riots in paris banlieu...

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fucking just pissed myself laughing. that was class.

 

[tobyjug]

Ah the delights of school trips to France and the promise of the things it was rumoured you could buy

One can also buy tear gas canisters quite legally in France.

 

[where to]

Nearly effortless, I have enough material in my garage and home for 75 petrol bombs, and this does not include the petrol in the car which my wife has taken to work.

you scare me sometimes tobyjug lol

 

[where to]

but I think many know that this is way too organized to be just "random upset kids".

why though, what signs of organisation are there? other than kids quite naturally phoning their mates, and congregating before they go out.

you must have no imagination pal. i feel sorry for you.

 

[TeeJay]

The the argument that Powell or Rice are an advancement for black people is a bloody stupid one.

Your ruler may share the same colour as you but he is still your ruler. A black person is no better off being ruled by a black person that he is being ruled by a white person.

You may be right, but it can both indicate other things going on in society and have some 'cultural/symbolic' value as well - just as total exclusion can send out the opposite message.

Surely it is generally speaking healthy thing to have elected representatives that are drawn from all parts of society? It may not actually be *necessary* to present people's views and interests nor in itself lead to proper representation.

 

[where to]

edited for adding nothing to the conversation

 

[tobyjug]

you scare me sometimes tobyjug lol

Nothing scary about it, 4 motorcycles with full petrol tanks and the recycling man has not put in an appearance for weeks due to staffing difficulties.
I have a gallon of 30 monograde oil to make some anti vehicle petrol bombs as well. (A little oil mixed in with the petrol makes the flaming petrol "stick" to vehicles)

 

[where to]

Nothing scary about it, 4 motorcycles with full petrol tanks and the recycling man has not put in an appearance for weeks due to staffing difficulties.
I have a gallon of 30 monograde oil to make some anti vehicle petrol bombs as well. (A little oil mixed in with the petrol makes the flaming petrol "stick" to vehicles)

aye, i just meant the fact that you'd thought it through and that eh....

 

[Phototropic]

Nothing scary about it, 4 motorcycles with full petrol tanks and the recycling man has not put in an appearance for weeks due to staffing difficulties.
I have a gallon of 30 monograde oil to make some anti vehicle petrol bombs as well. (A little oil mixed in with the petrol makes the flaming petrol "stick" to vehicles)

Fuck it is you isn't Your the one who is leading the riots

What is to be ey tobes!? First Paris then the world

Well luckyilly we have Christian Man. Without him your devious plans might never have been foiled.

 

[TeeJay]

I have a gallon of 30 monograde oil to make some anti vehicle petrol bombs as well. (A little oil mixed in with the petrol makes the flaming petrol "stick" to vehicles)

tobyjug - do you reallly think it is wise to post stuff like that up on a well known "anarchist" website?

You'll get put on The List!

 

[soulman]

People feeling that they are being excluded from work and suffering from racism and police harassment and violence, brought to a head by this recent case and made worse by Sarkozy's public comments.

All of which are symptoms of the existing social and economic order. Is it that you don't think the people rioting are clever enough to understand this?

 

[tobyjug]

tobyjug - do you reallly think it is wise to post stuff like that up on a well known "anarchist" website?

You'll get put on The List!

Stuff like what, it is standard resistance handbook, in the event of invasion instructions not a state secret.

 

[TeeJay]

All of which are symptoms of the existing social and economic order. Is it that you don't think the people rioting are clever enough to understand this?

Only clever people believe in your ideology?

Anyone who disagrees with you is stupid?

 

[TeeJay]

Stuff like what, it is standard resistance handbook, in the event of invasion instructions not a state secret.

Context is everything.

Where did you get this "resistance handbook" btw?

 

[tobyjug]

Context is everything.

Where did you get this "resistance handbook" btw?

Family heirloom along with my mother's Civil Defence manual.

 

[soulman]

I think people need to face it - this isn't any sort of progressive uprising. I'm amazed some people are rushing to try and portay it as such, when much of it appears very unpleasant and devoid of working-class politics at all. Indeed - how can smashing up fellow-working class people's cars, buses and services or beating fellow-working class people up be in any way progressive?

That depends what you mean by working class politics.

There's nothing rational about capitalism so why expect a neat, orderly and rational reaction against it?

 

[bigfish]

Yves Bot said he had detected an organized hand and a strategy behind the riots.

Could that be the organized hand of the French state, I wonder?

 

[tobyjug]

Yves Bot said he had detected an organized hand and a strategy behind the riots.

Could that be the organized hand of the French state, I wonder?

Organised hand of the internet is more likely.

 

[editor]

Yves Bot said he had detected an organized hand and a strategy behind the riots.

Could that be the organized hand of the French state, I wonder?

You tell us. What do you think?

Is there yet another pesky conspiracy at work here?

Looking forward to seeing the evidence, facts, proof etc etc.

 

[tobyjug]

Is there yet another pesky conspiracy at work here?

.

Personally I doubt it. A death or two in an ethic minority area, percieved to be the fault of the police has somewhat of a history of kicking off serious and prolonged rioting from Britain to more recently Australia.

 

[where to]

a guy called William Dalrymple in the wall street times has come up with the strongest dismissal of the riots yet:

that they are an attempt to kill off sarkozy and therefore kill off the reforms that will take from them their supposedly cushy life of hanging around and enjoying the life of crime in their own little territory (that would soon be taken over by cops/ CRS.)

i agree with him about the (sub?)conscious effort to bring down Sarko, but not so much the rest. there probably is a bit of truth in what he's saying though. i think there is definately a fear of sarkozy, one way or another.

hopefully giving the right wingers a common sense, realistic and thought through argument will now save us all that conspiracy and wishy washy bullshit that has dominated most of their interventions thus far

 

[lightweight]

come along now...

"- that a group of low-life scum ran into an electric substation and short-circuited (not very hard) their brains."

Excuse me mate, but you are fucking bang out of order for assming that these boys were low life scum. The full facts of the events of that night are not out yet. We are still yet to know exaclty what the boys were doing and what thye were supposedly running from the police for.

I lived in the banlieues of Paris for 5 months last year whilst doing a language course in the city, and there can be a very large disparity between the lives of those living within the peripherique and outside it.

The segregation is the problem. You need to at least have proper inetgration for any hope of racial harmony- and this is a racial issue. This menas white children sharing school with arab children and black children and chinese children and indian children. All through the city not just in a few places. The secularism embedden in the french constitution is contradictory if it doesn't appear that efforts are to be made to show that the government does regard citizens as equal. That everyone is included in society.

Insteda of condemming drugs and the problems in the banlieus where they're sold, canthey not start talking baout addictions as an illness. One that poeple can be helped with. Szarkozy makes himself so distant from the situation. By calling them lotus he insults their concerns about where they live and their despair at their surroundings. Someone really needs to fucking listen to these guys. Unhappy poor people do not stay quiet for long. Let's not forget 1795.

 

[lostexpectation]

acab

police persecute banlieuens...

the banlieuians attack the police suddenly it news.

seems there main motivation is attack the police, can I blame em, no.

it was interesting on euronews they said that the curfew law is a 50 yr old law that was created to deal with trouble in Algeiria and has never been used before in mainland France. Funny that.

 

[Christian Man]

It could be France's strong socialist values as the underlying cause of these disaffected youth.

 

[lostexpectation]

what world you living in

i don't really want to engage in conversation with christian_mad, but for anyone who knows what theyre talking about, is france really _that_ different from any other country in europe...ie a money/greed driven society

 

[Ryazan]

It could be France's strong socialist values as the underlying cause of these disaffected youth.

?

 

[editor]

It could be France's strong socialist values as the underlying cause of these disaffected youth.

Feel free to elaborate upon this fascinating theory of yours.

 

[davgraham]

Now I know why Butcher's said he was staying out of this thread.

Gra

 

[Lea]

That puzzles me, most major towns in France have been shown on maps on TV news bulletins as having problems. Even as far West as Nantes and Rennes.
I have as yet not seen anything about Brest having any problems though.

Had a bit of a laugh when watching the France2 news last night. They were showing the international interest in the riots. They showed a clip from CNN with a big map of France and the problem areas. On the map they placed Toulouse to the far East and Cannes to the SW. Can't remember the rest. I knew the Americans are terrible when it comes to World Geography but for such an international television station to make such obvious errors...

 

[Sue]

Anyone hear the interview with Le Pen on the Today programme this morning...? Apparently the only racism that's been displayed is towards French people, anyone causing trouble should be shipped back to where they -- or, if French citizens, where their grandparents -- came from, the people involved are all dealing drugs and driving round in big fancy cars and a lot more along similar lines. Why the fuck is the BBC giving him airtime?