The DUP, eh? Welcome to your new lizard overlords

[ddraig]

I was not serious FFS. No wonder the left get nowhere, no sense of humour or the ridiculous.

how is any of this in any way funny?
last refuge of the scoundrel "only joking", "where's your sense of humour love" ffs

 

[Sasaferrato]

This guy was working for you lot in south Armagh....army intelligence and special branch .. and further afield . Without doubt the most prolific killer during the conflict .

Robin Jackson - Wikipedia

This guy served in Crossmaglen barracks, as did quite a few others he names . This is what was really going on down there .

Document:John Weir Affidavit - Wikispooks


As did this guy, a former DUP activist

Billy McCaughey - Wikipedia

The British forces weren't there to stop people killing each other . Far from it . That was a lie for the gullible.

It wasn't quite as simple as that.

Was it you that recommended Ann Cadwallader's book, which I bought and read? It was shocking, genuinely shocking. I have no doubt that the heirachy were aware of what was going on, but the ordinary soldier was not, not at the time.

I see the conflict from one side, you from the other. All we wanted to do was survive, and get home, never to see the place again. The thought that the people of NI couldn't easily move away didn't occur to us. In retrospect, it must have been utter hell.

Hindsight is wonderful; at the time it was simple and clear, we were there to keep the peace. Now, especially after reading that book, I feel absolutely ashamed of the actions of Britain at that time. They were deplorable.

 

[Sasaferrato]

how is any of this in any way funny?
last refuge of the scoundrel "only joking", "where's your sense of humour love" ffs

Yawn. Get over yourself.

 

[LiamO]

Was it you that recommended Ann Cadwallader's book, which I bought and read?

No. That was me.

Was it you that recommended Ann Cadwallader's book, which I bought and read? It was shocking, genuinely shocking. I have no doubt that the heirachy were aware of what was going on, but the ordinary soldier was not, not at the time.

...
Hindsight is wonderful; at the time it was simple and clear, we were there to keep the peace. Now, especially after reading that book, I feel absolutely ashamed of the actions of Britain at that time. They were deplorable.

But even after all that you are still capable of coming out with the drivel of two days ago, which you compounded yesterday. You have had 40-odd years to come to a more mature/nuanced/informed view, but you have chosen not to. What exactly are you so afraid of that you continue to cling desperately to the simplistic ediface constructed for you by your 'betters' all those years ago?

And you could have avoided all this bitterness by adding "The way we/us squaddies felt at that time" to your statement about airstrikes. But you chose not to. In fact you continually choose not to. The question to ask yourself is "Why"?

 

[Poi E]

On The Belfast Telegraph Move on free NHS abortions for Northern Ireland women is hailed and criticised in equal measure
Steady, the DUP are still counting the money they got from the Godless English.

Maybe the prod churches should try their luck with the Vatican, which shares their views on this matter.

 

[xenon]

Airstrikes. LOL.

Yep. One of the classics that one.

 

[19force8]

Maybe the prod churches should try their luck with the Vatican, which shares their views on this matter.

Yeah, but that whole transubstantiation thing...

On the other hand how much can you get for a decent indulgence these days?

 

[Poi E]

Yeah, but that whole transubstantiation thing...

Had to look that one up! Bells, smells, spells and hell sell, huh?

 

[Sasaferrato]

No. That was me.



But even after all that you are still capable of coming out with the drivel of two days ago, which you compounded yesterday. You have had 40-odd years to come to a more mature/nuanced/informed view, but you have chosen not to. What exactly are you so afraid of that you continue to cling desperately to the simplistic ediface constructed for you by your 'betters' all those years ago?

And you could have avoided all this bitterness by adding "The way we/us squaddies felt at that time" to your statement about airstrikes. But you chose not to. In fact you continually choose not to. The question to ask yourself is "Why"?

What you don't seem to grasp, quite probably because I have failed to articulate properly, is the difference between the experience/objective of the ordinary soldier, and the objectives of the British government. They were not the same.

With regard to government policy, I am deeply ashamed that the country I'm part of behaved in such a mendacious and despicable manner. I can assure you that neither myself, or my colleagues, knew what was happening. It is only as the truth slowly emerged that we realised... well, that we had been duped basically. Had been used in a way entirely contrary to what we had been told. Remember also, we led a very enclosed life. I didn't leave barracks when off duty, I had a wife and child and was not heading into any unnecessary danger.

As an ordinary soldier, I was in a situation where people were actively trying to kill me. It wasn't a game, it was a situation where a wrong move could mean your death, or the death of a colleague. The people of NI suffered, but so did we. (from now on, 'we' means the ordinary squaddie.). One of the most prominent and respected posters on these boards was blown up in NI, and has suffered ill health ever since. I'm not going to name him without his consent. As a medic, I diodn't have to do street patrol, but it was made clear that it was expected, because it rested someone else. A lot of people were wound very tight, having been shot at, and having seen their colleagues killed in various ways. I lost a friend at Warrenpoint, we had joined the army on the same day, he was Para, I was RAMC.

I patched up innumerable people who had been hit by shrapnel, hit with bottles, stones etc. We really did not consider the bigger picture, we counted down the days until we could get to fuck out of there. My experience has left me with an abiding hatred of NI terrorists of all flavours. I do regard them as scum, and that will never change. It didn't matter to us which side they were on, they were trying to kill us.

It is very easy forty years later to point out how wrong it all was. Back then, information such as Ann Cawallader's book was not available. We had to rely on the information supplied, with no way of knowing, or checking its veracity.

My remark about airstrikes on XMG, I cannot help but feel there is a deal of faux outrage going here, it was perhaps in poor taste, but anyone taking it literally is more than a tad deluded.

 

[Idris2002]

Spoiler

 

[YouSir]

What you don't seem to grasp, quite probably because I have failed to articulate properly, is the difference between the experience/objective of the ordinary soldier, and the objectives of the British government. They were not the same.

With regard to government policy, I am deeply ashamed that the country I'm part of behaved in such a mendacious and despicable manner. I can assure you that neither myself, or my colleagues, knew what was happening. It is only as the truth slowly emerged that we realised... well, that we had been duped basically. Had been used in a way entirely contrary to what we had been told. Remember also, we led a very enclosed life. I didn't leave barracks when off duty, I had a wife and child and was not heading into any unnecessary danger.

As an ordinary soldier, I was in a situation where people were actively trying to kill me. It wasn't a game, it was a situation where a wrong move could mean your death, or the death of a colleague. The people of NI suffered, but so did we. (from now on, 'we' means the ordinary squaddie.). One of the most prominent and respected posters on these boards was blown up in NI, and has suffered ill health ever since. I'm not going to name him without his consent. As a medic, I diodn't have to do street patrol, but it was made clear that it was expected, because it rested someone else. A lot of people were wound very tight, having been shot at, and having seen their colleagues killed in various ways. I lost a friend at Warrenpoint, we had joined the army on the same day, he was Para, I was RAMC.

I patched up innumerable people who had been hit by shrapnel, hit with bottles, stones etc. We really did not consider the bigger picture, we counted down the days until we could get to fuck out of there. My experience has left me with an abiding hatred of NI terrorists of all flavours. I do regard them as scum, and that will never change. It didn't matter to us which side they were on, they were trying to kill us.

It is very easy forty years later to point out how wrong it all was. Back then, information such as Ann Cawallader's book was not available. We had to rely on the information supplied, with no way of knowing, or checking its veracity.

My remark about airstrikes on XMG, I cannot help but feel there is a deal of faux outrage going here, it was perhaps in poor taste, but anyone taking it literally is more than a tad deluded.

Fair few people at the time were point out that it was wrong, no?

 

[chilango]

My remark about airstrikes on XMG, I cannot help but feel there is a deal of faux outrage going here, it was perhaps in poor taste, but anyone taking it literally is more than a tad deluded.

Airstrikes on XMG would have been welcome.

XMG was inhabited by murdering fucking scum. At times so hot, we could only go in and out by helicopter. So, roll your pictures into a tight cylinder and stick them up your arse.

I was not serious FFS. No wonder the left get nowhere, no sense of humour or the ridiculous.

Read it back.

Are you standing by your comments or not?

 

[CrabbedOne]

Maybe the prod churches should try their luck with the Vatican, which shares their views on this matter.

That would be an ecumenical matter.

Being pro-life is already pretty much of a consensus with Churchy folk in N.Ireland. The big parties are mostly that way as well with SF flirting with being a tiny bit more progressive recently in line with sentiment down South causing howls of outrage from some supporters. I heard the DUP aping 60s Evangelicals in the US was recently doing some outreach to conservative RCs over this but folk are so doggedly sectarian in N.I. success seems unlikely.

 

[Casually Red]

What you don't seem to grasp, quite probably because I have failed to articulate properly, is the difference between the experience/objective of the ordinary soldier, and the objectives of the British government. They were not the same.

With regard to government policy, I am deeply ashamed that the country I'm part of behaved in such a mendacious and despicable manner. I can assure you that neither myself, or my colleagues, knew what was happening. It is only as the truth slowly emerged that we realised... well, that we had been duped basically. Had been used in a way entirely contrary to what we had been told. Remember also, we led a very enclosed life. I didn't leave barracks when off duty, I had a wife and child and was not heading into any unnecessary danger.

As an ordinary soldier, I was in a situation where people were actively trying to kill me. It wasn't a game, it was a situation where a wrong move could mean your death, or the death of a colleague. The people of NI suffered, but so did we. (from now on, 'we' means the ordinary squaddie.). One of the most prominent and respected posters on these boards was blown up in NI, and has suffered ill health ever since. I'm not going to name him without his consent. As a medic, I diodn't have to do street patrol, but it was made clear that it was expected, because it rested someone else. A lot of people were wound very tight, having been shot at, and having seen their colleagues killed in various ways. I lost a friend at Warrenpoint, we had joined the army on the same day, he was Para, I was RAMC.

I patched up innumerable people who had been hit by shrapnel, hit with bottles, stones etc. We really did not consider the bigger picture, we counted down the days until we could get to fuck out of there. My experience has left me with an abiding hatred of NI terrorists of all flavours. I do regard them as scum, and that will never change. It didn't matter to us which side they were on, they were trying to kill us.

It is very easy forty years later to point out how wrong it all was. Back then, information such as Ann Cawallader's book was not available. We had to rely on the information supplied, with no way of knowing, or checking its veracity.

My remark about airstrikes on XMG, I cannot help but feel there is a deal of faux outrage going here, it was perhaps in poor taste, but anyone taking it literally is more than a tad deluded.

I forgive you . Pax vobiscum .

 

[ddraig]

Yawn. Get over yourself.

you stupid stupid idiot buffoon
what is any way amusing about it?

 

[LiamO]

 

[YouSir]

you stupid stupid idiot buffoon
what is any way amusing about it?

He's a nasty old bastard, always has been, just a thin veneer of jokiness over the top.

 

[DexterTCN]

He's a nasty old bastard, always has been, just a thin veneer of jokiness over the top.

right...that's half of urban.

 

[William of Walworth]

Within the Pale surely ...

Apologies all for being crap with that earlier post of mine. I should have checked. I had forgotten how narrow an area geographically the Pale was. Had misremembered it as including Prods but excluding Catholics more generally

 

[CrabbedOne]

Apologies all for being crap with that earlier post of mine. I should have checked. I had forgotten how narrow an area geographically the Pale was. Had misremembered it as including Prods but excluding Catholics more generally

The most English part of Ireland but always mostly Catholic I think. A lot of Anglicans settled in North Armagh in the 17th century as well. My mother's family originating from Yorkshire for example. The core DUP base tends to look more to a Scottish heritage and the dissenting tradition.

 

[CrabbedOne]

In The Daily Telegraph Ministers hold secret talks with DUP MPs about compensation for victims of Libyan-supplied IRA bombs

...
"The reason this matter is not explicitly mentioned in the Agreement between the DUP and the Government is because we have not yet reached an agreed position or established legal basis for accessing Libyan assets, given that these are the subject of international sanctions and covered by international law.”

In the letter seen by the Belfast Telegraph, he added: “We remain committed to supporting the wider campaign by innocent victims to secure recompense and reparation from Libya and will seek to use our influence to secure a positive outcome.”

Matthew Jury, a lawyer for the victims, said: "The DUP has assured us that the issue of compensation for the variety of victims of Libyan sponsored IRA terrorism throughout the UK is very much on the agenda for the Government/DUP Coordination Committee, and that discussions on how to achieve a resolution with Libya will now be taken forward at a ministerial level.

“This is a promising development which we hope will mean that, after decades of being ignored by successive governments, justice may finally be done.”

Magic money trees springing up everywhere.

 

[Casually Red]

This is interesting

Brexit minister linked to group that used loophole to channel £435,000 to DUP

 

[CrabbedOne]

On RTE Did Arlene Foster sell out on Brexit?

...
Useful though the cash will be, it is surprising to see how little consideration is given to addressing the impact of Brexit. The only exception is agriculture.

The deal says: "The parties agree to continue to commit the same cash total in funds for farm support until the end of the Parliament. Further discussions will take place on the future framework for farming support."

This is critical. At present a significant slice of farm incomes in the North comes from aid, direct payments, grants for improving the environment, training and technical assistance. All of this money originates with Europe.

The implication is that after the UK leaves the EU, Northern farmers can rely on those payments until the next election – with no guarantees beyond that date.

The DUP secured investment for roads, health and broadband. There is nothing wrong with that.

Indeed, it will be put to good use.

But the North could be facing an economic challenge from Brexit, which would dwarf the funding secured in the Supply and Confidence arrangement.
...

Interesting point as N.I. may be quite badly fucked over by the Hard Brexit the DUP are supporting. Particularly rural communities that are a big part of the DUP's core base and hinge around farming. These are also liable to be screwed by post-Brexit Free Trade Agreements. On the other hand jam tomorrow is an unreliable commodity.

 

[Casually Red]

 

[LiamO]

part one

 

[LiamO]

part two

 

[LiamO]

The gift that keeps on giving ...



Who knew Mr Bean was in the DUP?

 

[DotCommunist]

 

[dessiato]

Apparently there was an orangeman parade in, of all places, Prestonpans.

 

[Sue]

Battle of Prestonpans - Wikipedia