Bye bye MEAT! How will the post-meat future look?

[bcuster]

Reading that it clearly states that there is no concern wrt the milk supply.

Your point is?

Why you are going to see less milk at the grocery store​

MSN

 

[kabbes]

Why you are going to see less milk at the grocery store​

MSN

You do realise that the complete clusterfuck that is the US’s food supply means absolutely zero to us in the UK, right? We barely even get any US processed food, let alone its milk.

 

[klang]

You do realise that the complete clusterfuck that is the US’s food supply means absolutely zero to us in the UK, right? We barely even get any US processed food, let alone its milk.

weren't we promised pink slime at some point?

 

[WouldBe]

weren't we promised pink slime at some point?

And bleach flavoured chicken.

 

[Septic98]

I'm slowly turning away from meat strictly for health reasons, realistically, I'd be ovo-veg* in five+ years time

There's more flavors and textures from any given vegetable, with "less" effort, for less money compared to meat

I made this the other day without any hot oil or sugar, I used leftovers in place of meat or pre-bought stock for pea soup, delicious!

*I grew up with a small chicken farm in my backyard, I can give up dairy, but fresh eggs from the source are

 

[Agent Sparrow]

Tbf, the reason that they want to be milked is because they are not feeding the calves they gave birth to, and their udders get full and sore if they're not milked.
Which is my personal bugbear - there are some people who are ardently vegetarian who get upset about others eating meat, but eat dairy and eggs, as if there are no animals killed to sustain that. Male calves and male chicks are killed to sustain that method of farming is what happens.
(I was vegetarian for over 20 years myself btw. I just think there's no moral high ground unless one forgoes every animal product)

And then some plant based crops involve really dodgy practices, e.g. causing climate issues or exploiting human labour. Unless you grow everything yourself it’s very hard to find a rock hard high ground. Indeed this is the whole plot of Netflix’sThe Good Place.

And not everyone is able of following all the principles they’d ideally want to follow due to personal necessity, be that financial, health, circumstantial etc.

 

[gentlegreen]

 

[Jeff Robinson]

And then some plant based crops involve really dodgy practices, e.g. causing climate issues or exploiting human labour. Unless you grow everything yourself it’s very hard to find a rock hard high ground. Indeed this is the whole plot of Netflix’sThe Good Place.

And not everyone is able of following all the principles they’d ideally want to follow due to personal necessity, be that financial, health, circumstantial etc.

So, carry on paying to have female mammals repeatedly forcibly impregnated, repeatedly steal their children from them and continue doing so until they’re too physically and mentally broken to produce profitable levels of milk and then shoot the in the head, that’s fine because the alternatives aren’t perfect? Get real!

 

[editor]

Here's a good man:

From an industrial park on the outskirts of Berlin, Burrichter and his team cook for a dozen hospitals that offer patients a “planetary health” diet – one that is rich in plants and light in animals. Compared with the typical diet in Germany, known for its bratwurst sausage and doner kebab, the 13,000 meals they rustle up each day are better for the health of people and the planet.

“I’ve been a cook my whole life and have run many kitchens,” says Burrichter. “Now I want to do something sustainable.”

etting people in rich countries to eat less meat is one of the hardest tasks in the shift to a cleaner economy. In Burrichter’s kitchen, the steaming vats of coconut milk dal and semolina dumpling stew need to be more than just cheap and healthy – they must taste so good that people ditch dietary habits built up over decades.

The biggest challenge, says Burrichter, is replacing the meat in a traditional dish. “The bite is the most important, and the flavour comes after that.”

Moderate amounts of meat can form part of a healthy diet, providing protein and key nutrients, but the average German eats twice as much as doctors advise – and many times more than the climate can handle. The meat and dairy industry pumps out 12% to 20% of the pollutants baking the planet and making weather more violent.

And the continuing drop in meat consumption is great news

The proportion of people who eat meat every day fell from 34% in 2015 to 20% in 2023, according to a survey from the German agriculture ministry. Driven more by the dangers to their health than to the climate, close to half of respondents said they were trying to eat less meat.

The planetary health diet: ‘People mustn’t feel meat is being taken from them’

A dozen hospitals in Berlin serve up a menu rich in plants and light in animals – and say they have had few complaints

www.theguardian.com

 

[Agent Sparrow]

So, carry on paying to have female mammals repeatedly forcibly impregnated, repeatedly steal their children from them and continue doing so until they’re too physically and mentally broken to produce profitable levels of milk and then shoot the in the head, that’s fine because the alternatives aren’t perfect? Get real!

Yes that’s EXACTLY what I meant when I pointed out that values and actions are complicated.

 

[Elpenor]

Equating caged chickens with automated milking procedures isn't very sensible.

You do get that the cows are milked twice a day (and they want to be milked), while those caged chickens live all their lives in those cages? Those are not comparable scenarios in any way.

It amazes me that for someone who wants to reform farming you appear stubbornly unwilling to learn anything about it.

Man who lives in city does not understand countryside

 

[Jeff Robinson]

More undercover footage documenting how pigs are brutalised and then tortured in slaughterhouses:



Would be interested to know, who here watches this footage and thinks ‘yep, that’s a price worth paying for bacon’. Would be helpful to sort out the genuine sociopaths who I should put on ignore vs the wilfully blind/in deep denial.

 

[littlebabyjesus]

So, carry on paying to have female mammals repeatedly forcibly impregnated, repeatedly steal their children from them and continue doing so until they’re too physically and mentally broken to produce profitable levels of milk and then shoot the in the head, that’s fine because the alternatives aren’t perfect? Get real!

The alternative way of farming dairy - ie calf at foot - is still only practised on a few farms. You can't get milk produced that way unless you are lucky enough to live close to one of those farms. I would absolutely buy such milk and pay a premium for it if it were available to me, but it's not. You probably think I'm an ogre to buy milk produced on regular farms knowing that a better alternative exists. You also seem to think such practices are evil in a way that I don't. We'd both like to see change, but the change I'd like to see is towards more ethical animal farming. The only change you would deem acceptable would be one that ended animal farming.

In terms of people making compromises in their lives and buying things not produced in the perfect way, I think you need to get real, though. We all compromise. We just set our various red lines in different places. And for complicated, sometimes contradictory, and usually very imperfect reasons.

 

[Jeff Robinson]

The alternative way of farming dairy - ie calf at foot - is still only practised on a few farms. You can't get milk produced that way unless you are lucky enough to live close to one of those farms. I would absolutely buy such milk and pay a premium for it if it were available to me, but it's not. You probably think I'm an ogre to buy milk produced on regular farms knowing that a better alternative exists. You also seem to think such practices are evil in a way that I don't. We'd both like to see change, but the change I'd like to see is towards more ethical animal farming. The only change you would deem acceptable would be one that ended animal farming.

In terms of people making compromises in their lives and buying things not produced in the perfect way, I think you need to get real, though. We all compromise. We just set our various red lines in different places. And for complicated, sometimes contradictory, and usually very imperfect reasons.

This is why the ideology of animal welfarism is so toxic. Because there’s some nominal standard of welfare in dairying that you support, you’re happy to support actually existing practices that you admit are unethical.

Yes, we all have our red lines. Apparently yours don’t include repeatedly forcibly impregnating cows, stealing their children, selectively breeding them to produce quantities of milk that are harmful to their health and welfare, exploiting their bodies until they’re mentally and physically broken and then shooting them in the head. You exemplify the classic human brutal indifference, pomposity, arrogance and self-deception about animals that I’m opposed to. We are not allies on this topic, you are 100% part of the problem as I see it.

 

[littlebabyjesus]

Where do you get 'you're happy to' out of that? That's one of the more annoying ways you post on this subject. You tell people that they are happy with things that they've just said they're not happy with. If their conclusion isn't 'therefore I am now vegan', you consider them (us) to be beneath contempt, essentially. Your posts are drenched in moral superiority.

 

[WouldBe]

Apparently yours don’t include repeatedly forcibly impregnating cows,

Once again most cows in the UK are impregnated naturally. The only "abnormal" part of it is the bull is only allowed to be in with the cows at a certain time of year so the calves are born in spring. If left to their own devices a cow can become pregnant only 20 days after giving birth which would mean more pregnancies not less.

 

[Jeff Robinson]

Where do you get 'you're happy to' out of that? That's one of the more annoying ways you post on this subject. You tell people that they are happy with things that they've just said they're not happy with. If their conclusion isn't 'therefore I am now vegan', you consider them (us) to be beneath contempt, essentially. Your posts are drenched in moral superiority.

I don’t care about the ‘happy’ part to be honest, I could equally have said ‘willing to support’. The willingness is all that matters. That you’re making it about your psychological disposition rather than the consequences of what you support is just you making it about you again. If you’re not ‘happy’ about current dairy practices why don’t you actually do something about them instead of your endless whinging, special pleading and empty platitudes on here?

For what it’s worth, I don’t hold you in contempt as a person, but I do think your attitudes towards animals and your frequent vitriol directed against animal rights activists and vegans are worthy of contempt. As I just said, I think you exemplify exactly the attitude I’m trying to challenge.

 

[Funky_monks]

Once again most cows in the UK are impregnated naturally. The only "abnormal" part of it is the bull is only allowed to be in with the cows at a certain time of year so the calves are born in spring. If left to their own devices a cow can become pregnant only 20 days after giving birth which would mean more pregnancies not less.

Ive explained standing heat more than once. He just likes carrying on that particular trope because he seems to like trivialising rape.

I'm sure such disgusting levels of mysogyny are bannable if they were reported, but I suppose its a useful warning to people what kind of person you are dealing with that has been called out on this numerous times and continues to do it.

 

[Funky_monks]

For what it’s worth, I don’t hold you in contempt as a person, but I do think your attitudes towards animals and your frequent vitriol directed against animal rights activists and vegans are worthy of contempt. As I just said, I think you exemplify exactly the attitude I’m trying to challenge.

The notion that you've effectively challenged anything on this tread says more about your ego than anything else really.
All you've done is painted yourself as a fundamentalist loon who has bastardised some 19th century philosophy in an attempt to give the appearance of some semblance of an intellect.

 

[Jeff Robinson]

The notion that you've effectively challenged anything on this tread says more about your ego than anything else really.
All you've done is painted yourself as a fundamentalist loon who has bastardised some 19th century philosophy in an attempt to give the appearance of some semblance of an intellect.

Coming from a piece of shit like you, I’ll take that as a compliment.

 

[WouldBe]

Coming from a piece of shit like you, I’ll take that as a compliment.

I guess in your case ignorance is bliss.

 

[Agent Sparrow]

Honestly Jeff, I think for many it’s less a case not caring and more not having the capacity to care about everything and having to prioritise. People have so many pressures and competing priorities going on, and intersectionality hugely affects the headspace and resources available to follow through on such committed actions.

It’s great that this is what some people priortise but don’t confuse others inaction with sociopathy - indeed not recognising the different demands on others is really blinkered. I wish I had the capacity and freedom from various restrictions to care as much about this as I did 20 years ago. Sadly life is a hell of a lot more demanding now so I don’t .

 

[butcher]

Ive explained standing heat more than once. He just likes carrying on that particular trope because he seems to like trivialising rape.

I'm sure such disgusting levels of mysogyny are bannable if they were reported, but I suppose its a useful warning to people what kind of person you are dealing with that has been called out on this numerous times and continues to do it.

Obviously the mods on this forum are cool with it and don't want to do anything

 

[gentlegreen]

Yum.

 

[editor]

Obviously the mods on this forum are cool with it and don't want to do anything

Did you report it? No.

Did anyone report it? No.

Have I seen any of it? No.

Have any of the other mods seen it? I doubt it.

Am I seriously fucked off with your nasty, unprovoked, vindictive projection? Yes.

 

[Funky_monks]

Tbh, I wouldn't be arsed to report anything other than personal threats, never reported a post in my life, nor have I put anyone on ignore.

At the end of the day, it worries me not when I log out from here what anonymous people on Internet forums think about me, and it's far more entertaining to let posters like Jeff showcase just what utter nutcases they are.

It's almost funny that someone more reasonable like Agent Sparrow is trying to explain to him, like the petulant child he is about such things as sublety, nuance and critical evaluation, when he's demonstrably a fundamentalist loon, who thinks anyone who doesn't agree 100% with his dogma is subhuman.

I'm sure if he behaved like he does away from bulletin boards, he'd be entirely ostracised wherever he goes, so I kind of hope he doesn't (although I suspect he does).

 

[bcuster]

I don't think Jeff is a nutjob t all. He's taken a strong position on an issue he takes seriously.

 

[Agent Sparrow]

Honestly, I think a lack of subtlety and empathy is rife throughout the entire thread and not just from Jeff/from his “side”. There’s a reason it got name dropped on that ill fated “urban is macho” thread.

 

[krtek a houby]

Honestly, I think a lack of subtlety and empathy is rife throughout the entire thread and not just from Jeff/from his “side”. There’s a reason it got name dropped on that ill fated “urban is macho” thread.

Some boys love to argue. They need to cut down on their pork life.

 

[Agent Sparrow]

Some boys love to argue. They need to cut down on their pork life.

Thank you for today’s earworm.

Which will provide good brain food, despite not having the protein of a typical worm.