P&O Ferries sacks workers and docks ships

[Artaxerxes]

So Chris Grayling has been writing EU directives on the sly, has he? Cheeky...

P&O Ferries sacks workers and docks ships

They might simply have calculated that whatever penalty they might end up having to pay, the wage savings are large enough that it still adds up for them financially.

www.urban75.net

 

[not-bono-ever]

View attachment 316264
source

they used to run big freight only from Felixstowe to the Hook with 4 ferries a little while ago but dumped the route to focus on pax and DFDS bought it.

 

[cupid_stunt]

Good front page here...



It basically confirms the sort of pay & conditions the agency staff get.

Agency workers aboard a P&O ferry which sails to Hull make less than £3 an hour and have to live on the ship for months at a time, Hull Live understands.

The largely Filipino agency workers on P&O’s superferry the Pride of Rotterdam are employed on six months contracts through an agency, with no guarantee of returning, it is claimed.

A P&O source, who spoke to Hull Live on condition of anonymity, said the agency staff made between roughly £916 and £1,298 a month, equating to less than £3 an hour on their 11-hour day, seven days a week rota.

Hull East MP Karl Turner has described the working conditions as like the crew living on a ‘floating prison’.

The claims have been supported by the RMT union which represents many of those sacked by P&O. Sources told Hull Live about nine out of 10 crew on the Pride of Rotterdam were contracted agency workers from the Philippines. They earn between £3 and £5 an hour, work 12-hour days, seven days a week for a six month contract period and all live on the vessel, according to the trade union.

P&O workers 'earning £3 an hour and live on Hull ship for months'

P&O agency staff pay and conditions revealed after mass sackings

www.hulldailymail.co.uk

 

[Ax^]

IIRC there was an interregnum of some 13 years when there was a Labour government, ample time to change labour and union legislation, yet they chose not to? A bit hypocritical really to blame only the Conservatives for eroding workers' rights.

not sure when you last changed jobs before retiring but you know for at least the last 4 years,
the tory party made the way for legislation that states you don't even get full workers rights for the first 2 years

it been enacted and lets employers choose if you even entitled sick pay during that period
even after a pandemic and the government tell people to got and get covid to live with it

business atm are losing more people to sickness that during lockdown and then not paying them
fucking bullshite

 

[hitmouse]

Doing Hull on Tuesday again:

 

[hitmouse]

Full list of P&O demos over the next few days:


Hull 4pm Tuesday 5 April King George Dock, Hull HU9 5PR
Liverpool 4pm Wednesday 6 April Meet Sandy Rd, Seaforth, Liverpool L21 3TN by Seaforth Autoparts, near Seaforth and Litherland Railway Station
Cairnryan 12noon Friday 8 April Loch Ryan Port, Cairnryan, DG9 8RG

 

[ddraig]

Consequences

Stena Line: Fishguard route suspended as ship plugs P&O gap

Stena Line suspends route from Fishguard as its ship is sent to help out in Northern Ireland.

www.bbc.co.uk

Sailings on a Welsh ferry route have been suspended as the operator tries to plug gaps left in Northern Ireland.
Stena Line has cancelled all crossings between Fishguard, Pembrokeshire and Rosslare, Republic of Ireland until 12 April.

It has moved a ship to Northern Ireland following concerns food supplies could be affected by the P&O crisis.

P&O's services were suspended after it sacked 800 staff saying the business was not "viable".

Passengers who usually travel from Fishguard are being advised to travel on the Pembroke service instead, as Irish Ferries is accepting Stena Line customers.

 

[sleaterkinney]

The govt doesn’t need directives to sort this out, it can just call in p&o and say they're not getting any more govt contracts. They could sort it in 5 mins - if they wanted to.
As far as brexit is concerned this kind of behavior is what they want to see more of.

 

[Sasaferrato]

The P&O boats need to get back in service ASAP. It's a fait accompli, all that is happening now is that there is chaos at the ports.

Take away government contracts, and then see if there is enough capacity for other operators to take them.

Appalling behaviour, but all but one have accepted the settlement. Time to move on, sad as it is.

 

[BigTom]

The P&O boats need to get back in service ASAP. It's a fait accompli, all that is happening now is that there is chaos at the ports.

Take away government contracts, and then see if there is enough capacity for other operators to take them.

Appalling behaviour, but all but one have accepted the settlement. Time to move on, sad as it is.

Bollocks. If you roll over and let this happen, you'll get others doing the same. Suspend P&Os licences to run any ships into or out of UK ports, like the MCA are doing at the moment. Not just government contracts, literally ban them from docking except in emergencies. Show some backbone or you will keep getting rolled over by multinational companies. If they want to do trade on this land, they need to meet our standards.

 

[Ax^]

but that not what brexit was about

 

[hitmouse]

It's a fait accompli, all that is happening now is that there is chaos at the ports.

Surely that's not what a fait accompli is? Yeah, at the point when the P&O boats are all back up and running in normal service it might be right to say "it's a done deal, time to move on", but if there's chaos at the ports that would seem to indicate that the situation is not yet settled and we are in fact still in the middle of it?

 

[wemakeyousoundb]

... If they want to do trade on this land, they need to meet our standards.

pretty low bar here

 

[Ted Striker]

I really don't quite understand how the accepted accusation that this is all illegal...Just seems to be glossed over?

Shouldn't there be punishments for this kind of thing? But none has ever been mentioned afaics (I haven't looked that hard, tbf).

Ditto the staff on sub-minimum wage.

 

[Nine Bob Note]

I really don't quite understand how the accepted accusation that this is all illegal...Just seems to be glossed over?

Shouldn't there be punishments for this kind of thing? But none has ever been mentioned afaics (I haven't looked that hard, tbf).

Ditto the staff on sub-minimum wage.

If the PM is seen to break the law with impunity, why would anyone else bother with rules?

 

[Sasaferrato]

Surely that's not what a fait accompli is? Yeah, at the point when the P&O boats are all back up and running in normal service it might be right to say "it's a done deal, time to move on", but if there's chaos at the ports that would seem to indicate that the situation is not yet settled and we are in fact still in the middle of it?

It is a fait accompli as far as P&O are concerned, all bar one of the ex employees has accepted the settlement. What is the point in further action, the people are gone.

Bollocks. If you roll over and let this happen, you'll get others doing the same. Suspend P&Os licences to run any ships into or out of UK ports, like the MCA are doing at the moment. Not just government contracts, literally ban them from docking except in emergencies. Show some backbone or you will keep getting rolled over by multinational companies. If they want to do trade on this land, they need to meet our standards.

Dear Lord. That is an astonishing level of naivety.

The bottom line is that we need these boats. It isn't just the Dover/Calais service that is now in complete chaos, it is also the Ireland service.

You can howl all you like, nothing is going to change. Are those people who got £100k+ payouts just going to give it back and come back to work?

Would you? Would you go back to working for an employer that had treated you like this? I had some shitty employers in 47 years of working, but never one as bad as that.

Pragmatism will prevail, the P&O boats will be back in service within a week.

 

[BigTom]

It is a fait accompli as far as P&O are concerned, all bar one of the ex employees has accepted the settlement. What is the point in further action, the people are gone.

Dear Lord. That is an astonishing level of naivety.

The bottom line is that we need these boats. It isn't just the Dover/Calais service that is now in complete chaos, it is also the Ireland service.

You can howl all you like, nothing is going to change. Are those people who got £100k+ payouts just going to give it back and come back to work?

Would you? Would you go back to working for an employer that had treated you like this? I had some shitty employers in 47 years of working, but never one as bad as that.

Pragmatism will prevail, the P&O boats will be back in service within a week.

I'm not for one second thinking that P&O will get blocked from ports. Totally agree with your last sentence.
And no, no-one is going to go back to P&O but that's not the point, the point is to stop every other multinational pulling this stunt or doing similar shit until we are totally fucked. If you're happy to roll over and show your belly, that's up to you but I would prefer to deal with short term issues to create long term gains as other companies, who are happy to take the profit from this land, move in to satisfy the demand. And yes, I know it takes time to build or buy ships like this, but long term is forever. Or P&O will find new people to hire at rates and conditions that are acceptable to us.

 

[Sasaferrato]

I'm not for one second thinking that P&O will get blocked from ports. Totally agree with your last sentence.
And no, no-one is going to go back to P&O but that's not the point, the point is to stop every other multinational pulling this stunt or doing similar shit until we are totally fucked. If you're happy to roll over and show your belly, that's up to you but I would prefer to deal with short term issues to create long term gains as other companies, who are happy to take the profit from this land, move in to satisfy the demand. And yes, I know it takes time to build or buy ships like this, but long term is forever. Or P&O will find new people to hire at rates and conditions that are acceptable to us.

I don't disagree that what you say is what should be, however, we cannot wait until ships are built. The M20 is a lorry park, again.

My nephew on Tiree is unemployed at the moment, he is a lobster fisherman, they have lifted their pots because most of their catch goes to Spain, and seafood needs to be alive at the point of cooking. If they cannot be sure that the stuff won't be sitting for days, they can't fish. Every Scottish inshore fisherman is in the same boat.

It's not a matter of 'rolling belly up' it is a matter of having the shipping that is needed. We import a hell of a lot of our food, which comes across the channel in lorries.

 

[cupid_stunt]

Why wait for ships to be built?

Just nationalise P&O ferries, as essential national infrastructure, and find a more acceptable operator to take over the business.

 

[two sheds]

Not worth a lot if it hasn't any government contracts I wouldn't have thought

 

[cupid_stunt]

Not worth a lot if it hasn't any government contracts I wouldn't have thought

I know the parent company has various government contracts, not sure if there's any contracts with P&O ferries, not that it matters, they are losing IIRC £100m a year, so should be able to nationalise at a very reasonable price.

 

[Sasaferrato]

not sure when you last changed jobs before retiring but you know for at least the last 4 years,
the tory party made the way for legislation that states you don't even get full workers rights for the first 2 years

it been enacted and lets employers choose if you even entitled sick pay during that period
even after a pandemic and the government tell people to got and get covid to live with it

business atm are losing more people to sickness that during lockdown and then not paying them
fucking bullshite

It was fifteen years. I moved from Sky to the Revenue (As it was then).

 

[teuchter]

Why wait for ships to be built?

Just nationalise P&O ferries, as essential national infrastructure, and find a more acceptable operator to take over the business.

What problem, exactly, would nationalising them solve? Who's going to crew this nationalised operation, how much will they be paid, and how long is it going to take to get it all set up?

 

[Bahnhof Strasse]

Clearly this is done. What MUST happen now is the law must be strengthened to prevent other companies doing the same, at the same time a rule that where ships primarily operate between two countries/regions (EU), all staff on those ships must be paid at least the minimum wage for at least one of those places. Making P&O pay those agency staff a proper rate will make this whole thing an expensive waste of time for P&O.

 

[teuchter]

I thought P&O had actually said that it would welcome minimum wage rules because they would apply to its competitors as well.

When the minimum wage rules come in, they'll have to pay more than they seem to be attempting at the moment, but presumably they still won't be paying as much as they were before, so I'm not sure it'll have made the exercise a waste of time from their (ruthless commercial) point of view.

 

[Bahnhof Strasse]

I thought P&O had actually said that it would welcome minimum wage rules because they would apply to its competitors as well.

When the minimum wage rules come in, they'll have to pay more than they seem to be attempting at the moment, but presumably they still won't be paying as much as they were before, so I'm not sure it'll have made the exercise a waste of time from their (ruthless commercial) point of view.

No idea what skilled trades got on those ferries, but my cousin Dippy-David worked on the ferries from Dover for three years on bare-arsed minimum wage, would suspect that for many deck-hands and stewards the same would also be true.

 

[hitmouse]

I don't disagree that what you say is what should be, however, we cannot wait until ships are built. The M20 is a lorry park, again.

My nephew on Tiree is unemployed at the moment, he is a lobster fisherman, they have lifted their pots because most of their catch goes to Spain, and seafood needs to be alive at the point of cooking. If they cannot be sure that the stuff won't be sitting for days, they can't fish. Every Scottish inshore fisherman is in the same boat.

It's not a matter of 'rolling belly up' it is a matter of having the shipping that is needed. We import a hell of a lot of our food, which comes across the channel in lorries.

I'm sorry to hear that about your nephew but that situation is entirely on P&O, no-one else made them sack all their staff. I don't get the line of argument that "their shitty decision has caused too much chaos so that means we just have to go along with it."

 

[teuchter]

No idea what skilled trades got on those ferries, but my cousin Dippy-David worked on the ferries from Dover for three years on bare-arsed minimum wage, would suspect that for many deck-hands and stewards the same would also be true.

According to this

TUC: Government P&O plan “has gaping holes”

Responding to the government’s plan on P&O announced by the transport minister Grant Shapps today (Wednesday), TUC General Secretary Frances O’Grady said:

www.tuc.org.uk

they were previously on union negotiated rates higher than minimum wage.

 

[cupid_stunt]

What problem, exactly, would nationalising them solve? Who's going to crew this nationalised operation, how much will they be paid, and how long is it going to take to get it all set up?

Well it should have happened right at the start to prevent the chaos that was clearly going to unfold, but it's not too late to do it now and bring the chaos to a swift end.

Emergency legalisation could be brought in nationalise the business, at a reasonably [low] valuation because of the losses it makes and the fact that it's not even operating in a meaningful way at present. If the former staff have not yet received their compensation payments, these should be guaranteed, and deducted from the figure to take over the business.

Those staff could then be invited back to their jobs, and I bet the majority would be happy to return, even after taking the compensation, just to get back at what would now be the former owners. Any shortfall of staff could then be filled by agency staff with proper pay and conditions.

We saved the banking sector, I see no reason why we shouldn't save the ferry sector.

 

[cupid_stunt]

Clearly this is done. What MUST happen now is the law must be strengthened to prevent other companies doing the same, at the same time a rule that where ships primarily operate between two countries/regions (EU), all staff on those ships must be paid at least the minimum wage for at least one of those places. Making P&O pay those agency staff a proper rate will make this whole thing an expensive waste of time for P&O.

It's not just wages, but overall terms of employment too.

At least some of these agency staff are expected to work 12 hours a day, 7-days a weeks, for months on end, that's basically modern day slavery in my book.