The Brexit Party
- Thread starter brogdale
- Start date
seventh bullet
sovietwave
To be fair to treelover in particular, anecdotally being from a poor background as well as being working class (still am!), the moralising scrutiny, even from those in the working class, on the spending of money by poor people (especially unemployed) no matter the context or particular circumstance, is a 'thing,' and way before the existence and popular use of various online social media platforms. Those pressures were real for me alright.
brogdale
Coming to terms with late onset Anarchism
Yep, 'moralising' judgemental types will always be there but, as killer b has said, the video and it's clear messaging was not really targeted at arseholes like that. And...speaking personally, I was annoyed that treelover was derailing a discussion about a (for once) useful message on the basis of the most trivial 'criticism' from online wankers.
seventh bullet
sovietwave
I don't think that was what treelover was suggesting. He's been unfairly piled on imo. Unfortunately the working class, poor, doing okay or doing very nicely thank you, is not ideologically sound.
seventh bullet
sovietwave
I don't think killer b understands the working class, or rather the experience of the most struggling strata within it, if he thinks the stuff mentioned is just clueless wankers being irrelevant online. These wankers were at my school, in my neighborhood, my friends' parents houses in the nicer parts of town and at work when I left school. No mobile phones or twatter accounts. It definitely marks you. You internalise shit, those doing the moralising also internalise the shit from above. I don't believe he's ever felt the shame of poverty.
8ball
Decolonise colons!
... and then get togged up for a big Friday night out and blow a wedge on booze etc.
That's perfectly normal, but were you lying awake until 3am worried about how you'd pay the bills?
ska invita
back on the other side
Right wing troll cunts can be working class too
I've known plenty of working class people who come out with that kind of bollocks, but it's always been restricted to the unemployed.
8ball
Decolonise colons!
I think there needs to be an element of both, and also an awareness of the whole balance of messages you're trying to send. If by challenging a right-wing narrative you end up feeding another one, you'll end up chasing your tail.
Treacle Toes
Time
Exactly...ffs why do people keep pretending that WC can't be sneering, right wing, judgemental, aspirational idiots? Who did Maggie sell off all those council houses to again?Right wing troll cunts can be working class too
8ball
Decolonise colons!
I guess maybe that has changed because the line has been blurred by the number of people in poverty while still working, and also possibly claiming in-work benefits, possibly using a food bank, insecure income due to zero-hours contracts etc.
The kind of stuff where it should be the employers who feel the shame.
teqniq
DisMembered
Blimey. I didn't think that tweet was going to generate so much hot air. I just though it was a good vid and tbh I wouldn't know what a Fred Perry shirt was or a least I wouldn't have known up until now.
In the vid in the link below I hope we can all agree that the people at the front doing the head-shaking and heckling don't look particularly working class to me.
British-Asian MEP told to go home 'by Brexit Party' supporters
In the vid in the link below I hope we can all agree that the people at the front doing the head-shaking and heckling don't look particularly working class to me.
British-Asian MEP told to go home 'by Brexit Party' supporters
is this really necessary btw? do you need to see my collection of debt collection letters before I can have an opinion on this stuff?
seventh bullet
sovietwave
Nah. Even when a general scruff from the local shithole estate, it was a big thing for me to get nice clothes (defined within the class and its subcultures but informed by wider cultural norms) even if only able to afford a few nice items now and then. Bollocks about profligacy of the proles aside, it's what middle class people don't understand about the working class, and even more funny when they try and act like us.
seventh bullet
sovietwave
Trivial and irrelevant wasn't the experience of my benefit-dependant single parent family, so ...
brogdale
Coming to terms with late onset Anarchism
I asked treelover what he was suggesting by choosing to highlight all the irrelevant, wanky clothing based sneering that he claimed to have seen and he choose not to respond.
The clip looked & sounded like a good, clear message to working class voters to reject the fools' patriotism of the populist, far-right. The fact that some wankers were commenting on the lad's shirt did not need to be used to derail the thread discussion.
Right, and if the guy had made a video talking about his experience as someone dependent on benefits, there might be some truth to treelover's concerns. But it isn't - IME, yours may vary - a line that's likely to have much purchase as an attack against the working class in general, except among people for whom working class means benefit dependent.
LDC
On est tous des pangolins
Equating the working class with being poor, on benefits, or lying awake at night worrying about paying bills is wrong, but more importantly is politically dangerous, as it then paints everyone not doing those things as not the working class, something that capital is also very keen to do.
Treacle Toes
Time
I don't think anyone is saying the w/c is only that ... it's most certainly the experience of some though.
8ball
Decolonise colons!
Things have become quite muddied these days in terms of who the working class is.
If we are talking about needing to sell your labour in order to manage financially, then that covers a lot of people we wouldn't call working class usually.
seventh bullet
sovietwave
I haven't done that. I don't think many here have. However, I am of the poor (not now). I don't see why we shouldn't also talk about working class experience with that included.
8ball
Decolonise colons!
Just for clarity - my comment about lying awake til 3am worrying about bills was a direct reference to what the guy in the video was saying (about himself), and not meant by me to be taken as a necessary facet of being working class.
Treacle Toes
Time
Well that's where the sneery, shaming comes in ime... 'you aren't w/c if you haven't got a job' etc..
brogdale
Coming to terms with late onset Anarchism
The clip was about political parties claiming to address "white working class concerns" and who to blame for the issues causing them. As a white working class lad, he was articulating some of his concerns about the lived experience of late capitalism, and who he thought we should blame. The message was clearly not aimed at people who's capacity for solidarity is negated by their comfortable life.
Is this about something that's been said on this thread?
Serge Forward
Just enjoyin' my coffee.
It's a good video with solid proletarian internationalism in it. Pity it blew it with all the reformist Labour Party crap 
Anyone who says working class people can't or shouldn't spend their money on nice clothes is a fucking wankstain and is clearly an arse kisser of the boss class (that said, I've always thought FPs look a bit shit).
Anyone who says working class people can't or shouldn't spend their money on nice clothes is a fucking wankstain and is clearly an arse kisser of the boss class (that said, I've always thought FPs look a bit shit).
Dom Traynor
Tino Pai
Gutted to see treelover is still with us, pleased to see the little Welsh fella is though.
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