Jeremy Corbyn's time is up

[Wilf]

Up here one of the local labour parties was about to show I Daniel Blake, but then found out the People's Assembly was also signed up as a sponsor of the event, so withdrew. At one level that's what bureaucratic parties have always done - not working with 'approved groups'. But then ffs! I'm no great fan of the people's assembly, fwiw, but if you can't look beyond your rulebook in times like these, what chance is there of delivering... anything?

 

[treelover]

Reckon it's possible to be pro-Corbyn and still recognise the Labour party has collapsed as an effective opposition. You'd have to be a proper cultist to think otherwise.

Do you not acknowledge the Shadow Cabinet are raising all sorts of issues in Parliament, particularly people like Debbie Abrahams(Works/Pensions) They are just not getting a hearing from the media, including 'liberal' ones like (especially) the Guardian, i do accept the wider public is not really listening though anyway.

 

[treelover]

"Who will speak for liberal Britain?"



View attachment 103125

Surprised to see David Hare having a go

 

[treelover]

Well, in practice, he is a drag on the party, I agree - though I suspect I'm agreeing with you from a different political position. But then the party has also been a drag on his leadership - the coups and briefings ensured he never had a chance, nor, more to the point did the attempt to restore the party to a social democratic position. But equally, more so in fact, I blame the Corbynites for never building that project, engaging with people. It was always going to be difficult, to change direction, to get people feeling they had a connection with the party - but it was never going to happen if they didn't actually do it. But all that adds up to, well, nothing. There's no realistic prospect of any kind of even semi successful political project emerging from the ruins. A united social democratic party would have more chance - even a united fucking Blairite party would have more chance in the polls than what there is now - but neither of those things is going to happen - so removing Corbyn does nothing.

just a question, how do you know they(Momentum) are not engaging with the public?

The wider party is having street stalls, open meetings, etc all the time, here.

 

[treelover]

Crikey, we could create a whole thread out of this fella.

he looked pretty cool in his band days.

 

[killer b]

Do you not acknowledge the Shadow Cabinet are raising all sorts of issues in Parliament, particularly people like Debbie Abrahams(Works/Pensions) They are just not getting a hearing from the media, including 'liberal' ones like (especially) the Guardian, i do accept the wider public is not really listening though anyway.

Sure, I acknowledge that if you like - but they aren't a functioning opposition, whatever the reasons.

 

[brogdale]

he looked pretty cool in his band days.

That 1992 look...

 

[Wilf]

That 1992 look...

View attachment 103263

Fucking hell, 25 years a liberal democrat, must have a soul the size of a pea.

 

[Wilf]

just a question, how do you know they(Momentum) are not engaging with the public?

The wider party is having street stalls, open meetings, etc all the time, here.

Apart from the Corbynmania events in Middlesbrough (meeting of 700+), I've never seen a single event (I did once go to a book launch, that might have been organised by momentum). Certainly not seen any evidence of the party as a whole or the left particularly going to places abandoned by Blair. Might just be that I've not seen stuff because I've not really been involved in anything for 12 months. Suppose a better way of putting would have been I've seen nothing that adds up to a part wide or even party-left wide strategy of reconnecting with the working class.

 

[kabbes]

That 1992 look...

View attachment 103263

Hilary Amstrong is the winner out of that trio.

 

[JTG]

Hilary Amstrong is the winner out of that trio.

And she was. 58% of the vote

 

[rutabowa]

I agree with this guy

“I like him, I like his policies, I like his integrity,” they say, “but he can’t convince other people, so it’s all pointless.” I’d argue if you are on board with the policies then why not spend your energies in helping argue for them? Rather than thinking in terms of a leader coming in and doing all the work, let’s think of a movement with each of us doing our bit to bring about the changes we want. If Corbyn doesn’t give great speeches then someone else should do some of the heavy lifting. But if you can’t lend your hand, as Dylan said: “Don’t stand in the doorway, don’t block up the hall.”

A seismic shift is needed for Corbyn to win in 2020. But it could happen | Maurice Mcleod

 

[bi0boy]

I agree with this guy

A seismic shift is needed for Corbyn to win in 2020. But it could happen | Maurice Mcleod

A seismic shift that sees the entire population except Corbyn wiped out by a mega-tsunami perhaps. Otherwise, no.

The idea that if only a bit more convincing took place, people would turn out for Labour in their droves is deluded.

 

[rutabowa]

A seismic shift that sees the entire population except Corbyn wiped out by a mega-tsunami perhaps. Otherwise, no.

The idea that if only a bit more convincing took place, people would turn out for Labour in their droves is deluded.

It was more the content of the article than the copy editors headline that I agree with; the idea that the party should move away from top down leadership dominated by personality and towards the membership taking more responsibility.

But you know never waste yet another opportunity to call someone deluded lol

 

[bi0boy]

It was more the content of the article than the copy editors headline that I agree with; the idea that the party should move away from top down leadership dominated by personality and towards the membership taking more responsibility.

But you know never waste yet another opportunity to call someone deluded lol

With 555 pages I'm sure everything has been said more than once.

 

[mikey mikey]

The idea that if only a bit more convincing took place, people would turn out for Labour in their droves is deluded.

I suspect the English will never again vote for Labour and will willingly drive themselves into a new Victorian era of landed gentry being served by people in maids and butler outfits who only get addressed by their surname. Fortunately for me, I won't be living there but I recognise that I am the one at fault in England. Since the population had only voted for a couple of decades of Labour in government, living under the boot of Tory Toffs must be what they want. Knowing that, I suppose I should just leave them to it. Walk away.

 

[butchersapron]

I don't suppose the labour vote actually going up in England and down in Scotland at the last election has any effect on this juvenile scenario does it?

 

[mikey mikey]

What's juvenile about that? You know, being a condescending prat might be the reason why you don't get invited out very much.

 

[rutabowa]

I guess the juvenile thing (of which I am 100% guilty of probably more than anyone) is treating the construction of the kind of society you want as someone else's problem/job, which it is possible to run away from... when in fact we are all personally part of it and complicit in whatever happens!!

 

[butchersapron]

What's juvenile about this:

"I suspect the English will never again vote for Labour and will willingly drive themselves into a new Victorian era of landed gentry being served by people in maids and butler outfits who only get addressed by their surname."?

Equally juvenile is the refusal to engage with facts that show this up as being juvenile nonsense.

You genuinely have no idea how you and people like you with your chest-prodding inanities drive people away from labour do you? Just about every labour person on here - including those far to the left of you - has been alienated by the content-free crap you churn out.

And then we find, hardy political fighter that you are,that you're going to run away from the fight that you obsessively witter on about day after day. The Labour Party has done so well out of you lot hasn't it?

 

[co-op]

I guess the juvenile thing (of which I am 100% guilty of probably more than anyone) is treating the construction of the kind of society you want as someone else's problem/job, which it is possible to run away from... when in fact we are all personally part of it and complicit in whatever happens!!

Well also ignoring as butchers pointed out that "the English" swung quite heavily to Labour in the last GE, they got 1,000,000 extra votes.

 

[rutabowa]

Well also ignoring as butchers pointed out that "the English" swung quite heavily to Labour in the last GE, they got 1,000,000 extra votes.

I totally didn't know that ha although it's not a huge surprise, guess it's not that important anyway in the scheme of things.

 

[DotCommunist]

just leave them to it

what sort of talk is this? Never lie down or walk away.

 

[brogdale]

RUK = 'Rest of UK' (minus Scottish seats)...

 

[rutabowa]

what sort of talk is this? Never lie down or walk away.

I always find this brings me back from defeatism

 

[co-op]

I totally didn't know that ha although it's not a huge surprise, guess it's not that important anyway in the scheme of things.

Now I think about it that 1m figure might be England & Wales combined, I can't be arsed to plough through the figures now, soz

 

[butchersapron]

Now I think about it that 1m figure might be England & Wales combined, I can't be arsed to plough through the figures now, soz

No, you're right.

 

[mikey mikey]

You genuinely have no idea how you ....drive people away from labour do you?

How would you know that?

Just about every labour person on here - has been alienated by the content-free crap you churn out.

Well you certainly share the confidences of a lot of people.

Either that, or you are attempting a schoolyardy "Nobody likes you" bullying tactic.

 

[Jeremiah18.17]

Cheer up you lot.
It's all to play for, a week is a long time in politics, it's not over til the fat lady sings, the wheel's still in spin, you can't predict the future etc etc etc
Brexit+Trump+Syria+China+Climate Change+Fracking+Rising Nationalism+rapid technological change+New Media+Covert Action+Further Financial/Economic Crisis+Black Swan events= ?....

 

[DotCommunist]

Cheer up you lot.
It's all to play for, a week is a long time in politics, it's not over til the fat lady sings, the wheel's still in spin, you can't predict the future etc etc etc
Brexit+Trump+Syria+China+Climate Change+Fracking+Rising Nationalism+rapid technological change+New Media+Covert Action+Further Financial/Economic Crisis+Black Swan events= ?....

It's the new dawn baby, and here be dragons