Is India's idea of "fit for human habitation" different from everybody else's?

[southside]

So you think just because of a few problems pre-opening of the games (which opened ON TIME with a spectacular sucessful show) a whole nation "couldnt organise a piss up in a brewery" is not anti ALL of India.

Shall I judge this country on Wembley or The British Library, or the Railway network....ect ect? It would be stupid to do so.

And the wheel was invented by the Sumarians not Indians (btw)

So poor people getting fucked and forced to live in squolar is OK then is it? You got me on the wheel thing I retract my statement on that bit. I judge this country on the Millenium dome.

 

[Streathamite]

Shipbuilding

yes,, as I understand it, India, China and Japan are the daddies in that field

 

[southside]

yes,, as I understand it, INdia, China and JApan are the daddies in that field

You left out call centres.

 

[iROBOT]

So poor people getting fucked and forced to live in squolar is OK then is it? You got me on the wheel thing I retract my statement on that bit. I judge this country on the Millenium dome.

The first point I've answered in a previous post. It's a world wide problem that we in the West contribute to with our excessive lifestyles (yes that means you too).

The bold is where we differ. A country is more than just it's construction projects.

BTW...post up the slum clearence and it consiquences in Delhi if you could. I've googled but not getting anything that relates to this thread and your points (re-shanty town evictions)

 

[Streathamite]

You left out call centres.

I prefer not to pander to national stereotypes

 

[southside]

The first point I've answered in a previous post. It's a world wide problem that we in the West contribute to with our excessive lifestyles (yes that means you too).

The bold is where we differ. A country is more than just it's construction projects.

BTW...post up the slum clearence and it consiquences in Delhi if you could. I've googled but not getting anything that relates to this thread and your points (re-shanty town evictions)

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/w...-as-games-open-in-dazzling-style-2096814.html

Here is a link. Do you think I just made this up?


http://edition.cnn.com/2009/WORLD/asiapcf/01/14/india.slums/index.html


There was a report on the BBC that showed the plight of these people.

 

[GarfieldLeChat]

I have to say - speaking as an IT recruiter - that runs very much contrary to my experience. The indian candidates on HSMP which pass my desk are streets ahead of their British counterparts - and that aplies to developers, analysts, project managers, networking people, you name it.
Also - so how come the huge growth of Wipro, cognizant, reliant infotech, HCL, Tata etc? why is there not one UK hi-tech firm to rank with these? (excepting possibly BT, I grant you)

having some personal experience of the workings of Tata I have so say chap this is a terrible example. largely because their growth is supported by diversification of product line and the massive state hand outs which it receives along with massive breaks or non-existent taxation. Also they were in real financial trouble recently (beginning/ middle of 2008-9) after purchasing Jaguar and landrover.

The company reported a loss of Rs. 2.63 billion, compared to a profit of Rs. 4.99 billion during the third quarter ending December 2007. Tata Motors reported a quarterly loss after a span of seven years. In the December 2008 quarter, Tata Motors' reported a sales volume at 98,760 vehicles as compared to 144,608 vehicles during the corresponding quarter of the previous year. Mentioning the reasons for the company's poor performance, the management said, "In the October-December quarter of the financial year 2008-09, the automotive sector in India suffered severe contraction in demand, arising from major financial and other market upheavals. This exacerbated the lack of liquidity and unavailability of consumer finance

http://www.icmrindia.org/casestudie...trategy/Tata Motors in Trouble-Case Study.htm

http://economictimes.indiatimes.com...pay_vendors_suppliers/articleshow/4078285.cms

Tata Motors had posted a loss of Rs 263 crore for quarter ended December 2008, its first in seven years. The company is negotiating with its suppliers for more time to make payments.

According to automobile industry insiders, the payment problem was aggravated after Tata Motors shifted its Nano car facility to Sanand in Gujarat from Singur in West Bengal. A large number of its vendors had put up factories at the vendor park that was being developed by Tata Motors at Singur. They are now awaiting reimbursements from Tata Motors, which, too, are yet to be paid.

 

[GarfieldLeChat]

The first point I've answered in a previous post. It's a world wide problem that we in the West contribute to with our excessive lifestyles (yes that means you too).

The bold is where we differ. A country is more than just it's construction projects.

BTW...post up the slum clearence and it consiquences in Delhi if you could. I've googled but not getting anything that relates to this thread and your points (re-shanty town evictions)

clearly you know zero about the culture within in india why are you posting on this thread...

 

[iROBOT]

clearly you know zero about the culture within in india why are you posting on this thread...

Really?

So what "culture" would that be then?

 

[iROBOT]

having some personal experience of the workings of Tata I have so say chap this is a terrible example. largely because their growth is supported by diversification of product line and the massive state hand outs which it receives along with massive breaks or non-existent taxation. Also they were in real financial trouble recently (beginning/ middle of 2008-9) after purchasing Jaguar and landrover.



http://www.icmrindia.org/casestudie...trategy/Tata Motors in Trouble-Case Study.htm

http://economictimes.indiatimes.com...pay_vendors_suppliers/articleshow/4078285.cms

This is usless information as it's 2 years old. This was at the time of the global meltdown, which was caused by the West, not Asia. And surprise surprise, an indian company made losses in a World recession. How surprizing.

Now, please lets see you spin it so it's Indias fault.

Should be fun

 

[Dr Jon]

It really has got better over the past 40 years. Ordinary people are living much better lives. This economic boom is here to stay and more people will benifit, not enough I grant you, but that's the case throughout the world not just India.

EDIT to add...Feel free to quote me in ten years time if Indias boom is as crap as you say it is..

Yes, the standard of living has definitely improved in 40 years - for the growing middle class at least. There has been an explosion in 'consumer' wealth (and road traffic!) in just the past decade. Much of this growth is supported by debt, though not to the ludicrous extent seen in the west. I'm pretty sure the boom will end the way they all do - massive bust. India's boom is fuelled by non-renewable resources, most notably petroleum and water, both of which are depleting rapidly. The rich and their wannabes are scrambling to make their fortunes before the shit hits the fan, which it inevitably will.


There are some interesting analyses of India's economy here.

 

[iROBOT]

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/w...-as-games-open-in-dazzling-style-2096814.html

Here is a link. Do you think I just made this up?


http://edition.cnn.com/2009/WORLD/asiapcf/01/14/india.slums/index.html


There was a report on the BBC that showed the plight of these people.

A quote from the top story

There were two Indias on display last night. In the stadium – where weeks of problems and embarrassment over the Games' shambolic preparations were swept aside by an inspirational opening ceremony directed by the veteran movie producer Shyam Benegal – was the India the establishment wished to display to athletes, spectators and millions of viewers.

It was the India of flair and imagination, of first-class technology and channeled energy, a "rising superpower", in the words of Suresh Kalmadi, the organising committee's chairman and the man widely blamed for the stumbles in preparation, who was booed during his welcoming speech.

This was the India proud of its past, proud of its culture, aware of the value of its people. It was the very best of a country bloated with potential and only the mean-spirited would have suggested that the ceremony was not world-class. Even the athletes from India's arch-rival, Pakistan, earned a rousing, big-hearted reception.

But outside the stadium was the India that did not find a place before the television cameras, whose residents were deemed too unsightly not to be hidden from view by special screens. People like Anthony Peter and his wife. The couple have lived in so-called Coolie Camp colony for more than 10 years. Life there is hard: mains electricity came a couple of years ago, but water still has to be pumped by hand from a shared tap or gathered in buckets from a tanker. Earlier this summer, the authorities used bulldozers to crush the cluster of shacks and simple shops from which many of the community's residents scrabbled a living. People feared the heavy machinery would soon come for their homes.

I have no problems with this.

India has many problems that it's trying to solve and rich Westerners saying that they couldnt "organise a piss up...ect" is just plain stupid (really it is).

 

[GarfieldLeChat]

This is usless information as it's 2 years old. This was at the time of the global meltdown, which was caused by the West, not Asia. And surprise surprise, an indian company made losses in a World recession. How surprizing.

Now, please lets see you spin it so it's Indias fault.

Should be fun

erm where have I done any such thing you clot I was backing up my statement that Tata aren't the company to cite when looking at huge growth of India companies as the haven't been successful.

and no Tata's problems weren't entirely caused by the World economic slump.

Why don't you stop posting on this thread as your knowledge is clearly based on 'internet research' ie google rather than a fundamental understand and working practice of the country in question.

that and you can't read what's been posted and are simply looking for an argument.

 

[iROBOT]

Yes, the standard of living has definitely improved in 40 years - for the growing middle class at least. There has been an explosion in 'consumer' wealth (and road traffic!) in just the past decade. Much of this growth is supported by debt, though not to the ludicrous extent seen in the west. I'm pretty sure the boom will end the way they all do - massive bust. India's boom is fuelled by non-renewable resources, most notably petroleum and water, both of which are depleting rapidly. The rich and their wannabes are scrambling to make their fortunes before the shit hits the fan, which it inevitably will.


There are some interesting analyses of India's economy here.

India is locked in the capitalist system, and yes there's debt but it didnt go down the stupid levels allowed in the West as sub-prime market was not allowed that's why India has come out of the reccession in relitive good terms.

 

[southside]

A quote from the top story



I have no problems with this.



India has many problems that it's trying to solve and rich Westerners saying that they couldnt "organise a piss up...ect" is just plain stupid (really it is).

I'm not rich however maybe my turn of phrase was a little over the top. What does ect mean?

 

[iROBOT]

erm where have I done any such thing you clot I was backing up my statement that Tata aren't the company to cite when looking at huge growth of India companies as the haven't been successful.

and no Tata's problems weren't entirely caused by the World economic slump.

Why don't you stop posting on this thread as your knowledge is clearly based on 'internet research' ie google rather than a fundamental understand and working practice of the country in question.

that and you can't read what's been posted and are simply looking for an argument.

I'm against the latent racism on this thread. And I'll carry on against that. Thanks.

 

[iROBOT]

clearly you know zero about the culture within in india why are you posting on this thread...

I ask you again. What is this "culture" in India?

 

[southside]

I'm against the latent racism on this thread. And I'll carry on against that. Thanks.

I wasn't being racist at all in any way shape or form. That's the problem with some of the PC fraternity their deffinitions are ill-informed and some of their statements are offensive.

 

[iROBOT]

I wasn't being racist at all in any way shape or form. That's the problem with some of the PC fraternity their deffinitions are ill-informed and some of their statements are offensive.

Me me me (it's all about you isnt it?)

I was refering to this thread and it's premise that India is a usless country, not YOu.

egotist or what.

 

[GarfieldLeChat]

India has many problems that it's trying to solve and rich Westerners saying that they couldnt "organise a piss up...ect" is just plain stupid (really it is).

I think you'll find there's a lot of indians who also bemoan the difficulties in resolving anything within india too.

For example to get one ambulance station built out there it takes the charity I work with around 3 years of wrangling to get permission to build a partially govt funded building and another up to 5 years to get sufficient funding secured to maintain it to a standard which would allow it to function properly. A not inconsiderable amount of this time is spent with groups of people across the board at all levels who are simply not able to do anythign without a massively complicated and often unnecessary level of bureaucracy.

And I love the place will move out there eventually, if it weren't for the mrs's illness we'd be living there now, as I happen to think it's the best place on earth.

but to say that there isn't a culture of things happen when they happen in india is utterly naive and entirely wrong.

 

[iROBOT]

I think you'll find there's a lot of indians who also bemoan the difficulties in resolving anything within india too.

For example to get one ambulance station built out there it takes the charity I work with around 3 years of wrangling to get permission to build a partially govt funded building and another up to 5 years to get sufficient funding secured to maintain it to a standard which would allow it to function properly. A not inconsiderable amount of this time is spent with groups of people across the board at all levels who are simply not able to do anythign without a massively complicated and often unnecessary level of bureaucracy.
And I love the place will move out there eventually, if it weren't for the mrs's illness we'd be living there now, as I happen to think it's the best place on earth.

but to say that there isn't a culture of things happen when they happen in india is utterly naive and entirely wrong.

So you're a tourist then?

And your little "story". damn you'r right India's so shite it deserves the hate dished out on this thread.

 

[GarfieldLeChat]

So your a tourist then?

lolsome...

no son but you've clearly never lived out there or built anything out there...

you do realise that culture on this thread is talking about behaviour and not people right...

I mean your single braincell can process that theres a dual meaning to the word...

 

[GarfieldLeChat]

also are you dyslexic.

cos you're simply not reading what's being written at all.

 

[iROBOT]

lolsome...

no son but you've clearly never lived out there or built anything out there...

you do realise that culture on this thread is talking about behaviour and not people right...

I mean your single braincell can process that theres a dual meaning to the word...

My families built MANY things in India (over the past 2000+ years or so). What have you built?

And behavour is diffrent to culture, ther I'll have no disagreements things could better, but to callit a "culture" therefore hard to change is utterly wrong.

 

[GarfieldLeChat]

My families built MANY things in India. What have you built?

learn to read thicko...

ambulance stations...

 

[iROBOT]

also are you dyslexic.

cos you're simply not reading what's being written at all.

Call it post colonial hate.

 

[iROBOT]

learn to read thicko...

ambulance stations...

You said "built anything". I answered with the truth.

Bully for you and you "charity" I'm sure it makes you feel better about yourself.

 

[southside]

Me me me (it's all about you isnt it?)

I was refering to this thread and it's premise that India is a usless country, not YOu.

egotist or what.

I just found it difficult deciphering your garbled gibberish thats all.

 

[GarfieldLeChat]

So you're a tourist then?

And your little "story". damn you'r right India's so shite it deserves the hate dished out on this thread.

cheeky fucking edit after it's prioved you're not reading posts and simply knee jerking around the place...

how very dishonest of you...

and I don't see hate on this thread except from you son and your inability to READ what's being written before instantly going off on some mental they've got it in for india stance...

your responses are very revealing about your attitude towards the place however as all that's been displayed so far is that in your not actually reading the posts is your own blind prejudices about the place.

 

[iROBOT]

cheeky fucking edit after it's prioved you're not reading posts and simply knee jerking around the place...

how very dishonest of you...

and I don't see hate on this thread except from you son and your inability to READ what's being written before instantly going off on some mental they've got it in for india stance...

your responses are very revealing about your attitude towards the place however as all that's been displayed so far is that in your not actually reading the posts is your own blind prejudices about the place.

Yup 200 years of built up hate.

Deal with it Western do-gooder.