chilango
Hypothetical Wanker
heh. ban all the communists and fascists from working in italy and no one would have a job....
The BNP list: would you have leaked it?
- Thread starter teuchter
- Start date
heh. ban all the communists and fascists from working in italy and no one would have a job....
Fedayn
Well-Known Member
I would hazard a guess, as have others, that the sticky fingers of Searchlight will be in this somewehere. Along with a few anti-Griffinite ex, and possibly current, BNP members. That Searchlight may have their sticky fingers in makes it unlikely, imho, that some arm of the state isn't involved yes.
butchersapron
Bring back hanging
Griffin is now publically saying this was the members list allegedly stolen by the failed breakaway/Collet Out/whatever group this time last year (Darby oddly is still claiming it was the Labour Party). Court case still prending over that. If this is spook/searchlight inspired it's a potential masterstroke in terms of achieving their aims. If they've whipped up someone from the anti-griffin faction into posting this (before the case is even heard) then someone is going to jail simple as that (publication of the list was prohibited by the High Court in April), Griffin will be blamed. Cue civil war. It doesn't provide the political repsonse needed, but Searchlight aren't up to that anyway.
Barking_Mad
Non sibi sed omnibus
It's easy for the sake of mental simplicity to lump all BNP people as being more or less identical in ideas and motives. This however would be, as with any generalisation, open to error.
Perhaps the elderly and frightened pensioner who has been on the receiving end of a mugging from a non-white person and joined the BNP after getting a leaflet through the door deserves the same thrashing as the neo-nazi who has indulged themselves in a little 'Paki-beating'?
Perhaps the elderly and frightened pensioner who has been on the receiving end of a mugging from a non-white person and joined the BNP after getting a leaflet through the door deserves the same thrashing as the neo-nazi who has indulged themselves in a little 'Paki-beating'?
dennisr
the acceptable face
To be frank - I am surprised at the number of tears being shed for mistaken old pensioners, little children etc.
So maybe, just maybe a couple of 'innocents' get done. Thats how the balance of forces sometimes works out. its not fair, any more than the actual victims of the generalisations made by idiots in the BNP.
Butchers and Fed makes pertinant points about the dangers of this disclosure - weaknesses of resorting to tactics such as this by anti-fascists or state (if that is the case), and the potential upsets internally for the BNP. The unfortunate side-show of possible 'innocents' getting done over is irrelevant. Sorry like but some fools only learn the hard way - unfortunate though that is.
butchersapron
Bring back hanging
Lee Barnes, the BNP's supposed legal boffin has named Sharon Ebanks, Sean Hadley and John Holloway as being responsible (in collusion with Searhclight), this whilst the court case is still waiting to be heard. At the same time he claims the list is full of made up names, and that the BNP will lie and say that real members are not members if asked - all this in public. Genius!
belboid
Exasperated, not angry.
good post
Joe Reilly
Well-Known Member
History shows the left, despite all the bluff and bluster does not have the appetite for getting their hands dirty - the councillors candidates don't seem to be in fear of their lives do they? The fact that there are 13,000 names also points to the pointlessness of 'individualised terror' at this juncture. That said, should an otherwise sympathetic BNP member, (elderly, female, community worker) 'get badly done' the propaganda value to the BNP would be immesurable.
dennisr
the acceptable face
I'd agree with you points about ultra-lefts and the pointlessness of using this as a hitlist but (given you other recent posts on the subject) I don't think this is quite the propaganda coup you make it out to be for the BNP. its a fuck up, I not even convinced the state or any other unseen hand played any role. They will lose as much as they gain here, maybe more if they handle it badly - which is always a possibility.
If those otherwise sympathetic members - and I'm not convinced anyone will be anyway - get done over it would probably be ignored as it is for the vast majority of victims of violence.
You argue for political opposition to BNP growth - i'd agree with that. Its what lefts in Stoke are doing at the moment. They are fully aware of the pointlessness of battering a bigoted granny and have been getting their hands dirty for a good while now.
Targetting the issues that have forced the "bigoted" granny or any other member of the public to vote for the BNP is key to stopping them growing a support base in deprived areas.
Shit, expensive public transport, lack of social housing, lack of jobs, crap schools, lack of social activites, crime and immigration, are probably the key factors that have caused more people to vote for the BNP. If somebody could tackle these issues head on then I think the BNP support base would fade away.
TomPaine
teuchter
je suis teuchter
Seeing the list is different to sending it to people, who you don't know will use it responsibly, so I don't think it's hypocritical at all.
belboid
Exasperated, not angry.
that isn't what your question asked tho, is it? it asked whether one would have 'leaked' it. leaked, within the normal meaning of te word means sending it on anywhere, other than back top the legal owners. so, sending it to a 'responsible' anti-fash outfit would be leaking it, sending it to the beeb would be leaking it, etc etc
Thats one of the main reasons why your question was meaningless
Thats one of the main reasons why your question was meaningless
dennisr
the acceptable face
Gromit
International Man of Misery
I'm surprised that people on Urban are endorsing the release of personal information of anyone even if you do disagree with their political beliefs strongly.
Its okay providing its done to people we don't like. That sort of thinking leads us down the same dark path as them.
Its okay providing its done to people we don't like. That sort of thinking leads us down the same dark path as them.
Barking_Mad
Non sibi sed omnibus
....
butchersapron
Bring back hanging
Vader is Luke's father you know?
Barking_Mad
Non sibi sed omnibus
Gromit
International Man of Misery
But Star Wars hadn't been written when Martin Luther King said that.
Yoda, MLK. Never been seen in the same room together at the same time have they?
Just saying. Its so easy to fake a celebrity death. Elvis works in my local chippy too btw.
teuchter
je suis teuchter
My understanding of the word "leak" is to make something intended to be private, public. And I think it should be fairly clear from my OP that I was asking who would have done the same as was done by whoever leaked this list, ie. make it publicly available.
Barking_Mad
Non sibi sed omnibus
butchersapron
Bring back hanging
Sonia Gable condemning the leak on behalf of Searchlight on C4 news. Chutzpah they call it.
Griffin on now, condemning fascism. He's doing pretty well. Interviewer a bit wrong-footed by responses.
Griffin on now, condemning fascism. He's doing pretty well. Interviewer a bit wrong-footed by responses.
Jonti
what the dormouse said
^ this
littlebabyjesus
one of Maxwell's demons
My initial reaction was yes, fuck em. After thinking about it, I now agree with butchers. I would not make it public, but I also would not throw it in a fire without looking at it. I would try to use it responsibly by giving information to those who I think could use it in the way I would want it used. Surely it is more useful to have that list knowing that the BNP don't know you have it, in terms of sabotaging their activities.
That's quite a burden - using it in a way that would avoid unjust violence being meted out. But just making it public and washing your hands of any consequences seems too easy.
Having said that, now that it has been released, I have no sympathy whatsoever for anyone on that list or the invasion of their privacy that it entails. Fuck em.
That's quite a burden - using it in a way that would avoid unjust violence being meted out. But just making it public and washing your hands of any consequences seems too easy.
Having said that, now that it has been released, I have no sympathy whatsoever for anyone on that list or the invasion of their privacy that it entails. Fuck em.
Until something is proven otherwise it looks like a former member(s) of the bnp have published the contents of an internal membership database on the internet. That person or persons must have been a trusted member of that party to have that kind of access. To me it just shows the kind of loons who are actively involved in their party. I mean FFS would anyone in their right mind want to get involved in a 'political party' where this kind of thing happens.
belboid
Exasperated, not angry.
shame you fucked it up by using the terms in a way contrary to that of normal english, rendering your poll even more meaningless than most on here
littlebabyjesus
one of Maxwell's demons
Thinking about it more, I can see a utilitarian argument that would say that making this public will damage the BNP's recruitment. Fewer people join for fear of it being made public, so there is less money in the pot for them.
I don't think the BNP should be made illegal. I do wish they didn't exist, and would do many things if I thought I could contribute to their downfall.
I would draw a parallel with fox hunting. I don't think fox hunting should have been made illegal. I do wish people wouldn't do it, and cheer when hunt sabbers manage to ruin a hunt by laying false scent trails, etc.
To me, joining the BNP is enough of an action to deserve being named and shamed.
I'm torn.
I don't think the BNP should be made illegal. I do wish they didn't exist, and would do many things if I thought I could contribute to their downfall.
I would draw a parallel with fox hunting. I don't think fox hunting should have been made illegal. I do wish people wouldn't do it, and cheer when hunt sabbers manage to ruin a hunt by laying false scent trails, etc.
To me, joining the BNP is enough of an action to deserve being named and shamed.
I'm torn.
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