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Just enjoyin' my coffee.
Quick, someone see if greyzone.co.uk is still available
Russell Brand: rape and sexual abuse allegations, grifting and general dodginess - discussion
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DaveCinzano
WATCH OUT, GEORGE, HE'S GOT A SCREWDRIVER!
Sputnik Kit?
tim
EXPLODED TIM! (Help me!!!)
Tucker Carlson is very critical of current US foreign policy and very supportive of Russia. When Larry O'Hara and others go on about US Foreign Policy, they don't seem to have many issues with the Trumpite far-Right and the policies they would persue.
krtek a houby
Anger is Hi-NRG
Cid
Proper break this time
Afaik correct. I'm scanning back through some of his early covid era content, and the wild headline grabbing just isn't there. No particular signs of covid denialism... Just a mix of leftish content, some spiritual stuff. He's got interviews with Amanda Palmer (on abortion), Ricky Gervais, assorted neuroscientists and the like. They're not all uncomplicated figures, but it's almost a mirror to early Joe Rogan... People you might not be totally on board with, but sure - might get some value listening to an interview with them.
Like I'll give a quick quote from a solo YT episode on the Dominic Cummings escapade (search 'cummings corona breakdown' if you want to view, obvs adblock/privacy/VPN):
'what is it about this time has produced these leaders - like Trump and Johnson notably - who are populist, yet somehow excruciatingly elitist, cruel in policy yet somehow oddly delightful on camera'
Nothing in that tells you this man will be chatting with Tucker Carlson 2 years later. I haven't watched the whole thing, but it's perfectly fine content. I can see the appeal... It isn't overly flamboyant or ranty, it's a man musing on the individuals involved, on accountability in general and trying to unpick their thought processes. At this stage he seems to have been one of those who thought there might be positives we could take from the covid response; talks about how there was a brief moment when homelessness was solved etc. Again, to be clear, I'm not really talking about the details of his views, and have only watched that one video. But it wildly different from his output now... Too much to start to unpack on a Wednesday evening really. And not exactly relevant to the sexual assaults... Somewhat though. In the sense whatever the core Russell Brand is, his expression to the public is... mutable. Though sadly not entirely mute-able.
Dystopiary
putting up a hook to hang my hopes upon
Somebody (not me) made a Freedom of Information Request to Northamptonshire Police, Fire and Crime Commissioner to ask for a transcript of the hoax phone call Brand made to Northants police in 2008. Negative response:
moochedit
Mr Mooched It
Surely that's just saying they wrote to the wrong people though?
"Nothing to do with me guv".
Dystopiary
putting up a hook to hang my hopes upon
Yes, I should've better worded my post. Wonder if they'll ask Northants Police next and if they'll get anything from them.
DaveCinzano
WATCH OUT, GEORGE, HE'S GOT A SCREWDRIVER!
The original FOI request was made on 22nd September, and the reply clarifying that Northants PFCC did not hold the information came in three days - that's the fastest response I've ever heard of.
gosub
~#
With heads up (probably in both directions)
Clair De Lune
Apocalypse cocktails
I'm embarassed to say I quite liked Russel Brand back in the day. So that fact and how triggering the accounts of rape and SA were to hear on the dispatches programme has left a real dark cloud over the last few weeks. All made worse by the many posts blindly supporting him. We need to get one thing straight...he can't sue us all and we are allowed to talk about serious allegations and share our opinions ...we won't shut up no matter how many times you say 'innocent until proven guilty' fuck off.
It got me thinking about why I liked him...I wouldnt have called myself a fan as such but he did amuse me occasionally. I think I always enjoy seeing people on TV causing chaos...disrupting shows and getting presenters to drop their fake TV personas. I suppose bad behaviour, edginess and blatant narcissism can be amusing from a safe distance but absolutely terrifying up close. I'd not seen or heard a lot of the really horrible stuff that's being reposted though, I imagine lots of people hadn't. But even some of the stuff from buzzcocks and big fat quiz of the year is quite shocking to rewatch, as thankfully we have had quite a speedy paradigm shift in the last decade and things we'd laugh at then are now very uncomfortable viewing.
I think something that we need to realise is that just because a guy is seen as charming and attractive to some, doesn't mean that they can't be a sexual predator. Its almost as if people assume that if someone is capable of pulling lots of women then they have no need to rape! (And Ive heard people ...mainly men say this about non famous men also) So to point out the obvious...rape is about power, control & twisted abuse, not about a lack of access to willing sexual partners.
I also think that easy access to porn has played a large role in fucking up young men & women. What used to be considered hard-core is now mainstream. It's pretty hard to find porn which doesn't include an element of force, pain and utter subjugation of women. So it's no wonder that Brands 'jokes' about deepthroating and mascara running weren't seen as that shocking, sadly.
He used his charm, celebrity and power to gain access to women in much the same way as musicians always have and I don't think we've moved past lauding them and feeling jealous of them for that as a society. He was able to pick out audience members to try to fuck after shows in the same way I've heard many musicians doing. It's always felt grimey as fuck but it would be nice if we could work towards it being unacceptable. The fact that his runners felt unable to complain about basically acting like his pimps is horrendous. If we don't change this and the way that 'talent' are protected then these abuses by stars will continue. Its so sick that money can buy silence and legal protection of abuse allegations getting out.
Anyway this post has veered off on many tangents ...apologies.
What I really hope is that the next generations of women will not be taught to faun around disgusting & dangerous men. That they feel able to call out bad behaviour in public, on screen and in every day life without being labelled a prude, a killjoy or it affecting their careers. That women's comfort will be considered more important than a man's discomfort at being called out. That they won't be expected to smile, shrink and laugh off clear boundary violations.
Arghh
It got me thinking about why I liked him...I wouldnt have called myself a fan as such but he did amuse me occasionally. I think I always enjoy seeing people on TV causing chaos...disrupting shows and getting presenters to drop their fake TV personas. I suppose bad behaviour, edginess and blatant narcissism can be amusing from a safe distance but absolutely terrifying up close. I'd not seen or heard a lot of the really horrible stuff that's being reposted though, I imagine lots of people hadn't. But even some of the stuff from buzzcocks and big fat quiz of the year is quite shocking to rewatch, as thankfully we have had quite a speedy paradigm shift in the last decade and things we'd laugh at then are now very uncomfortable viewing.
I think something that we need to realise is that just because a guy is seen as charming and attractive to some, doesn't mean that they can't be a sexual predator. Its almost as if people assume that if someone is capable of pulling lots of women then they have no need to rape! (And Ive heard people ...mainly men say this about non famous men also) So to point out the obvious...rape is about power, control & twisted abuse, not about a lack of access to willing sexual partners.
I also think that easy access to porn has played a large role in fucking up young men & women. What used to be considered hard-core is now mainstream. It's pretty hard to find porn which doesn't include an element of force, pain and utter subjugation of women. So it's no wonder that Brands 'jokes' about deepthroating and mascara running weren't seen as that shocking, sadly.
He used his charm, celebrity and power to gain access to women in much the same way as musicians always have and I don't think we've moved past lauding them and feeling jealous of them for that as a society. He was able to pick out audience members to try to fuck after shows in the same way I've heard many musicians doing. It's always felt grimey as fuck but it would be nice if we could work towards it being unacceptable. The fact that his runners felt unable to complain about basically acting like his pimps is horrendous. If we don't change this and the way that 'talent' are protected then these abuses by stars will continue. Its so sick that money can buy silence and legal protection of abuse allegations getting out.
Anyway this post has veered off on many tangents ...apologies.
What I really hope is that the next generations of women will not be taught to faun around disgusting & dangerous men. That they feel able to call out bad behaviour in public, on screen and in every day life without being labelled a prude, a killjoy or it affecting their careers. That women's comfort will be considered more important than a man's discomfort at being called out. That they won't be expected to smile, shrink and laugh off clear boundary violations.
Arghh
Wilf
Slouching towards Billingham
Here's another one hiding in plain sight - Keith Lemon (real name, Leigh Francis). Not a physical assault, but sustained sexist harassment/abuse in front of an audience. He 'entertained' an audience for 3 hours, making sexist comments to/about Melanie Sykes during a recording of Through the Keyhole, according to her complaint. Two things stand out to me: firstly, it's the hiding in plain sight. Another gobshite comedian, laddish, sexist, no boundaries, who turns out to be..... well, yes, correct. Can't say I've ever thought much about Keith Lemon other than finding him tedious and sexist. But then, yet again, no off switch and the public 'comedian' is an absolute shit in a wider sense (technically, this isn't an on stage/off stage thing. The abuse of Sykes was in the studio, but when the cameras weren't rolling). Not everyone, but maybe comedians and others who 'perform' sexist shit are sexist shits. But with Lemon, how entirely predictable, he's been performing like that for years and, no surprise, that's what he is.
The other thing is the entirely predictable non-response from Talkback detailed in the story. And this managerial response could be cut and pasted into just about every one of these stories:
www.dailyrecord.co.uk
The other thing is the entirely predictable non-response from Talkback detailed in the story. And this managerial response could be cut and pasted into just about every one of these stories:
Melanie Sykes claimed Keith Lemon complaints were 'ignored by TV bosses'
Melanie Sykes opened up about an alleged experience on ITV's Through The Keyhole which left her in tears 'for three hours'.
moochedit
Mr Mooched It
Never seen the "keith lemon" stuff but i had a mate that liked "bo selecta" years back and used to put it on. I thought it was shite then.Here's another one hiding in plain sight - Keith Lemon (real name, Leigh Francis). Not a physical assault, but sustained sexist harassment/abuse in front of an audience. He 'entertained' an audience for 3 hours, making sexist comments to/about Melanie Sykes during a recording of Through the Keyhole, according to her complaint. Two things stand out to me: firstly, it's the hiding in plain sight. Another gobshite comedian, laddish, sexist, no boundaries, who turns out to be..... well, yes, correct. Can't say I've ever thought much about Keith Lemon other than finding him tedious and sexist. But then, yet again, no off switch and the public 'comedian' is an absolute shit in a wider sense (technically, this isn't an on stage/off stage thing. The abuse of Sykes was in the studio, but when the cameras weren't rolling). Not everyone, but maybe comedians and others who 'perform' sexist shit are sexist shits. But with Lemon, how entirely predictable, he's been performing like that for years and, no surprise, that's what he is.
The other thing is the entirely predictable non-response from Talkback detailed in the story. And this managerial response could be cut and pasted into just about every one of these stories:
Melanie Sykes claimed Keith Lemon complaints were 'ignored by TV bosses'
Melanie Sykes opened up about an alleged experience on ITV's Through The Keyhole which left her in tears 'for three hours'.
moochedit
Mr Mooched It
Yeah that's him. I think he had a dodgy "celebrity stalker" character as well IIRC.
8ball
Maximum Facepalm
Wilf
Slouching towards Billingham
Does a lot of gambling adverts as well. A shit for all seasons.
Serge Forward
Just enjoyin' my coffee.
Don't know this Keith Lemon person, never watched him. Just as well. It sounds like he's another proper shitbag.
danny la rouge
More like *fanny* la rouge!
I have always found the guy utterly creepy. I can’t watch him. So not surprised at all, and have always expected worse to come out.Here's another one hiding in plain sight - Keith Lemon (real name, Leigh Francis). Not a physical assault, but sustained sexist harassment/abuse in front of an audience. He 'entertained' an audience for 3 hours, making sexist comments to/about Melanie Sykes during a recording of Through the Keyhole, according to her complaint. Two things stand out to me: firstly, it's the hiding in plain sight. Another gobshite comedian, laddish, sexist, no boundaries, who turns out to be..... well, yes, correct. Can't say I've ever thought much about Keith Lemon other than finding him tedious and sexist. But then, yet again, no off switch and the public 'comedian' is an absolute shit in a wider sense (technically, this isn't an on stage/off stage thing. The abuse of Sykes was in the studio, but when the cameras weren't rolling). Not everyone, but maybe comedians and others who 'perform' sexist shit are sexist shits. But with Lemon, how entirely predictable, he's been performing like that for years and, no surprise, that's what he is.
The other thing is the entirely predictable non-response from Talkback detailed in the story. And this managerial response could be cut and pasted into just about every one of these stories:
Melanie Sykes claimed Keith Lemon complaints were 'ignored by TV bosses'
Melanie Sykes opened up about an alleged experience on ITV's Through The Keyhole which left her in tears 'for three hours'.
moochedit
Mr Mooched It
Don't worry he has a water tight alibi...
(Won't post link as daily fail)
Edit - screenshot....
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danny la rouge
More like *fanny* la rouge!
I’m even more convinced now.Don't worry he has a water tight alibi...
(Won't post link as daily fail)
Wilf
Slouching towards Billingham
I thought it was 'interesting' that they explicitly asked him that question.Don't worry he has a water tight alibi...
(Won't post link as daily fail)
Edit to add: I'm not doing 'no smoke without fire' logic. We probably do need a sense of restraint in discussing this stuff and shouldn't assume that every sleaze bag is a legally defined criminal. So, all I'm saying is that it was, literally, interesting that they asked him that.
moochedit
Mr Mooched It
Wilf
Slouching towards Billingham
The idea of Sykes being trapped in the studio while Lemon unloaded his misogyny is horrible (assuming it happened as she said and there's no reason to doubt her). Sort of reminds me of how Reeves and Mortimer treated Ulrica Johnson on Shooting Stars. Can't remember whether that was sexualised or 'just' bullying, but was horrible to watch and I pretty quickly stopped doing so. Hard to know whether their treatment of her (particularly by Reeves, iirc) was scripted/she knew that was the role she was playing. Even if that was the case, why the fuck would you set a programme up around treating someone like shit?
As always, there's a debate to be had about comedy, transgression and the rest. Certainly I wouldn't want comedy to become a sanitised 'safe space'. But what a lot of these cases (such as Lemon's) do remind you is that treating someone like shit and adding to misogyny, are just that, nothing else.
As always, there's a debate to be had about comedy, transgression and the rest. Certainly I wouldn't want comedy to become a sanitised 'safe space'. But what a lot of these cases (such as Lemon's) do remind you is that treating someone like shit and adding to misogyny, are just that, nothing else.
Monkeygrinder's Organ
Dodgy geezer swilling vapid lager
This is a much wider issue than the professional comedy circuit isn't it. Certainly I can think of people much closer to home who, although no one has ever accused them of actually being funny, have been using 'its just a joke' as an excuse for a long time.
kittyP
Pluviophile
Very well put CDL.
This is pretty much how I have been trying and failing to put my thoughts on the matter together.
AverageJoe
...
Let's be fair here.
Keith Lemon/Leigh Francis has never been accused of being a glassy eyed abuser of women.
We're accusing him of being an over the top "nudge nudge wink wink" purveyor of OTT humor to get a reacion. There's at least one of those in every pub.
He knows what he is doing and almost stays on the right side of innuendo and stuff. Most of the time.
(this is nott a disclaimer or a defence of the man, but he's not been accused of Brand style issues, unless I've missed womething)
Keith Lemon/Leigh Francis has never been accused of being a glassy eyed abuser of women.
We're accusing him of being an over the top "nudge nudge wink wink" purveyor of OTT humor to get a reacion. There's at least one of those in every pub.
He knows what he is doing and almost stays on the right side of innuendo and stuff. Most of the time.
(this is nott a disclaimer or a defence of the man, but he's not been accused of Brand style issues, unless I've missed womething)
existentialist
Tired and unemotional
I do wonder whether one of the reasons misogyny and sexism is rife in comedy is because nobody wants to be the one who calls out the comedian and risking being accused of "not getting the joke". It's not going to be a sole factor, but I could see how it might add to the discouragement.Here's another one hiding in plain sight - Keith Lemon (real name, Leigh Francis). Not a physical assault, but sustained sexist harassment/abuse in front of an audience. He 'entertained' an audience for 3 hours, making sexist comments to/about Melanie Sykes during a recording of Through the Keyhole, according to her complaint. Two things stand out to me: firstly, it's the hiding in plain sight. Another gobshite comedian, laddish, sexist, no boundaries, who turns out to be..... well, yes, correct. Can't say I've ever thought much about Keith Lemon other than finding him tedious and sexist. But then, yet again, no off switch and the public 'comedian' is an absolute shit in a wider sense (technically, this isn't an on stage/off stage thing. The abuse of Sykes was in the studio, but when the cameras weren't rolling). Not everyone, but maybe comedians and others who 'perform' sexist shit are sexist shits. But with Lemon, how entirely predictable, he's been performing like that for years and, no surprise, that's what he is.
The other thing is the entirely predictable non-response from Talkback detailed in the story. And this managerial response could be cut and pasted into just about every one of these stories:
Melanie Sykes claimed Keith Lemon complaints were 'ignored by TV bosses'
Melanie Sykes opened up about an alleged experience on ITV's Through The Keyhole which left her in tears 'for three hours'.
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Wilf
Slouching towards Billingham
Erm, no, he's accused of misogynistic harassment against Melanie Sykes, in the studio. Something specific, not just his general schtick. I made it clear that he hasn't been acused of physical sexual abuse.
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