Is this woman a transphobe?

[Edie]

I will not be calling this male rapist a woman, and I find it deeply disturbing the media does:

Bristol transgender woman jailed for rape - BBC News

Lexi-Rose Crawford, 24, is sentenced to nine years in jail for raping someone while on licence.

www.bbc.com

The 24-year-old was on licence at the time of the attack, having recently been released from prison for a previous sex attack on a child.

Another:
A Male rapist who raped two women, remanded initially in a women’s jail Can you imagine the absolute distortion of thinking by ideology that the State would need to have to even consider this?

Trans woman Isla Bryson jailed for eight years for raping two women | Scotland | The Guardian

Bryson, 31, committed offences in Clydebank and Glasgow in 2016 and 2019 before transitioning

amp.theguardian.com

These are mentally ill, traumatised, offending men- not women. And any ideology, any quasi-religious belief in a gendered soul separate from a biological reality, that leads to male rapists in women’s jails or being referred to as ‘she’ in reports about their crimes against women is disgusting.

Which of you here would consider either of these male rapists a woman?

 

[smokedout]

Shall we start angry posting every time someone from a minority group is convicted of a serious crime? Because that's not bigotry at all, that's just normal. We could have threads full of them. Like Stormfront and places like that do.

 

[krtek a houby]

I will not be calling this male rapist a woman, and I find it deeply disturbing the media does:

Bristol transgender woman jailed for rape - BBC News

Lexi-Rose Crawford, 24, is sentenced to nine years in jail for raping someone while on licence.

www.bbc.com

The 24-year-old was on licence at the time of the attack, having recently been released from prison for a previous sex attack on a child.

Another:
A Male rapist who raped two women, remanded initially in a women’s jail Can you imagine the absolute distortion of thinking by ideology that the State would need to have to even consider this?

Trans woman Isla Bryson jailed for eight years for raping two women | Scotland | The Guardian

Bryson, 31, committed offences in Clydebank and Glasgow in 2016 and 2019 before transitioning

amp.theguardian.com

These are mentally ill, traumatised, offending men- not women. And any ideology, any quasi-religious belief in a gendered soul separate from a biological reality, that leads to male rapists in women’s jails or being referred to as ‘she’ in reports about their crimes against women is disgusting.

Which of you here would consider either of these male rapists a woman?

Why are you doing this?

It's really unhelpful.

 

[Shippou-Sensei]

So on the Aimee Challenor thread

I keep reading that as 'Anime Chancellor' which is off topic but sounds a lot more fun than this thread.

 

[Serge Forward]

Waiting now for posts on people from Pakistani background - therefore grooming gangs... or gay bloke who did a bad thing, so The Gays... or Irish person who, etc... you get the idea...

 

[krtek a houby]

Waiting now for posts on people from Pakistani background - therefore grooming gangs... or gay bloke who did a bad thing, so The Gays... or Irish person who, etc... you get the idea...

It's becoming depressingly commonplace nowadays and it's a fucking shame to see it on urban.

 

[NoXion]

I'm not sure what purpose is served by denying their womanhood, other than bigotry of course. It can't be because women don't commit horrific sexual crimes, because that's obviously nonsense.

 

[Shippou-Sensei]

Sadly not an option for trans people living through this but may be a answer for those who find this thread affecting their blood pressure.

 

[Santino]

'Silence, woman.'

 

[cesare]

'fuck off, bigot'

 

[Rob Ray]

"Disagreeing is silencing. Silencing is oppression. Be silent, oppressor."

Man scare quotes really are great.

 

[liquidindian]

This feels incredibly obvious and basic to say, but we can respect how people want to be seen, even if they've done terrible things, while at the same time not jailing them in certain places if it's assessed that the risk to others is too high.

 

[krtek a houby]

'Silence, woman.'

This is the new automated response to calling out prejudices.

It's like the religious zealots, who wail about being persecuted because their "rights" to discriminate are being "infringed" upon.

"You're oppressing us!'

 

[Edie]

Why are you doing this?

It's really unhelpful.

Because I care about women’s rights.

 

[krtek a houby]

Because I care about women’s rights.

And your way of showing how you care is to display your prejudice?

Again.

 

[Monkeygrinder's Organ]

This is the new automated response to calling out prejudices.

It's like the religious zealots, who wail about being persecuted because their "rights" to discriminate are being "infringed" upon.

"You're oppressing us!'

The anti-trans types are very, very invested in trying to portray any sort of pro-trans stance as a male thing aren't they. To the point that they just ignore any pro-trans cis female voices all the time. The irony is that someone like Santino who'll pop up with that sort of thing every single time is doing exactly what he thinks he's pointing fingers at others for.

 

[Edie]

Y’know, this isn’t healthy. I don’t wanna be around people who argue male rapists are women. It’s so divorced from reality. Men’s feelings should never be more important than women’s lives.

 

[Red Cat]

I'm not sure what purpose is served by denying their womanhood, other than bigotry of course. It can't be because women don't commit horrific sexual crimes, because that's obviously nonsense.

Which horrific sex crimes?

 

[krtek a houby]

Y’know, this isn’t healthy. I don’t wanna be around people who argue male rapists are women. It’s so divorced from reality. Men’s feelings should never be more important than women’s lives.

Doubling down on your hatreds of trans women and posting a diatribe on their gender isn't healthy, either.

What happened is horrible and all rapists and sex offenders should not be able to get away with their crimes.

But then you brought your prejudice against trans women into it.

Which, as pointed out, is really really unhelpful.

 

[littlebabyjesus]

These rapists have committed sexual violence against women in a way that only men can do.

Regarding respecting how people want to be seen, no, I don't think we do always have to do that. For example, in the case of men who rape women who then want to be seen as women, it is not bigotry to challenge that. I agree with Edie that we are in a hopelessly confused place right now when rapists in court are reported to be women and called 'her' and 'she'. 'Women also rape'? 'These particular people are men, not women' is the accurate way to put it in these instances. The vast majority of violent and sexual crimes are committed by men. The 'womanhood' here is the sex of these men's victims.

 

[bimble]

I think Edie’s question, which was do you actually honestly consider this person, referred to as she by the bbc, as a woman, the question is unacceptable because answering it honestly would make people feel bad. The desired pronoun is quite easy for people to do but answering that question is a different thing.

 

[NoXion]

Which horrific sex crimes?

No, you're right, women don't commit sexual offences ever, and therefore anyone who does do that is automatically a man.

 

[NoXion]

These rapists have committed sexual violence against women in a way that only men can do.

...

The vast majority of violent and sexual crimes are committed by men.

Do statistical outliers exist, or don't they? You're contradicting yourself here.

 

[xenon]

Do statistical outliers exist, or don't they? You're contradicting yourself here.

In this case, if I recall they did not transition till after the offence anyway. So the point is moot. Quite obviously they should not be in a women’s jail anyway.

 

[belboid]

can we rename the thread Edie's been to mumsnet again?

 

[Shippou-Sensei]

In this case, if I recall they did not transition till after the offence anyway. So the point is moot. Quite obviously they should not be in a women’s jail anyway.

If they have transitioned would you put them in a mens prison or some form of specialist provision?

 

[Poot]

In this case, if I recall they did not transition till after the offence anyway. So the point is moot. Quite obviously they should not be in a women’s jail anyway.

I can't help feeling the point is moot anyway. Why when we talk about trans issues is it always about this stuff? The suicide rate among young trans people is shockingly high, this stuff says nothing about the lives of pretty much all trans people and it's really not helpful. Or relevant. Or humane.

(Sorry, that was not aimed at you xenon, it was a general grump.)

 

[xenon]

rapists are scum of course. I think bringing up cases of transgender rapists in this context is only going to hurt majority of decent trans people however.

 

[xenon]

If they have transitioned would you put them in a mens prison or some form of specialist provision?

Ideally the latter. They should not be in a women’s prison. You don’t put paedophiles in a school.

 

[xenon]

But yeah let’s not make this about prisons and these outlying offenders. As has been mentioned many times trans people are often the victims of horrific sexual violence as well. Mostly from cis men.