groups are instinctive loons/fantasists etc...

The people who were most right about Savile are those who actually complained about him and were ignored or worse. But that doesn't mean I'm going to go to them for the truth about 'international banking' or 'big pharma'; and the same goes for the self-seeking anti-semite Icke, times a million.

Your transparent attempt, along with Jazz, to gain credibility for such posionous conspiracy theory rubbish on the back Savile's abuses and rapes is pretty fucking low.

Louis MacNeice

 

[ViolentPanda]

Self evident as it is that certain forums and groups are instinctive loons/fantasists etc.
it is also obvious that there has been an instinctive denialism in society about many things.

Consider the following notions:

- International banking practice is systemically criminal and fraudulent, the biggest threat to the global economy and routinely used for laundering the proceeds of massive crime with no care for it's source

- There are strong patterns of child abuse and cover-up in The Roman Catholic church

- Ditto: The media.

- The police routinely lie to the press.

- The Bilderberg Group exists.

10 or so years ago, to advance any of these would have probably incurred a major degree of flaming and comparison to the likes of Icke.

Some people who really should know better have played the role of establishment dupes with the familiar air of the know-all/smartarse. They really ought to be putting a large portion of humble pie in the oven right now.

I didn't think JS was a paedo by the way, I am not one of the "I told you so" gang. It's probably not helpful to discuss individuals anyway.

And all this doesn't mean to say any, or even most of "conspiracist" purports are true.

It does mean people might be slower to resort to reactionary knee-jerk scoffing at the notion that <shudder> some bad and weird things are going on out there.

Instinctive anti-conspiracism is as bad and dangerous as instinctive conspiracism.

Judge each case by it's merits, not by lazy stereotypes and the assumption that one knows every thing going on among the 7,000,000,000 people on this ball of rock.

It's the Jooooozzzzz!!!!!

 

[frogwoman]

saville's paedophilia was predicted in the Protocols.

never mind that large closed institutions such as the bbc the police and the vatican where it's leading members are held in high regard tend to cover each others backs and find no shortage of people willing to cover for them because "they'd never do that sort of thing" and they do so much for charity/the nation/god etc

plenty of people disbelieved accusations of saville's abuse on these boards ffs. no conspiracy needed.

 

[laptop]

None of this will get through.

A pretty good working definition of a conspiranoid is someone who cannot understand that things that are true by accident don't count as knowledge.

 

[taffboy gwyrdd]

It's the Jooooozzzzz!!!!!

What an erudite response. Very well informed as well.

People who said child abuse was covered up in the RC church hate the jews. Everyone knows that.

 

[frogwoman]

What an erudite response. Very well informed as well.

People who said child abuse was covered up in the RC church hate the jews. Everyone knows that.

it's sick to use jimmy saville's crimes to promote your protocols esque idea of a "banking conspiracy". how utterly predictable that icke and his minions would use this coverup of a predatory paedophile to go "look, this proves what we were saying all along!"what kind of sick mind links jimmy saville to "international bankers" and the "bilderberg group"? really?

 

[taffboy gwyrdd]

None of this will get through.

A pretty good working definition of a conspiranoid is someone who cannot understand that things that are true by accident don't count as knowledge.

There's something in that, though a conspiranoid can be right, even if by accident.

Conspiranoids said we were lied to about the Iraq war. They were right, and it wasn't an accident.

Lots of non conspiranoids said the same thing and turned out to be right as well.

Whether or not an individual instance is accident or in some form intentional is a very good question.

In many cases it can't be established at all. In such cases some have a prejudice for the former and some for the latter, the word "prejudice" might say enough. Others may look for a basis to put an "x" somewhere on the spectrum of possibilities, or keep an open mind.

Others seek to place labels on things, indulging in cod psychology and inferring that anyone who questions the establishment is anti semitic without basis, derailing discussion (possibly deliberately), insulting intelligence, hindering knowledge and puffing out their chest with fatuous ignorance about how funny and worldy wise they are with their out-dated obfuscationist cliches.

 

[frogwoman]

What an erudite response. Very well informed as well.

People who said child abuse was covered up in the RC church hate the jews. Everyone knows that.

there were people high up in the vatican who said that the fact that the coverup was revealed was because of a conspiracy about the jews.

 

[frogwoman]

There's something in that, though a conspiranoid can be right, even if by accident.

Conspiranoids said we were lied to about the Iraq war. They were right, and it wasn't an accident.

Lots of non conspiranoids said the same thing and turned out to be right as well.

Whether or not an individual instance is accident or in some form intentional is a very good question.

In many cases it can't be established at all. In such cases some have a prejudice for the former and some for the latter, the word "prejudice" might say enough. Others may look for a basis to put an "x" somewhere on the spectrum of possibilities, or keep an open mind.

Others seek to place labels on things, indulging in cod psychology and inferring that anyone who questions the establishment is anti semitic without basis, derailing discussion (possibly deliberately), insulting intelligence, hindering knowledge and puffing out their chest with fatuous ignorance about how funny and worldy wise they are with their out-dated obfuscationist cliches.

Maybe it's because some people think it's downright disgusting to use saville's crime to promote your hero's anti-semitism. "Saville's paedophilia is being covered up - the banking conspiracy is also being covered up!"

The sad thing is that people like you jumping on the bandwagon of child abuse being covered up will make it less likely that scum like saville are brought to justice. as for questioning the establishment, i am sure that saville is just the tip of a very large iceberg and there are more revelations to come. that doesn't mean that it should be be used as propaganda by you.

 

[Pickman's model]

There's something in that, though a conspiranoid can be right, even if by accident.

A stopped clock is right twice a day.

a conspiranoid is right - on your evidence - just once in ten years.

 

[DotCommunist]

he was just repeating the rumours as fact. The rumours anybody with a passing interest in the strange mr savile knew.

 

[taffboy gwyrdd]

Maybe it's because some people think it's downright disgusting to use saville's crime to promote your hero's anti-semitism. "Saville's paedophilia is being covered up - the banking conspiracy is also being covered up!"

The sad thing is that people like you jumping on the bandwagon of child abuse being covered up will make it less likely that scum like saville are brought to justice. as for questioning the establishment, i am sure that saville is just the tip of a very large iceberg and there are more revelations to come. that doesn't mean that it should be be used as propaganda by you.

1) Icke is no hero of mine.

2) If a group of people say "A, B and C" are true" and are derided for decades in saying so, then it turns out that A and B are true, it is not sick or disgusting to wonder if C is true as well.

It's fine to disagree, but the amount of sanctimony you are employing is absurd.

I am not using anything as propaganda, the charge that you are using this conversation as propaganda would probably stand up as well or badly, but I won't bother to make it.

I am just disturbed that so many things talked about for so long turned out to be true. I didn't generally believe them at the time, but neither did I tend to attribute cod psychology and "disgusting" motivations to the proponents.

Please do cite where I said Icke was a hero though, because I wouldn't want to get into my head that you were a constructor of strawmen.

 

[Pickman's model]

I didn't think JS was a paedo by the way, I am not one of the "I told you so" gang. It's probably not helpful to discuss individuals anyway.

In the light of this, what the bloody fuck are you doing on a thread discussing an individual?

 

[taffboy gwyrdd]

he was just repeating the rumours as fact. The rumours anybody with a passing interest in the strange mr savile knew.

So were quite a lot of people in different fashion it turns out.

Were they all disgusting Jew haters with a nefarious propaganda agenda?

I think we should be told.

 

[Pickman's model]

So were quite a lot of people in different fashion it turns out.

Were they all disgusting Jew haters with a nefarious propaganda agenda?

I think we should be told.

You're taking the royal wee

 

[taffboy gwyrdd]

In the light of this, what the bloody fuck are you doing on a thread discussing an individual?

Because the circs surrounding this individual echo patterns around other phenomena and perceptions, as I have said.

Hope this helps.

Sorry, to translate: I fucking hope this bloody helps.

 

[taffboy gwyrdd]

there were people high up in the vatican who said that the fact that the coverup was revealed was because of a conspiracy about the jews.

Blimey. It's always a hall of mirrors this stuff.