brogdale
Coming to terms with late onset Anarchism
Funny to see Labour right-wingers piling-in to demand that Labour "atone for its past... especially on the economy". I wonder what part(s) of the Blair/Brown economic record they have in mind?
Corbyn & Cabinet in the Media
- Thread starter ska invita
- Start date
teqniq
DisMembered
Well yes but the report is a bit all over the shop when on the one hand it's quoted as saying that Labour are indistinguishable from the Tories north of the border and on the other they are not to be trusted on the economy. Also seen to be soft on benefit claimants and the 'hard-working families' meme pops up again. It's like the report is almost in places telling sections of the party what they want to hear.
nino_savatte
No pasaran!
The "soft on benefits claimants" line comes straight from the media. The "not to be trusted on the economy" line is Tory-driven but also assumes that the Tories are better at managing the nation's economy. We know this isn't true and sadly, your average news consumer is absolutely clueless about economics, and doesn't realise that it isn't the neutral academic discipline that it's often portrayed as.
I often wonder how these reports are written. Do they actually conduct proper research (the Tories don't and we know this) or do they just pull whatever prejudiced crap happens to be lying around in their heads, gather it up and present it as hard evidence (the Tories always do this)? We do so love our confirmation biases, don't we?
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The 'scrounger' notion is an article of faith for all Blairites and many on the right of the party, I recall discussing this with John Battle (ex LP MP) and he said that the "PLP was obsessed with welfare". They have no self awareness that they themselves have created/shaped the public mood(which i don't think is as punitive as they make out) through a systematic campaign to demonise the unemployed, disabled people. I do think that the non labour left, the sort that we see on mass Syria/Anti-Austerity demos, etc could have done much much more to counter this narrative though.
Artaxerxes
Look out, he's got a gnu!
I think this is something that needs nailing home
On social media, his supporters curse rebellious Labour MPs and a hostile media for turning the public against him, but even if these complaints aren’t entirely unfounded it’s besides the point. Wringing your hands over what could have been won’t make the actual situation any less bleak.
On social media, his supporters curse rebellious Labour MPs and a hostile media for turning the public against him, but even if these complaints aren’t entirely unfounded it’s besides the point. Wringing your hands over what could have been won’t make the actual situation any less bleak.
likesfish
You can't park here sir
I think corbyn needs to rethink his falklands policy.
Islanders don't want links with argentina.
Argentina has done zero in anyway to apologize for the invasion or even attempt to build any bridges at all they walked away in a huff from the only joint declaration on oil and fishery and did everything in their way to cause problems.
Argentina is already rich in resources and lands the islanders arnt of spanish or latin american extraction a colonial country whining that a colony wasnt handed to them is a bit silly.
it may be two bald men fighting over a comb but the comb isn't argentinas
Islanders don't want links with argentina.
Argentina has done zero in anyway to apologize for the invasion or even attempt to build any bridges at all they walked away in a huff from the only joint declaration on oil and fishery and did everything in their way to cause problems.
Argentina is already rich in resources and lands the islanders arnt of spanish or latin american extraction a colonial country whining that a colony wasnt handed to them is a bit silly.
it may be two bald men fighting over a comb but the comb isn't argentinas
He is speaking out again, leaving aside its merits, I think he lets his interests dominate his agenda.
ska invita
back on the other side
yeah, knowing how ropey his position is he's doing a good job of sticking to his guns. Have to respect that
gosub
~#
Defending the islands is a lot cheaper and easier if you don't give Argentina (whose claims to the place are nonsense anyway) a beachead
This must just be fine words as he must know hundreds of thousands here don't live in decent housing, can't afford tuition fees, access courses, that FE is being savaged and adult education largely disappeared. Refugees/migrants do get free education, etc so does he mean degree level?
Pickman's model
Starry Wisdom
it'd be a photofinish between you and MarkyMarrk for worst poster of the year: and we're not even in february
existentialist
Tired and unemotional
Ah, let joy be unconfined - the "prolier than thou" gambit.
As if "leftness" is the only thing that matters.
Pickman's model
Starry Wisdom
i know ordinary people think. you spout guff devoid of any prior thought. either stop doing that or get used to it being pointed out.
Pickman's model
Starry Wisdom
he doesn't know what he means by left.
nino_savatte
No pasaran!
"His interests"? You say that as though he's the only one to hold such views. Heaven forbid that we should ever show compassion towards our fellow human beings, eh?
Zelo Street has a much needed corrective to all the hysterical outpourings from the press, who have not only selectively quoted Corbyn but made up much of the story themselves.
Zelo Street: Corbyn Calais Smears Busted
nino_savatte
No pasaran!
I detect a straw man here.
nino_savatte
No pasaran!
Fuck the Falkland Islanders. This is one of those rare occasions on which I agree with Galloway: it would cost much less to resettle the islanders in Hampshire, where many of them have familial ties, that to keep them on the Falklands.
kebabking
Not a Girly Swot, but I like them....
i don't, i don't think it shows integrity, i think it shows a deeply smug attitude and a complete failure to understand that his job is to win an election, rather than feel virtuous.
he doesn't need to talk about this stuff to win an election, he needs to talk about the stuff he believes that also resonates with the electorate - the domestic economy stuff: infrastructure, housing, railways - everytime he opens his mouth about his other favourite subjects he loses votes.
talking about refugees, or the Falklands, or nuclear weapons in a way that excites a load of lefties who would probably vote for him anyway is rather foolish when it also ensures that in three hundred constituancies across the Midlands and South he's just ensured that the Labour PPC will forever remain prospective.
in a 600 seat parliament, as will be elected in 2020, the voting in the 2015GE under the less than spectacular Miliband would give the Tories a 22 seat majority with Labour barely scraping 200 seats. at this stage, Corbyn is doing less well than Miliband at winning the seats he needed in order to form a government. anyone who thinks that will be admirable for Corbyn to ensure that Labour gets an even smaller proportion of the seats south of Manchester is, of course, entitled to their opinion...
littlebabyjesus
one of Maxwell's demons
If you're talking about the next general election, this isn't really true. It's four years away, so this isn't an election campaign yet. What it does do is start to shift the terms of debate. That may not be being done in order to move up in opinion polls today, but that doesn't mean it is losing votes four years down the line.
Pickman's model
Starry Wisdom
yeh let's see how things pan out in the elections four months down the line
littlebabyjesus
one of Maxwell's demons
Also, he was elected leader, surely, on the understanding that he would bring new issues into the debate. Obsessing over opinion polls just months after that election seems to me to miss the point.
J Ed
Follow Back Pro Expropriation
I just don't understand why he is talking about it at all. On balance I think that holding on to the islands isn't worth the amount we spend on them and the bad will it creates across Latin America however it's not like the prospect of giving the islands to Argentina gets *me* excited - that constituency must number less than 100, by contrast there are a good number of people who do feel very angry at the idea even of negotiations over the islands. Why talk about it at all?
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two sheds
Least noticed poster 2007
Agree with that but I wonder how much he talks about housing and the like but doesn't get reported.
He's also likely fucked if he does fucked if he doesn't. Reporter asks him what he thinks of Calais, "I'd rather talk about infrastructure, housing, railways ..." headline's "Corbyn refuses to condemn millions of immigrants flooding Britain".
likesfish
You can't park here sir
it only costs money because of a threat from argentina and frankly all the resources would be doing something else anyway the islanders may end up paying the cost of the defence if the oil comes through so that's that argument gone.
Argentina wants south georgia as well although they have zero claim to that and British antarctic even though they can't supply their own base there.
littlebabyjesus
one of Maxwell's demons
It also costs money because it's right over the other side of the world. Why does Britain own bits of land right over the other side of the world? Is it sensible, equitable or desirable for any country to control bits of land thousands of miles away from any of its other bits of land? Or is this a legacy of empire that needs resolving?
I just hope that you are only pretending to be ignorant of Britain's past.
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