Rumsfield pushing for war on Iran

[Bernie Gunther]

Well Bush, Rumsfeld and the boys wouldn't give a shit about some Brits dying after all, so from his point of view bombing Iran is probably a pretty cool idea.

You can, if you've a strong stomach, easily picture republican voters getting off on it.

 

[Aldebaran]

Not at all; I'm pointing out the duplicity of aldebaran, complaining about US aggression, then advocating the bombing of the place.

He's an islamic warmonger, pure and simple.

If you quote someone, then quote correctly, instead of selectively choosing a section of a post that somehow fits your delusional agenda.

To me it looks very much that you are:
1. US citizen
2. Bush supporter
3. Hence in complete support of the current US government's "policy" of illegal invasion of sovereign nations, bombing the territory of sovereing nations, murdering tens of thousands of citizens of sovereign nations, committing war crimes, threatening other sovereign nations and hence its citizens with invasion and hence war and hence with death, and all this while living under the delusion to be God.

Aha: double standard.

Just think how few troubles there would be if we bombed Palestine to hell.

Yes, indeed your double standard is showing again.
You mention Palestinians, while you could have mentioned Israel just as well, if it only comes down to "solve the problem" which, may I remind you, was created by the arrogance and idiocy of West, suffering from a huge feeling of guilt toward the Jewish peoples.
The Palestinians still pay the price for the guilt of the West = for the Western induced and tolerated genocide on the Jewish people, commonly known as the Holocaust.

Maybe your US schools should teach some real WWII history and the consequences thereof, instead of "history waving the US Flag".

salaam.

 

[spring-peeper]

If you quote someone, then quote correctly, instead of selectively choosing a section of a post that somehow fits your delusional agenda.

To me it looks very much that you are:
1. US citizen
2. Bush supporter
3. Hence in complete support of the current US government's "policy" of illegal invasion of sovereign nations, bombing the territory of sovereing nations, murdering tens of thousands of citizens of sovereign nations, committing war crimes, threatening other sovereign nations and hence its citizens with invasion and hence war and hence with death, and all this while living under the delusion to be God.

eta: I hope that my quoting was more to your standards.



Yes, indeed your double standard is showing again.
You mention Palestinians, while you could have mentioned Israel just as well, if it only comes down to "solve the problem" which, may I remind you, was created by the arrogance and idiocy of West, suffering from a huge feeling of guilt toward the Jewish peoples.
The Palestinians still pay the price for the guilt of the West = for the Western induced and tolerated genocide on the Jewish people, commonly known as the Holocaust.

Maybe your US schools should teach some real WWII history and the consequences thereof, instead of "history waving the US Flag".

salaam.

JC is a Canadian, so the first part of your mathmatics equation is wrong.

The rest is just stereo-typical crap.

 

[fela fan]

Idiot. Please keep your idiotic CAPS LOCKS comments out of these threads. We want a serious discussion.

Oh really? And that from the person that ruins 911 threads. Beggars will never cease.

 

[fela fan]

Thank you so very much once again to the arrogant, bloodthirsty, greedy shameless scum first class, commonly named USA.

I like that description!

 

[spring-peeper]

In my view it is about time someone bombs the USA to hell.
Yet it would be much better if the rest of the world finally found the decency to tell lunatics like Rumsfeld & crew to shut up.

Meanwhile in Iran:
Student organisations and other groups organising the enrollment for training in armed resistance, with a few options for candidate-suiciders to choose from. Some gatherings bring 30 % and more of enrollments (male and female) for such a quick course in how to kill the enemy where ever you can find him.

Thank you so very much once again to the arrogant, bloodthirsty, greedy shameless scum first class, commonly named USA.

I shall sign this post with "salaam" as usual although I am convinced some readers do not want "peace" but for their greedy own at the cost of tens of thousands of innocent lives.

salaam.

The bolded text is my doing and is the part of the quote that I'm addressing.

It is your personal belief that the United States should be bombed. That's interesting.

What part of the United States would you target? What would you hope to accomplish by bombing the United States? How can you justify killing innocent people?

Early you claim to have lost family members to the US/<insert name of your country>. My condolences, that could not have been very pleasant. Why would you wish to inflict this type of pain and sorrow on others?

You say that you preach peace through your religion. Wishing to have a country and its citizens bombed is not very peaceful.

Your post is so full of hatred and venim, I hope that you can find internal peace at sometime.

As for signing your posts with "salaam"...well, I don't believe that any more.

 

[TAE]

Aldebaran, post #32, you once again make many bold statements which are based on assumptions rather than facts.

 

[Aldebaran]

The bolded text is my doing and is the part of the quote that I'm addressing.

Like I said to an other poster: Selective reading is nothing else then a dishonest, self-serving reading.
You should read one sentiment and then the following since that clearly rises from the first one and is hence inseparable part of one line of reasoning.

The full text is:

In my view it is about time someone bombs the USA to hell.
Yet it would be much better if the rest of the world finally found the decency to tell lunatics like Rumsfeld & crew to shut up.

If I propose one option and then let it be followed by an other one which I describe as much better, it is clear enough which one I prefer and hence what the conclusion is that I came to.

Your post is so full of hatred and venim, I hope that you can find internal peace at sometime.

Correction:
My post is full of realism and deals with nothing else then just that. If realism is something you can't deal with that can't be my problem.
It isn't even limited to describing my personal sentiments or conclusion. In fact: My family in Europe shares them. The same counts for my European friends.
That is today's reality for you.

As for signing your posts with "salaam"...well, I don't believe that any more.

That is your choice, hence not my responsibility hence I don't take notice of it.

salaam.

 

[Aldebaran]

Aldebaran, post #32, you once again make many bold statements which are based on assumptions rather than facts.

TAE, post 37: You once again make bold statements which are based on assumptions rather than facts.

Now you can chose to limit your postings to this line and I can do the same.
You can also chose to write down your personal opinions about other posters and what drives them based on posts made by those you give your opinion about. Which is what I did in this thread in the post you refer to.
You can also chose to write down your opinions or comments on posts made by others and on the contenance thereof, which is also what I do.
You can also chose to write posts initiating a debate or discussion, which is also what I do.
Or you can chose to read and keep silent. Which is also what I do.

These are the facts of my (short) posting history on this message board. What more "facts" do you want or expect or which ones do you detect that somehow escape me?

salaam.

 

[Johnny Canuck3]

To me it looks very much that you are:
1. US citizen
2. Bush supporter
3. Hence in complete support of the current US government's "policy" of illegal invasion of sovereign nations, bombing the territory of sovereing nations, murdering tens of thousands of citizens of sovereign nations, committing war crimes, threatening other sovereign nations and hence its citizens with invasion and hence war and hence with death, and all this while living under the delusion to be God.
.

I guess it's hard to see clearly from way over there.

 

[Johnny Canuck3]

Yes, indeed your double standard is showing again.
You mention Palestinians,.

I did that deliberately, as sort of a counterpart to your 'bomb the US' statement, to show that in other contexts, such a comment is unacceptable.

 

[Johnny Canuck3]

Maybe your US schools should teach some real WWII history and the consequences thereof, instead of "history waving the US Flag".

salaam.

They didn't teach any US history in the schools I went to. Any I've learned, I picked up on my own.

 

[Johnny Canuck3]

If I propose one option and then let it be followed by an other one which I describe as much better, it is clear enough which one I prefer and hence what the conclusion is that I came to.

.

You propose two options. You describe one as preferable, but both appear to be acceptable to you.

 

[Azrael23]

So rather than discuss opposition to the war......we argue...

 

[Aldebaran]

I did that deliberately, as sort of a counterpart to your 'bomb the US' statement, to show that in other contexts, such a comment is unacceptable.

1. Since I don't read this message board long enough to assess if yes or no you are honest about this I give you the benefit of the doubt on this..
2. On the other hand I have the strong impression that you claim that the US invasion of a sovereign nation, the US murdering tens of thousands of people including two I loved, among which my second mother, is completely acceptable. In addition you seem to claim that the USA threatening Iran and hence the population of Iran with the same is fully acceptable.

You propose two options. You describe one as preferable, but both appear to be acceptable to you.

At least I have a very fundamental reason, and more then one, to feel what I feel and hence to write what I wrote.

And no, the first option is not morally acceptable, if I found it acceptable I wouldn't even bothered to mention the other one. Yet like I said, the first one is also the expression of a sentiment that can be heard all over the world.
That is a reality.

An other reality is that you give me very much reasons to believe your are US citizen hence I have no reason to believe you are not.

salaam.

 

[fela fan]

2. On the other hand I have the strong impression that you claim that the US invasion of a sovereign nation, the US murdering tens of thousands of people including two I loved, among which my second mother, is completely acceptable. In addition you seem to claim that the USA threatening Iran and hence the population of Iran with the same is fully acceptable.

The biggest political irony in my life is watching the US fuck up the world while simultaneously rabbitting on about bringing peace and democracy to the very countries they're bombing the shit out of, or destabilising through their CIA. And a large part of that irony is how so many americans and britons have swallowed their filthy rhetoric.

Where bush may have done the world a favour is to wake up many of those americans and britons to the damage that the US visits upon our planet. I mean, it's not like they weren't exactly the same before bush got his power. They've been at it for fucking decades. They are the deadliest force in our world, love killing, and love bombing. They swagger around the world bringing misery and mayhem to thousands of communities.

Furthermore they get rid of democracies in developing world countries as soon as they look like taking hold.

They are a total disgrace to the human race. With their attitude to global affairs we will not only never achieve peace, we will have increased violence and injustices for the ordinary brother and sister.

My fight remains the same as it has for my adult life: i am for the peoples and i am against the leaders. Nationality and religion have got nothing to do with anything for me.

Oh, and the likes of rumsfeld should be chucked in the most disgusting prison that exists in the US, stripped naked and tortured. Let him vomit on his own medicine. What an inhumane amoral disgraceful example of a human being. He has not one atom of humanity. He is evil personified. And he's a member of the government of a country that claims they're bringing freedoms and democracies to other countries.

The self-deception is too big for me to grasp.

 

[GarfieldLeChat]

JC is a Canadian, so the first part of your mathmatics equation is wrong.

if you are talking maths then it's jc2 that's got it wrong love...

Aha: double standard.

Just think how few troubles there would be if we bombed Palestine to hell.

unless jc2 has yet again let it slip who and what he/it is .... oops jc2 you just can't help yourself can you...

wriggle wriggle little worm...

 

[GarfieldLeChat]

I did that deliberately, as sort of a counterpart to your 'bomb the US' statement, to show that in other contexts, such a comment is unacceptable.

what is unacceptable is a canadian leaping into bed with the americans every time someone mentions the usa...

 

[Johnny Canuck3]

At least I have a very fundamental reason, and more then one, to feel what I feel and hence to write what I wrote.

And no, the first option is not morally acceptable, if I found it acceptable I wouldn't even bothered to mention the other one. Yet like I said, the first one is also the expression of a sentiment that can be heard all over the world.
That is a reality.

An other reality is that you give me very much reasons to believe your are US citizen hence I have no reason to believe you are not.

salaam.

What's that: revenge?

And so the world turns.

I dont' know where you're from or what you know, but it's interesting to think that only americans can hold certain beliefs and ideas. And don't get me wrong, I'm not agreeing with all the ideas that you'd attribute to me in your post.

 

[Johnny Canuck3]

, the first one is also the expression of a sentiment that can be heard all over the world.
That is a reality.
.

Well, the counter reality is that Americans know that you and others feel that way, and after 911, they aren't taking chances, so don't be surprised to find Humvees driving down your street.

That is a reality.

 

[Johnny Canuck3]

if you are talking maths then it's jc2 that's got it wrong love...



unless jc2 has yet again let it slip who and what he/it is .... oops jc2 you just can't help yourself can you...

wriggle wriggle little worm...

You don't simplify language usage ever?

And as it happens, Canadian soldiers are shooting al qaida members in Afghanistan right now, so I guess that pretty much puts us on the 'us' side of 'us vs them'.

 

[Johnny Canuck3]

what is unacceptable is a canadian leaping into bed with the americans every time someone mentions the usa...

Why; do you want to exercise thought control over me?

 

[TeeJay]

About Rumsfeld's comments that Iran was involved in activities within Iraq: I have heard the same thing being said by Iraqi Sunni representatives.

Two questions:

1. Is the Iranian government involved with Shia militia activity in Iraq?
2. If so is this a bad thing?

These questions exist regardless of Rumsfeld or any American agenda. Anyone got a view?

 

[fela fan]

Well, the counter reality is that Americans know that you and others feel that way, and after 911, they aren't taking chances, so don't be surprised to find Humvees driving down your street.

That is a reality.

I really do reckon you should read blowback by chalmers johnson.

Either that or get a lesson in cause and effect, sowing and reaping, and where and with who the whole processes begin. Not leaping in the middle somewhere.

 

[ViolentPanda]

About Rumsfeld's comments that Iran was involved in activities within Iraq: I have heard the same thing being said by Iraqi Sunni representatives.

Two questions:

1. Is the Iranian government involved with Shia militia activity in Iraq?
2. If so is this a bad thing?

These questions exist regardless of Rumsfeld or any American agenda. Anyone got a view?

I'll have a go:

1: I'd say that the Iranian government is behind some elements of the Shia militias in Iraq, but not in a direct relationship, more likely they "feed" intel and materiel through third parties. Do the militias execute Iranian policy? Almost certainly. It's in their interests to preserve good links with their Shia brothers in Iran because it garners them the stuff mentioned above, and it also gives them a massive ""backyard" to escape to (if necessary) after operations.

2: I don't believe (at least in the context of the 20th-century history of the region) that it is a bad thing in cultural terms, after all the Iraqi Shia were shat on under Saddam, why shouldn't they seek comfort from their brethren over the border? Of course, this relationship annoys and upsets many in Bush's inner circle who remember the events of 1979, but it's their present actions that have caused this "firming up" in the relationship between Iraqi and Iranian Shi'ites, so they've only themselves to blame.

 

[TAE]

Now you can chose to limit your postings to this line and I can do the same.

You were speculating about JC2 and got it wrong, as posts above mine made clear.

 

[GarfieldLeChat]

You don't simplify language usage ever?

And as it happens, Canadian soldiers are shooting al qaida members in Afghanistan right now, so I guess that pretty much puts us on the 'us' side of 'us vs them'.

no to the extend of changing nationalities no ... that's a simplification too far really isn't it... wriggle wriggle...

you cannot state oh yes me and my fellow citizens the americans, when you are french neither can you if you are canadian, unless you ment in like one great big global type way mannnnnnn... which you didn't you stated you are american in your post which contradicts your previous claims that you are a cannuck so either you were lying previously and forgot yourself or you are some missive who through some homogious binding thinks that everyone from the contenant of the americas is a citizen of the us which is narrowminded bigotry, or you were just to damn quick to leap in to defend your beloved bush...

face facts JC2 you are a sham of a poster...


as for

Why; do you want to exercise thought control over me?

well yes it'd be nice to have a sainity thouht prick the insatiable appitite you have for blundering along like some wounded bear from one untied states govermental fuck up to another and the cia bodge jobs which cause them and have you think hey that's shit rather than have you sitting there glory worshipping the deaths of 100,000's of arabs like some nigger baiting, coon hating kkk member... odd when you think about it really that your overt racism is thinly disgusied under the premise that cos you your self are a minority that you couldn't possibly be racist...

yet you are a racist, to you as is evidenced through out your entire backcatalouge of posts, not only racist but also and frankly more importantly a charlaton...

now be a good doggie and fuck off..

 

[GarfieldLeChat]

What's that: revenge?

And so the world turns.

I dont' know where you're from or what you know, but it's interesting to think that only americans can hold certain beliefs and ideas. And don't get me wrong, I'm not agreeing with all the ideas that you'd attribute to me in your post.

just the one's about revenge eh?

like you previously stated aims for comign here in the first place... after 9/11 summit which didn't involve you or for that matter canada... you lying fuck bag...

 

[GarfieldLeChat]

You were speculating about JC2 and got it wrong, as posts above mine made clear.

nope jc2 left the house with his underwear showing as has been demonstrated above ...

you are another clueless prick TAE another waste of dna fuck off too...

 

[Lock&Light]

untied states

Is that another way of saying non-aligned states?