International Mens Day
- Thread starter Kesher
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Johnny Vodka
The Abominable Scotsman
Hmm. I wouldn't really describe it like that - maybe some blame out for 'out there', but also a lot of self loathing for stuff I can't change. But I think you at least know what I'm referring to.
Orang Utan
Psychick Worrier Ov Geyoor
^^^^^^
this, entirely this
Johnny Vodka
The Abominable Scotsman
IYO. As it happens, my best mate is fucked up, possibly even more so than I am (
), and has gone through counselling, etc, but nothing's really changed. His answer now seems to be a retreat, be more self-sufficient, not to need anyone, etc. Stuff that happens to you in childhood/adolescence can be really hard to shake, especially if life fails on several fronts.
Orang Utan
Psychick Worrier Ov Geyoor
you don't give up just cos you get to a certain age. there's always potential for changeIYO. As it happens, my best mate is fucked up, possibly even more so than I am (
weltweit
Well-Known Member
I think a lot of people feel that way - perhaps when they are not in a couple. And perhaps not socialising very much. And the more you think about it the worse it gets, that feeling.
But focussing on rejection or acceptance is I think an issue in itself. It is almost saying that if you are not in a relationship you are somehow less worthy. Or that if you are getting rejections you are less worthy. That just isn't the case.
And this rejection thing, so it means you are asking, but not getting the response you hoped for, I can imagine that would be tough on the ego. There are other ways.
DotCommunist
So many particulars. So many questions.
this whole album is sick. Its the second best Dire Straits after Love Over Gold. Although Telegraph Road deserves a shout too
Johnny Vodka
The Abominable Scotsman
I've not given up. I've developed alternative coping strategies. There's probably a lot more energy (holidays, time to exercise, time to watch films, etc) in my life than that of the many people I know who have settled down and had kids. But, yeah, sometimes, if I don't keep myself busy, I feel those pangs of not having someone.
Orang Utan
Psychick Worrier Ov Geyoor
and no time to work on your own attitudes to yourself?
Johnny Vodka
The Abominable Scotsman
Lost cause, mate. I get some sort of confidence/buzz through running and stuff, but it's really not going to carry over into other aspects of my life. I can fake it enough just to get by, as in work and socialise.
Orang Utan
Psychick Worrier Ov Geyoor
well then there's no hope
DotCommunist
So many particulars. So many questions.
and theres something beguiling about the idea of armed comradeship that was not healthy, I can pick a similar destrucive theme from Sons of Anarchy. Its something that has long troubled me, brotherhood should not be destructive. It should not be based on shared loss and that drive, whatever that drive can be called. It should be better than the slime you get in biker gang ferocity or the neccesity and anger of a partisan revenge outfit (obvs there were female partisans but y get where I am coming from)
e2a I'm not smearing partisans as evil here, the 'neccesity' bit is important
e2a I'm not smearing partisans as evil here, the 'neccesity' bit is important
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mauvais
on reddit or something
IME you can change most things about yourself, whenever you like to boot. You don't have one life-on-rails you're inescapably stuck living, just inertia that keeps you doing what you're doing, right or wrong.
Some things you shouldn't compromise, because this is sound advice:
But some you should, especially because it's self-reinforcing and produces the very outcomes you hate.
BTW I'm getting married next year as if my hopeless teens & 20s never even happened.
Poot
My wife thinks I work too hard
I don't think it's too late. Have you tried speaking to a GP about your low mood? I know that you say you have coping strategies but I'm not sure they're making you happy. I mean, maybe in the short term, but longer term maybe you could try some sort of counselling or therapy? You are important and you do need to look after yourself. I don't believe you're a lost cause.
Johnny Vodka
The Abominable Scotsman
Coz you keep going on about it.
We should get back to discussing the wider themes of IMD.
me and everyone else giving you advice cus you raised the issue like you wanted to do something about it
Johnny Vodka
The Abominable Scotsman
Nah, trust me, way too much shit in my head - goes well beyond just rejection by the opposite sex. I'd rather just try and manage the life I have. Most people in relationships don't have it all rosy anyway. When I think about it, my life probably ain't too bad, as long as I focus on the now and what interests me.
weltweit
Well-Known Member
Speaking up for yourself at work is one type of confidence, and the ability to socialise another. I have always been amazed at the difference in my work colleagues when they were out of the workplace. Some who were absolute wall flowers in business meetings became the life and soul of the party down the pub. How does that work?
You can build confidence in specific situations, and part of that is gentle immersion into the situation, a bit more perhaps each time.
I wonder about putting energy into the dating scene? especially if you have been getting lots of rejections. There are other ways to meet people. The only advantage I see in dating is that you at least know the other party should be up for it if you click. In real life you will meet a lot of nice people who are already taken.
Orang Utan
Psychick Worrier Ov Geyoor
you are rejecting yourself
bluescreen
tofu eating wokerati
Johnny Vodka it's saddening to read your posts. Maybe it's worth focusing elsewhere for a bit? Forget about coupledom, just concentrate on being sociable generally, relaxing with other people. Women aren't special, they aren't another species. Old men, young men, older women - people you regard as off-limits - won't reject you, because they won't be afraid of you hitting on them. It's a good place to practise being your natural self, without pressure. It may sound boring but all these people can be interesting if you listen to them and engage with them. Funnily enough, young women are the same. (You just need to get over the Oh God I Need It hurdle.)
Johnny Vodka
The Abominable Scotsman
It's not like I've never got laid. Went through a relatively promiscuous period in my late 20s/early 30s, but I'm not sure I was particularly honest with people... It was something I had to do and don't exactly regret, but I don't think I could act that way now... Hence the total dearth of interest for a long time.
weltweit
Well-Known Member
As was suggested above I would focus on being sociable, meeting all sorts of people and enjoying their company and yourself, also joining things, never a bad idea, you never know, things might get better on their own.
Johnny Vodka
The Abominable Scotsman
I'm the 1st to go out when the opportunity arises. Sadly, colleagues only go out occasionally, friends have families, i can't get dates and the local meet up group is shit. I'll happily go on holiday alone (and meet up with peeps on my yearly jaunt to ibiza) and need to get back into going to gigs - on my own, tho. I'm satisfied that i put the effort in.
bluescreen
tofu eating wokerati
Good to hear you put the effort in. Never mind dates. Still pressing you on things like politics - are you involved locally? The gift that keeps on giving, surely? Or, less controversially: camera club, book club, history society, wine tasting (OK, I'm making it up). Politics, though - surely there is room to engage there? Surely you aren't one of Eric Berne's stereotypes.
Vintage Paw
dead stare and computer glare
Not related to the feelings Johnny has, but I can say from personal experience that while this is true, it can be incredibly difficult to get your head in a place where you believe it. Particularly if you suffer from depression. Sometimes your current position and circumstances feel like 4 lead walls closed tightly around you.
I had a breakthrough once, where I managed to pull myself out of depression. You know people say "it was like a weight lifted off my shoulders"? There's never been a more apt saying. I could almost physically feel it lift. But what it taught me was that it can't happen until all the necessary pieces are in place, and you can't force them to be in place. You can work at them, and indeed you must do. But until something triggers that thing in your brain to 'click' you can't simply will yourself to feel or think differently.
Having sunk back into depression again, I think a lot about what got me out of it last time. But knowing what worked that time doesn't help in the slightest this time because my head isn't just quite there yet. There's something missing to enable that 'click' - and I don't know what that something is. I wish I did.
Anyway, what I'm saying is that while I disagree with Johnny on a very fundamental level with almost everything he says and does, I absolutely understand the feeling of not being able to break out of a certain mindset - and that includes believing whether you can change or not.
It's very difficult to understand what it means to have that 'click' moment - and therefore to also understand what it is to be unable to have it - if you've not experienced it yourself. It's not about saying the trigger is external to you - in my case it required me making a decision to do a particular thing with my life, and of course I didn't know that would be the trigger until it happened - and of course you have to keep working at stuff in the meantime, but some stuff is difficult to work on, and some is impossible to work on until that moment has come.
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