hipipol
Peckham Wry
No doubt the embassy were on their asses with "this is not confirmed...." bullshit within seconds of version one going up
Gaza under attack yet again.
- Thread starter Mr.Bishie
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coley
Well-Known Member
Aye, because the surrounding Arab nations would know exactly what would happen to them once the displaced Palestinians started launching revenge attacks from their new 'homelands'
ViolentPanda
Hardly getting over it.
Is it ridiculous of me to hope that the huge impact that Twitter has had on getting information out, as it happens, may make any sort of a difference to the opportunities the Israeli and US govt's have in their repeated attempts to lie about what is happening and when?
Just that that information is now available for far more people to see than it ever would've been previously and that it IS changing people's minds (as we've seen on this thread even).
It just doesn't seem like anything else but pressure from the few international governments who have actually taken action against Israel, by expelling diplomats etc - and pressure from the public in those countries where their governments have either avoided involvement or actively assisted Israel - will stop them.
I'm sure I'm being totally naive - but *the power of Twitter* has struck me frequently over the last few weeks.
While I think that social media has definitely added an arm to protest that disperses info and comment unmediated by "the system", there's still a huge weight of inertia (mostly caused by the interests of the powerful, and their walking in step with the media) as well as actively-partial "news management" (Regev himself is merely a manifestation of putting a public face to manipulation that arguably started with Desert Storm and the Yugoslavian mess) that needs to be overcome.
But yeah, quick and detailed rebuttal of government lines in the form of "insider" reportage is a great antidote to the Big Lie.
ViolentPanda
Hardly getting over it.
The filter system that is, in reality, anything but natural.
framed
Leave it!
It's more likely that a huge increase in the Palestinian refugee population of Arab countries would cause them more internal political problems, in addition to external pressure from Israel (the Palestinians are generally more politically radical than the populations of their Arab neighbours, as a direct result of their experience). This was the result in Jordan and Lebanon in the 1970's/80's when a radicalised Palestinian movement based itself first in Jordan (only to be drowned in blood by the Jordanian Army). After that bloodbath the PLO leadership moved its centre of operations to Lebanon where a similar 'dual power' situation developed...
ViolentPanda
Hardly getting over it.
Well, you'd think that would be the prinicple reason, wouldn't you?
In reality, though, at least half the reason that the neighbouring states haven't done so isn't to do with not wanting to be militarily-assaulted for harbouring terrorists, it's been about keeping Palestinians, who have a secular Muslim heritage, as well as (even now) a higher general standard of education (for both sexes), away from their Syrian, Jordanian and Egyptian brothers and sisters, to whom they might pass on dangerous ideas about rebellion, revolution and the like, or even worse, whom they might train in the "dark arts" of working-class insurgency.
ViolentPanda
Hardly getting over it.
Barking_Mad
Non sibi sed omnibus
Blockade of Gaza
270,000 refugees
1,735 Palestinians dead
6,500+ injured
Power Station bombed (last in Gaza)
2 Water Plants bombed (2/3 without clean water)
138 schools bombed
17 hospitals attacked (10 closed down)
36 ambulances attacked
37 Mosques completely destroyed
81 Mosques badly damaged
1 university bombed
TV station bombed
Incremental genocide.
270,000 refugees
1,735 Palestinians dead
6,500+ injured
Power Station bombed (last in Gaza)
2 Water Plants bombed (2/3 without clean water)
138 schools bombed
17 hospitals attacked (10 closed down)
36 ambulances attacked
37 Mosques completely destroyed
81 Mosques badly damaged
1 university bombed
TV station bombed
Incremental genocide.
sheothebudworths
Up the bum - no babies!!!
Cheers for answering that, VP.
I suppose I was thinking generally that it's just exposed many more people to the truth of what is happening - and that it's happening at all for many - but also, specifically, re the Israeli claim that the clash which saw the IDF soldier go 'missing' could not be so easily passed off as having occurred after the ceasefire started, when it was already documented on Twitter, as it was happening, well before the 8am start.
I'm sure it means fuck all in the end when they're so blatantly flouting international law on so many levels - and with the U.S. in particular so steadfastly supporting them in all of that - but as you say, it's still added *something* that wasn't previously so freely available to so many people and that can't have no effect.
I know I'm maybe just clutching at straws though.
ETA - Of course I do see what you're saying re the manipulation of news, which ALSO reaches far greater numbers of people, too - and how that might well counter against any positives that social media offers.
Barking_Mad
Non sibi sed omnibus
I think its fair to say lots of people who in the past wouldn't have thought twice about supporting Israel now don't do so, or have shifted towards criticising them, but with caveats about Hamas.
There's certain a much greater public sympathy for the Palestinian cause. How that translates into real life is debatable though.
There's certain a much greater public sympathy for the Palestinian cause. How that translates into real life is debatable though.
ViolentPanda
Hardly getting over it.
They "know", do they? You certainly seem to.
sheothebudworths
Up the bum - no babies!!!
Yep, that's it.
Pickman's model
Starry Wisdom
i have someone else to pat me on the back for occasions such as thisIs your shoulder aching from patting yourself on the back?
It's worse than that. In 2008 political scientist Steffen Hertog and sociology professor Diego Gambetta found a disproportionate number of engineers among a sample of "404 people from 30 countries engaged in political violence".
The result was, of course a fatwa-equivalent against them from engineering organisations
Hertog and Gambetta said:
That would work for revisionist Zionism as well as it appears to work for Islamism. A drive for "neat" solutions and a desire to expel complexity and "messiness".
Limerick Red
Мы вас похороним!
Latest PFLP communique includes:
The strong position will not be forgotten, of the tens of thousands of
people in the streets of France, London, Austria, Belgium, Romania,
Denmark, Germany, Chile, Brazil, Chicago, Canada and all the cities of the
world, nor to the consistent solidarity of those in Latin America who have
also struggled against imperialism for many years. It is a victory for
Palestine to see the masses of the world condemning the Zionist aggression
on Gaza, the massacres and the killing of children. It is urgently needed
for you to escalate and continue your support for the cause of Palestine
and its people, to put serious pressure on your government and to escalate
the boycott of the occupation state; to surround and occupy the consulates,
embassies and business offices of the occupier, and to bring its officials
before international courts as war criminals.
Latest Abu Ali Mustafa Brigade actions:
The Abu Ali Mustafa Brigades, the armed wing of the Popular Front for the
Liberation of Palestine, continued its confrontation of the Zionist troops
and settlements on the outskirts of Gaza, causing casualties in the ranks
of the occupation soldiers.
The fighters engaged in fierce battles with improvised weapons at medium
and short distances with invading forces on the outskirts of Gaza.
The report of the brigades as follows:
Wednesday, July 30:
Targeting military forces east of Shujaiya with 2 mortar rounds at 5:20 pm
Sniping troops in the vicinity of the dome east of Shujaiya, injuring them
directly at 11:30 am
Fierce clashes since dawn with occupation forces east of Khan Younis
Targeting Bir Saba with 2 missiles at 4:50 am.
Tuesday, July 29:
Abu Ali Mustafa Brigades and AbdelQader al-Husseini Brigades targeting
Kerem Abu Salem with 107 missiles at 4:40 PM, blaring sirens and
helicopters landing to evacuate wounded soldiers
Bombing military forces in Kerem Abu Salem with three mortar shells at 1:00
PM
Bombarding Eshkol settlement with 107 missiles at 12:00 PM
Targeting troop concentrations east of Zeitoun with three mortar shells at
9:21 AM
Targeting military site with 107 missiles at 10:30 AM
Abu Ali Mustafa Brigades and AbdelQader al-Husseini Brigades fired seven
Grad rockets at 12:25 AM
Monday, July 28:
Targeting enemy forces gathered near Kerem Abu Salem with three mortar
shells at 8:20 PM
Targeting Eshkol and Sderot with two missiles at 6:50 PM
Firing three rockets at Nahal Oz at 5:30 PM
In a joint action with AbdelQader al-Husseini Brigades, targeting Kerem Abu
Selem with missiles at 3:00 PM
Sunday, July 27:
Sniping Zionist soldier in eastern Gaza at 1:42 PM
Firing a missile on Eshkol settlement, 1:00 PM
Targeting a settlement with a rocket at 1:10 AM
In a joint action with AbdelQader al-Husseini Brigades, targeting Karem Abu
Salem with missiles at 12:55 AM
Saturday, July 26
Bombing of a military compound in Eshkol with 2 missiles at 8:25 PM
In a joint action with AbdelQader al-Husseini Brigades, targeting a
military site at Sofa crossing at 12:50 PM
The strong position will not be forgotten, of the tens of thousands of
people in the streets of France, London, Austria, Belgium, Romania,
Denmark, Germany, Chile, Brazil, Chicago, Canada and all the cities of the
world, nor to the consistent solidarity of those in Latin America who have
also struggled against imperialism for many years. It is a victory for
Palestine to see the masses of the world condemning the Zionist aggression
on Gaza, the massacres and the killing of children. It is urgently needed
for you to escalate and continue your support for the cause of Palestine
and its people, to put serious pressure on your government and to escalate
the boycott of the occupation state; to surround and occupy the consulates,
embassies and business offices of the occupier, and to bring its officials
before international courts as war criminals.
Latest Abu Ali Mustafa Brigade actions:
The Abu Ali Mustafa Brigades, the armed wing of the Popular Front for the
Liberation of Palestine, continued its confrontation of the Zionist troops
and settlements on the outskirts of Gaza, causing casualties in the ranks
of the occupation soldiers.
The fighters engaged in fierce battles with improvised weapons at medium
and short distances with invading forces on the outskirts of Gaza.
The report of the brigades as follows:
Wednesday, July 30:
Targeting military forces east of Shujaiya with 2 mortar rounds at 5:20 pm
Sniping troops in the vicinity of the dome east of Shujaiya, injuring them
directly at 11:30 am
Fierce clashes since dawn with occupation forces east of Khan Younis
Targeting Bir Saba with 2 missiles at 4:50 am.
Tuesday, July 29:
Abu Ali Mustafa Brigades and AbdelQader al-Husseini Brigades targeting
Kerem Abu Salem with 107 missiles at 4:40 PM, blaring sirens and
helicopters landing to evacuate wounded soldiers
Bombing military forces in Kerem Abu Salem with three mortar shells at 1:00
PM
Bombarding Eshkol settlement with 107 missiles at 12:00 PM
Targeting troop concentrations east of Zeitoun with three mortar shells at
9:21 AM
Targeting military site with 107 missiles at 10:30 AM
Abu Ali Mustafa Brigades and AbdelQader al-Husseini Brigades fired seven
Grad rockets at 12:25 AM
Monday, July 28:
Targeting enemy forces gathered near Kerem Abu Salem with three mortar
shells at 8:20 PM
Targeting Eshkol and Sderot with two missiles at 6:50 PM
Firing three rockets at Nahal Oz at 5:30 PM
In a joint action with AbdelQader al-Husseini Brigades, targeting Kerem Abu
Selem with missiles at 3:00 PM
Sunday, July 27:
Sniping Zionist soldier in eastern Gaza at 1:42 PM
Firing a missile on Eshkol settlement, 1:00 PM
Targeting a settlement with a rocket at 1:10 AM
In a joint action with AbdelQader al-Husseini Brigades, targeting Karem Abu
Salem with missiles at 12:55 AM
Saturday, July 26
Bombing of a military compound in Eshkol with 2 missiles at 8:25 PM
In a joint action with AbdelQader al-Husseini Brigades, targeting a
military site at Sofa crossing at 12:50 PM
You skipped steps 1), 2) and 3)
http://jewssansfrontieres.blogspot.co.uk/2008/07/how-to-make-case-for-israel-and-win.html
DrRingDing
'anti-human wanker'
More calls for genocide....
http://electronicintifada.net/blogs...parliament-deputy-speakers-gaza-genocide-plan
http://electronicintifada.net/blogs...parliament-deputy-speakers-gaza-genocide-plan
agricola
a genuine importer of owls
A somewhat similar, albeit slightly more subtle, piece appeared on Fox's website a couple of days ago. That Bibi is just too soft, you see.
Gingerman
Is a great bunch of lads.....
Israel had plenty of chances to negotiate and come to some sort of fair settlement with the PLO in the past,instead they humilated,belittled and assainated their leaders.Even when Arafat and the PLO reconised Israel the Pals got fuck all out of it,thats why Hamas came to power in Gaza,if they're not careful the Israelis could have the likes of Isis on their doorstep in the near future......
Well - that'd definitely stave off the threat of peace for a generation and guarantee the career of anyone just starting out in rightwing politics or the armed forces.
Also, it'd leave Israel fighting an enemy that would arouse nearly equal revulsion.
Seems like a plan for the Revisionist Zionists
I think Israel is a very frightened nation. That is why they are striking hard and fatally at Gaza. With what is happening in Syria and Iran they fear that the radical Islamists will form a massive coalition big enough to strike at Israel with more than a few puny home made rockets. It is fear that drives Israel to extremism; they know that their propaganda machine only works in America and Britain at the top political level in right wing circles. They know that the independent internet media are not fooled and that the word is out.The world's playground bully is frightened and dangerous.
DotCommunist
So many particulars. So many questions.
ISIS have made ground precisely because they've seized territory in a region with a weak state and a half hearted military. If they decided to try testing the vastly better equipped and ideologically secure IDF they'd be handed their arses.
Of course they aren't going to repeat the zip-across-the-desert-in-pickups tactic.
But I think they'd be quite adept at explosions in Tel Aviv, for example.
I'll have to get very drunk now: otherwise I'll have to turn my brain in for containing information useful to a terrorist
bubblesmcgrath
Well-Known Member
http://www.jpost.com/Operation-Prot...hould-stop-Israels-desire-for-genocide-369899
existentialist
Tired and unemotional
Any help with debunking this
would be most gratefully received. Yeah, I've got into a FB argument with a "friend" who is happily spewing this propaganda, and I feel inclined to engage with it at least for a short while...
would be most gratefully received. Yeah, I've got into a FB argument with a "friend" who is happily spewing this propaganda, and I feel inclined to engage with it at least for a short while...
agricola
a genuine importer of owls
TBH I think the problem is more that they arent frightened, rather than that they are. The Israeli leadership are striking at Gaza and openly talking about ethnic cleansing it (to put the best spin on it) because they think they can get away with that in a way that they never would have been able to in the past.
Doctor Carrot
Marxist Henchman
Surely you can just say it's no different from the Donald Duck etc propaganda cartoons of old that taught kids to punch blacks and Russians? Probably to shoot them too. The only difference is it wasn't as blatant as the video shown here but still the same point was being put across.
Of course you are entitled to make your own judgement of Israel's motivation but I fear that you are wrong.
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