#occupy London....

[DownwardDog]

'My suspicions are confirmed when he invites me to the "love tent".
Oh God, is that what I think it is?
Why yes, it is. He tells me: "I went in there once. It's basically a massive orgy with loads of teenagers.
"There was just this mass of bodies all getting down to it."

C,mon this is bollocks isn't it?

What was the bit about collecting bottles of piss all about?

 

[Pickman's model]

What was the bit about collecting bottles of piss all about?

for the demonstration on wednesday when the cops will be pelted with it.

don't be surprised when you see that in the papers tomorrow or wednesday.

 

[Gramsci]

The media have been setting the rules for our politicians for the last few decades. Remember "It's the Sun wot won it" after Kinnock's defeat. Remember the Labour Party Rapid Rebuttal Unit using Excalibur software to pick up hostile news and counter it, and subsequently Tony Blair flying off to meet Murdoch to get him on side before his election campaign. Look at the failure of the Met Police to admit to being influenced by journalists in the phone tapping scandal. If people at that level of power and politics are cowed by the media then it is not surprising that anti-establishment people sleeping in tents where they are not wanted, should show caution.

Exactly. And showing caution is not sucking up to the media.

 

[rekil]

'My suspicions are confirmed when he invites me to the "love tent".
Oh God, is that what I think it is?
Why yes, it is. He tells me: "I went in there once. It's basically a massive orgy with loads of teenagers.
"There was just this mass of bodies all getting down to it."

C,mon this is bollocks isn't it?

See post #944.

 

[Gramsci]

Why do you assume it's the media setting the rules? The media is hardly 'flattering' the occupations is it? They continue however and despite the way you want to interpret the 'discrete' drinking policy on camp,there was a consesus decision for it which had nothing to do with wanting to discrimate against street drinkers. Many people on site are taking the occupation and their input in it seriously, shock horror they don't want to get drunk all the time or encourage others to do so.

I agree. I did say as much to a couple of the Occupiers when I was dropping some food off last week.

Im in a Coop and we agreed a no drinking at meetings rule as we found a minority were getting disruptive after a few drinks. This has nothing to do with the media as we arent that important. It was just commonsense decision.

As far as I can see the Occupiers are giving food to whoever turns up. No one is being questioned if they are an Occupier or not.

The Occupiers are learning the hard way to keep this going for several months. Most would not have experience of working in this Cooperative way even if its something they believe in. Looks to me that the London Occupations are doing ok for the time being.

I do think they could heed the advice of Naomi Wolf:

"The movement has been shy of identifying leaders, but I believe this is a mistake. A leader does not have to be a top-down hierarchist: a leader can be a simple representative. Protesters should elect representatives – for a given term just like in any democracy – and train them to talk to the press and to negotiate with politicians. These should span the spectrum: young people and grandparents, truckers and teachers and businesspeople. It is hard to cover the protest effectively if there are no spokespeople."

http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree/2011/nov/06/naomi-wolf-occupy-movement

 

[treelover]

that woman from Uk uncut who was interviewed on newsnight was very good, though I could see her in the LP in ten years time..

 

[free spirit]

I do think they could heed the advice of Naomi Wolf:

"The movement has been shy of identifying leaders, but I believe this is a mistake. A leader does not have to be a top-down hierarchist: a leader can be a simple representative. Protesters should elect representatives – for a given term just like in any democracy – and train them to talk to the press and to negotiate with politicians. These should span the spectrum: young people and grandparents, truckers and teachers and businesspeople. It is hard to cover the protest effectively if there are no spokespeople."

http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree/2011/nov/06/naomi-wolf-occupy-movement

well, she would say that wouldn't she, being a self identified spokesperson for such movements.

fact is the powers that be love organisations with leaders, spokespeople etc as they're easy to buy off / threaten / outmanouver politically.

if there's no head, then it's far harder to kill off by any decapitation approach, though they'll no doubt find other ways of achieving the same affect.

 

[Nigel]

As an aside, has anyone seen any conspiralloons turn up.
Right wing group calling itself L@wf*l R£bell10n had their conference in central london @ weekend.
Had a lot of papers from U#K C0llumn of which for instance individuals such as W@yn£ Sturg£0n of N@ ti0n@l A n @rchi$t$ is involved in.
They said they were going down to St. Pauls to spread the word.
Anyone see or hear of them being around.

 

[AKA pseudonym]

I do think they could heed the advice of Naomi Wolf:

"The movement has been shy of identifying leaders, but I believe this is a mistake. A leader does not have to be a top-down hierarchist: a leader can be a simple representative. Protesters should elect representatives – for a given term just like in any democracy – and train them to talk to the press and to negotiate with politicians. These should span the spectrum: young people and grandparents, truckers and teachers and businesspeople. It is hard to cover the protest effectively if there are no spokespeople."

http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree/2011/nov/06/naomi-wolf-occupy-movement

hmmm.. to 'train' people reveals an inherent hierachal position....
imo... feck 'jazzy hands'..... get an agreed 'agenda', stop faffing about, and stick to the important issues... designate an agreed time to 'debate each topic' and vote for a consensual agreement... not being tanky but a good chairperson could cut the BS... if people feel strongly about an issue, let them regroup and present a coherent arguement at the next meeting...
A lot of people (the majority) aint used to these 'jazz hand' incestual discussion processes... anyhows, I believe there is another thread here to discuss 'thoughts' on #occupy....

 

[AKA pseudonym]

As an aside, has anyone seen any conspiralloons turn up.
Right wing group calling itself L@wf*l R£bell10n had their conference in central london @ weekend.
Had a lot of papers from U#K C0llumn of which for instance individuals such as W@yn£ Sturg£0n of N@ ti0n@l A n @rchi$t$ is involved in.
They said they were going down to St. Pauls to spread the word.
Anyone see or hear of them being around.

huh?

your links are to email addresses?
tbh: they look like lulzsec/chan identities?
PLUS my security is flagging them as dodgy?

 

[stuff_it]

Headline tomorrow: St.Paul's Steps Sordid Lesbian Love-In Shame

I wish I'd made it into London now.

I agree. I did say as much to a couple of the Occupiers when I was dropping some food off last week.

Im in a Coop and we agreed a no drinking at meetings rule as we found a minority were getting disruptive after a few drinks. This has nothing to do with the media as we arent that important. It was just commonsense decision.

As far as I can see the Occupiers are giving food to whoever turns up. No one is being questioned if they are an Occupier or not.

The Occupiers are learning the hard way to keep this going for several months. Most would not have experience of working in this Cooperative way even if its something they believe in. Looks to me that the London Occupations are doing ok for the time being.

I do think they could heed the advice of Naomi Wolf:

"The movement has been shy of identifying leaders, but I believe this is a mistake. A leader does not have to be a top-down hierarchist: a leader can be a simple representative. Protesters should elect representatives – for a given term just like in any democracy – and train them to talk to the press and to negotiate with politicians. These should span the spectrum: young people and grandparents, truckers and teachers and businesspeople. It is hard to cover the protest effectively if there are no spokespeople."

http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree/2011/nov/06/naomi-wolf-occupy-movement

Leaders, lol.

 

[free spirit]

As an aside, has anyone seen any conspiralloons turn up.
Right wing group calling itself L@wf*l R£bell10n had their conference in central london @ weekend.
Had a lot of papers from U#K C0llumn of which for instance individuals such as W@yn£ Sturg£0n of N@ ti0n@l A n @rchi$t$ is involved in.
They said they were going down to St. Pauls to spread the word.
Anyone see or hear of them being around.

have you caught l33t or something?

 

[stuff_it]

have you caught l33t or something?

Trying to make this thread unsearchable obvs.



Noobz

 

[Treacle Toes]

I agree. I did say as much to a couple of the Occupiers when I was dropping some food off last week.

Im in a Coop and we agreed a no drinking at meetings rule as we found a minority were getting disruptive after a few drinks. This has nothing to do with the media as we arent that important. It was just commonsense decision.

As far as I can see the Occupiers are giving food to whoever turns up. No one is being questioned if they are an Occupier or not.

The Occupiers are learning the hard way to keep this going for several months. Most would not have experience of working in this Cooperative way even if its something they believe in. Looks to me that the London Occupations are doing ok for the time being.

Cool!

 

[Treacle Toes]

Boris Johnson heckled by Occupy protesters on People's Question Time before they were removed by sercurity.
More of this sort of thing. This kind of direct action/disruption of public meetings is working very well for Occupy wall Street.

 

[killer b]

huh?

your links are to email addresses?
tbh: they look like lulzsec/chan identities?
PLUS my security is flagging them as dodgy?

he's trying to make his comments unsearchable, but i guess the forum software automatically converts anything with a @ in into an email link.

 

[Blagsta]

As an aside, has anyone seen any conspiralloons turn up.
Right wing group calling itself L@wf*l R£bell10n had their conference in central london @ weekend.
Had a lot of papers from U#K C0llumn of which for instance individuals such as W@yn£ Sturg£0n of N@ ti0n@l A n @rchi$t$ is involved in.
They said they were going down to St. Pauls to spread the word.
Anyone see or hear of them being around.

There are people at the Birmingham camp into all that "lawful rebellion" crap.

 

[Nigel]

There are people at the Birmingham camp into all that "lawful rebellion" crap.

That could be a bit of a nightmare.
Guy I talked to was from the Midlands

 

[Nigel]

huh?

your links are to email addresses?
tbh: they look like lulzsec/chan identities?
PLUS my security is flagging them as dodgy?

That wasn't done on purpose

 

[smokedout]

Why do you assume it's the media setting the rules? The media is hardly 'flattering' the occupations is it?

because people said on this thread that the media were one of the reasons for the drinking ban, and you yourself said part of the reason was the 'image' of the camp

They continue however and despite the way you want to interpret the 'discrete' drinking policy on camp,there was a consesus decision for it which had nothing to do with wanting to discrimate against street drinkers.

was it a consensus decision or did you vote?

Many people on site are taking the occupation and their input in it seriously, shock horror they don't want to get drunk all the time or encourage others to do so.

why do you think that if you dont ban drinking then suddenly everyone will fall to the devil drink and spend all day getting pissed?

 

[treelover]

There is a post on OLSX FB page apparently originating from the Zeitgeist Movement basically endorsing Workfare, which they call 'workfair'

worrying...

 

[treelover]

 

[shaman75]

Occupy London protesters issue demands to lord mayor

Occupy London protesters outside St Paul's have put demands to the City of London Corporation which, if accepted, may prompt them to leave the cathedral area. The camp already planned to move further back on Friday to avoid impeding Remembrance Sunday commemorations, but now conceivably might leave entirely at the weekend.

The document from Occupy London's general assembly is the first set of agreed demands, and raises the renewed possibility of negotiation with the corporation, after previous talks broke down. Bryn Phillips, who helped draw up the demands, said he was meeting the lord mayor to hand over the group's demands, which he regarded as a significant advance. On Monday night protesters voted for demands that, if they were to be accepted, would open the corporation, the local authority for the area housing the UK's financial centre, to more scrutiny. Those present said that 200 people voted for the document asking the corporation to open itself tofreedom of information requests, publish its accounts retrospectively to 2008, and reveal its financial involvements. A third proposal is for a commission, with representatives of the main Westminster parties, to look at reforming the corporation, with the archbishop of Canterbury suggested to chair it. The Occupy statement says democratic reform is "urgently needed" for an "unconstitutional and unfair" institution. It calls for:

• An end to business and corporate votes in elections, which can outvote residents.

• Removal of "secrecy practices", and transparent reform of institutions.

• Decommissioning of the City of London police, with officers put under the Met.

• Abolition of the offices of lord mayor, sheriffs and aldermen.

• A truth and reconciliation commission to examine allegations of corruption.

www.guardian.co.uk/uk/2011/nov/08/occupy-london-protesters-issue-demands

http://occupylsx.org/?p=839

 

[Delroy Booth]

interesting article about the role of conspiracy theories in the Occupy movement http://shiftmag.co.uk/?p=512

 

[BigTom]

There is a post on OLSX FB page apparently originating from the Zeitgeist Movement basically endorsing Workfare, which they call 'workfair'

worrying...

not good, but if it's on a fb page it's not meaning anything much really. Remember that one of the OLSX aims/beliefs agreed near the start was the defence of benefit claimants, I doubt they would endorse workfare as a group.
There are a lot of nuts around at occupy places, and anyone can post on fb.

 

[ExtraRefined]

interesting article about the role of conspiracy theories in the Occupy movement http://shiftmag.co.uk/?p=512

finance capital vs industrial capital: Populism often depends on the producerist narrative, which pits “unproductive capital” against “productive” capital. Unproductive capital refers to industries which are based on the manipulation of abstractions (banking), versus the production of physical objects (factory work). The Nazis relied on this distinction for their “National Socialism.”

Lol Milliband is a Nazi.

 

[nino_savatte]

How did you work that out, brainwave?

 

[shaman75]

I'm fairly convinced nobody from OccupyLSX looks at the facebook page, so it's probably the best place for the trolls and nutcases and people with shit ideas to come together and keep themselves occupied.

 

[ExtraRefined]

How did you work that out, brainwave?

http://www.newstatesman.com/uk-politics/2011/09/britain-values-government-work

Let me tell you what the 21st century choice is: Are you on the side of the wealth creators or the asset strippers? The producers or the predators? Producers train, invest, invent, sell.
Things Britain does brilliantly.
Predators are just interested in the fast buck, taking what they can out of the business. This isn't about one industry that's good and another that isn't. Or one firm always destined to be a predator and another to be a producer. It's about different ways of doing business, ways that the rules of our economy can favour or discourage.
Look at what a private equity firm did to the Southern Cross care homes. Stripping assets for a quick buck and treating tens of thousands of elderly people like commodities to be bought and sold.

 

[treelover]

I'm a great fan of the Photographers Gallery in London, been going many years, but i just had a look at its trustees, its not just the church which has very very strong links with the COL...

http://www.photonet.org.uk/index.php?pid=192