Griffin and BNP strategy

[The Black Hand]

Just glanced at the BNP %s in the election I make it about 60 wards where they polled over 10%. approx anpother 20 wards where either EDP, EFP, NF or any of the splinter groups got over 10%.

It is also true that the levels of the BNP vote have declined significantly. Generally in all wards and also in what can be seen as target wards - Down from relatively high 20%+ to under 20% in many of these wards.

That is not to say the general political situation has moved in our favour, it looks like the far right splinter and small groups are becoming more effective, & the general right wing conservative culture continues.

 

[The39thStep]

It is also true that the levels of the BNP vote have declined significantly. Generally in all wards and also in what can be seen as target wards - Down from relatively high 20%+ to under 20% in many of these wards.

That is not to say the general political situation has moved in our favour, it looks like the far right splinter and small groups are becoming more effective, & the general right wing conservative culture continues.

remarkably sane point if underwhelming

 

[TremulousTetra]

So what argument are you making with reference to "the lesson of history" (unity and the lack thereof) that you want us to learn? You explain what point you're trying to make, or people will probably assume that you're calling for "the rest of the left" to unite under the SWP's guiding hand to fight fascism and achieve revolution.

lol no.

 

[ViolentPanda]

lol no.

Your reply makes no sense, you doughnut.

No change there, then.

 

[LLETSA]

That is not to say the general political situation has moved in our favour, it looks like the far right splinter and small groups are becoming more effective, & the general right wing conservative culture continues.

Regardless of the rights and wrongs of anything else you might say, the general right wing conservative culture you refer to is imaginary. Culturally, there is no way that contemporary Britain could be considered right wing.

 

[The Black Hand]

Regardless of the rights and wrongs of anything else you might say, the general right wing conservative culture you refer to is imaginary. Culturally, there is no way that contemporary Britain could be considered right wing.

Nonsense. There were authentic independent cultures in the UK in the 19th century, working class cultures in the 20th, but now largely the cultural machine has been infested by capitalism, and what passes for politics is very capitalist status quo. In what sense can Britain NOT be right wing? It certainly doesn't encourage working class political change.

There is a liberal ethos true, but I didn't think you would like them Letty, and Littlejohn really slagged them in todays Mail - 'The 4 areas of the country which voted for Av were Guardianista heaven - Oxford, Cambridge etc'. Its certainly small enough and politically insignificant at present, and likely to be squeezed further in these 'class against class times' (the feel and spirit of the present age).

So, at the very best your comment is misleading, and there is enough evidence to plainly say that you are wrong here Letsa.Apologies.

 

[The39thStep]

Beggars belief that being 'liberal' and for AV is somehow seen by you as being a rallying point against the system. Britain is a capitalist system with a total lack of economic democracy but a strong emphasis on individual rights . Ironically the latter underpins the the former.

 

[Pickman's model]

Beggars belief that being 'liberal' and for AV is somehow seen by you as being a rallying point against the system. Britain is a capitalist system with a total lack of economic democracy but a strong emphasis on individual rights . Ironically the latter underpins the the former.

i don't think he said that

 

[The Black Hand]

i don't think he said that

Quite right Pickman.

 

[LLETSA]

Nonsense. There were authentic independent cultures in the UK in the 19th century, working class cultures in the 20th, but now largely the cultural machine has been infested by capitalism, and what passes for politics is very capitalist status quo. In what sense can Britain NOT be right wing? It certainly doesn't encourage working class political change.

There is a liberal ethos true, but I didn't think you would like them Letty, and Littlejohn really slagged them in todays Mail - 'The 4 areas of the country which voted for Av were Guardianista heaven - Oxford, Cambridge etc'. Its certainly small enough and politically insignificant at present, and likely to be squeezed further in these 'class against class times' (the feel and spirit of the present age).

So, at the very best your comment is misleading, and there is enough evidence to plainly say that you are wrong here Letsa.Apologies.

Capitalism doesn't necessary equal a right-wing culture, and by no stretch of the imagination do we have one in this country right now. As we are seeing, there can be a liberal cultural climate that's even less conducive to 'working class political change,' than a conservative one. In fact, most of the left, having quietly given up the attempt at an alternative to capitalism, is focused on 'defending' liberal Britain.

So it's actually you that's wrong. Again.

 

[LLETSA]

Beggars belief that being 'liberal' and for AV is somehow seen by you as being a rallying point against the system. Britain is a capitalist system with a total lack of economic democracy but a strong emphasis on individual rights . Ironically the latter underpins the the former.

And most people, regardless of what they believe politically, now subscribe to a phoney, media-prompted individualism. Just look at the way even the self-styled radical libertarians on boards like this simply repeat the commonplace notions of the day.

 

[The39thStep]

Quite right Pickman.

 

[The39thStep]

The BNP statement on their election results was actually quite amusing , it begins 'Let's be honest. The results for the British National Party in the recent election were pretty dire.' and then goes on to say 'Bad though our results were, can you imagine how you would feel if you were a Liberal Democrat?'

 

[The Black Hand]

Capitalism doesn't necessary equal a right-wing culture, and by no stretch of the imagination do we have one in this country right now. As we are seeing, there can be a liberal cultural climate that's even less conducive to 'working class political change,' than a conservative one. In fact, most of the left, having quietly given up the attempt at an alternative to capitalism, is focused on 'defending' liberal Britain.

So it's actually you that's wrong. Again.

Sorry letsa, we disagree. What liberal cultural climate there is, exists alongside a right wing one, you are just in denial, focusing to heavily on your usual target, the crap left. Its plainly wrong to dismiss the imperial and racist right wing climate that clearly exists.

 

[The Black Hand]

Thats U and letty!

 

[LLETSA]

Sorry letsa, we disagree. What liberal cultural climate there is, exists alongside a right wing one, you are just in denial, focusing to heavily on your usual target, the crap left. Its plainly wrong to dismiss the imperial and racist right wing climate that clearly exists.

I'm not denying that right-wing sentiment exists; I just don't think it's culturally dominant.

And plenty of people are racist or supportive of, for example, British military interventions without being particularly right wing in any meaningful sense.

 

[sihhi]

And most people, regardless of what they believe politically, now subscribe to a phoney, media-prompted individualism. Just look at the way even the self-styled radical libertarians on boards like this simply repeat the commonplace notions of the day.

You mean like the right of individuals to smoke the tobacco they've bought in pubs?

 

[past caring]

 

[Spanky Longhorn]

He shoots he scores

 

[The39thStep]

Apparantly BNP are now anti tesco as well as being anti war.

 

[MellySingsDoom]

Apparantly BNP are now anti tesco as well as being anti war.

They've probably jumped back on the "Tesco Jews" bandwagon as beloved by anti-Semites and conspiraloons. Now what are the chances of that happening?

 

[The39thStep]

They've probably jumped back on the "Tesco Jews" bandwagon as beloved by anti-Semites and conspiraloons. Now what are the chances of that happening?

The are playing it with a straight bat of protecting local traders etc etc. There isn't much mileage in blatant anti semitism for the BNP.

 

[MellySingsDoom]

The are playing it with a straight bat of protecting local traders etc etc. There isn't much mileage in blatant anti semitism for the BNP.

This being the BNP who've got a piss poor record with not paying local suppliers, services and so on? Oh dear. I know the general public aren't in on the BNP's Arthur Daley-like dealings, but still....well, we'll see how successful their "local trade" campaign is in due course.

 

[LLETSA]

You mean like the right of individuals to smoke the tobacco they've bought in pubs?

No, I mean that people's attitudes generally are off-the-peg. How can it possibly be otherwise when we all compulsorily drink from the same trough?

 

[Pickman's model]

No, I mean that people's attitudes generally are off-the-peg. How can it possibly be otherwise when we all compulsorily drink from the same trough?

oh dear. i took you off ignore thinking there may have been some improvement in your posts. not much of a surprise but still something of a disappointment.

 

[MellySingsDoom]

Quick heads-up for the Urbans - this is strictly minor-league fare really, but these two videos show the "interesting" relationships amongst the BNP "top table" - meltdown, anyone? (They are lengthy videos, by the way):

 

[Fedayn]

Quick heads-up for the Urbans - this is strictly minor-league fare really, but these two videos show the "interesting" relationships amongst the BNP "top table" - meltdown, anyone? (They are lengthy videos, by the way):

That sounds very much like Richard Edmunds at the back asking about the plenary session during the 1st video.

 

[love detective]

looks like him as well!

 

[Fedayn]

looks like him as well!

Doesn't it just..... Hadn't got to that part...

 

[Fedayn]

That's quite an interesting meeting....