where to said:
Sue:
1. Lack of integration and not just in the banlieue either. Lip service may be paid to the idea of egalite but some French people are certainly more equal than others. Unusual to see mixed race groups of friends which is perhaps partly down to...
thats simply not true. if you look at the folk rioting they are mixed race groups. okay theres not many white, but they are mixed. unlike bradford and the like in the uk where you have situations like birmingham - blacks vs asians.
2. "Sure there's racism here but in France it's much worse."
evidence please.
3. "Lack of employment/crap education. With unemployment in France in general being v high and the economy being stagnant, unemployment among young people is extremely high. And all this is much much worse in the banlieue and exacerbated by the French way of doing things education-wise."
hows that?
four and five sound about right.
Where to, find it surprising you're trying to argue that lack of integration isn't a problem. In my experience, it is very unusual to see, for example, a mixed race group of friends in a restaurant/bar for a night out. People coming together to kick off against the state wasn't really what i was meaning.
The casual racism thing -- any response will obviously be anecdotal but I can assure I've seen this many times and experienced it when with non-white/Arab friends. Maybe your experience has been more fortunate than mine.
When I mentioned the French education thing, I mean the idea that everything is decided on merit. As is true in Britain, if you live in a deprived area with crap schools, it's that much harder to do well at school. Because things in France are very rigid (ie you have to do your Bac at age x, your degree at age y) if you do things in a non-traditional way, it's very much seen as inferior. For example, a friend who went back to do her Bac part-time in her 20s, who was then studying for a degree part-time. Now to me, the fact she was motivated enough to do this (and do it well) while looking after her kids and working full time would be seen as a positive thing. But no, in a depressed econony when there aren't too many jobs about, why employ someone like her when you can get someone who's done everything in the right order.
Anyway, guess all this is anecdotal and you obviously have your own views on it. Just find some of them a bit different to my own experience tbh.
Oh, and just to add, Sarkozy talking about using an industrial-strength steam cleaner to clean away the 'scum' is, shall we say, really not helping things...
