burma - potential uprising?

[poster342002]

No word from him. He rarely appears - only just managed to make Armed Forces Day this year and last - and makes even fewer statements.

This is interesting - sounds a bit like Kim Jong Il of North Korea, who is similarly rarely heard from publically.

Is President Than-Shwe no longer truly running the country, I wonder? Or at least not the true power behind the throne? Or is he ill or incapacitated or something?

 

[fela fan]

The thought has occured to me as well There would be some innocent people killed but in this case it might be worth it.
Of course the difficult question is who should do it.

The US and UK are good at that sort of thing.

As for the innocent people, not really i don't think. That city is just the generals and the network of people that allow them to run the country.

And i'd rather see the whole lot of them blown to fucking bits than any of the bloodshed going on around the country now. It's because of them that burma has been a giant prison camp for so many years.

 

[poster342002]

The US and UK are good at that sort of thing.

That "thing" namely making a very bad situation even worse.

 

[ymu]

Start harrasing the Chinese Embassy and the International Olympic Committee demanding Beijing be stripped of the games.

Sticks in the craw, but...I wonder if it's better to emphasise that it should not be allowed to destroy the Olympics; act decisively and make it a double cause for celebration...

This article (Darfur) makes the point unconvincingly ... I dunno.

 

[Yu_Gi_Oh]

The thought has occured to me as well There would be some innocent people killed but in this case it might be worth it.
Of course the difficult question is who should do it.

Our fucking govt is happy to join in the fight for 'democracy' when it suits them, when they want it, invading countries who never even asked for our help, but here Burma is desperate for some help and what do we do? Sanctions? UN envoy?

Cunts, all of them, fucking spineless lying cunts of the highest order.

I want so badly to help.

 

[poster342002]

As for the innocent people, not really i don't think. That city is just the generals and the network of people that allow them to run the country.

A bit like the North Korean capital, Pyongyang - where only regime officials and those with most-trusted/loyal status are allowed to reside.

 

[ymu]

The US and UK are good at that sort of thing.

Also good at not picking fights with better armed bullies. They ain't going to war with China.

Sanctions?

The existing sanctions are why the West has no political leverage.

 

[Brainaddict]

The US and UK are good at that sort of thing.

As for the innocent people, not really i don't think. That city is just the generals and the network of people that allow them to run the country.

And the cleaners? The builders? The cycle-taxi drivers?

I have to admit I'd much rather the UK had bombed Myanmar than Iraq but you've got to wonder how the Chinese would take it. Could launch the third world war....

 

[poster342002]

Also good at not picking fights with better armed bullies. They ain't going to war with China.

Which is what it would probably entail.

I think those calling for a western invasion of Burma should first se the 1980s film, threads, in which an invasion of Iran following a coup-attempt there led to nuclear WW3 between the superpowers.

 

[fela fan]

Our fucking govt is happy to join in the fight for 'democracy' when it suits them, when they want it, invading countries who never even asked for our help, but here Burma is desperate for some help and what do we do? Sanctions? UN envoy?

Cunts, all of them, fucking spineless lying cunts of the highest order.

I want so badly to help.

Exactly. This is what makes me the most exasperated over the whole thing.

 

[poster342002]

I have to admit I'd much rather the UK had bombed Myanmar than Iraq but you've got to wonder how the Chinese would take it. Could launch the third world war....

Yep - see my earlier comments about that film, threads.

 

[Brainaddict]

Our fucking govt is happy to join in the fight for 'democracy' when it suits them, when they want it, invading countries who never even asked for our help, but here Burma is desperate for some help and what do we do? Sanctions? UN envoy?

Cunts, all of them, fucking spineless lying cunts of the highest order.

I want so badly to help.

Yes to all that. When I was there I met a monk with the kind of boundless faith in liberal democracy that you don't see in Britain any more. He asked me to write to Tony Blair when I got home to remind him of the suffering of the Burmese people. The way he came across he genuinely seemed to think the country had just slipped TB's mind and if I wrote and reminded him then he would do something about it.

I did write when I got home - because I had promised I would, not because I thought it would make any difference.

I have to say I wouldn't have shown the answer to that monk. It would have been like spitting in his face.

 

[fela fan]

That "thing" namely making a very bad situation even worse.

No, making a very bad situation infinitely better. That new capital city is filled with the thugs and their families and everyone that is happy enough to work for them in keeping up the illegal rule and running of the country.

Drop a bomb on that city and you only wipe out the most evil regime in the world and those that prop them up.

That seems most reasonable to me compared to the total injustices going on in the country at the moment.

 

[fela fan]

And the cleaners? The builders? The cycle-taxi drivers?

I have to admit I'd much rather the UK had bombed Myanmar than Iraq but you've got to wonder how the Chinese would take it. Could launch the third world war....

All this stuff about china, they've barely got an army mate. Forget them and their pathetic reactions and even patheticker face. Any third world war will be over the US and the middle east. Not over burma and china.

 

[Brainaddict]

All this stuff about china, they've barely got an army mate.

Interesting idea. They have the largest standing army in the world. They're busy updating all their military technology, spending billions and billions of dollars a year. And of course have nuclear weapons.

What, to you, would be a *proper* army?

 

[fela fan]

Which is what it would probably entail.

I think those calling for a western invasion of Burma should first se the 1980s film, threads, in which an invasion of Iran following a coup-attempt there led to nuclear WW3 between the superpowers.

There's only me, and i'm not calling for an invasion. I'm simply providing a possible course of action better than the inaction of the international community who are all wringing their hands. They are utterly pathetic, and they represent us.

Just stop comparing this to iran, the two situations are totally different. In time and space.

We don't need any invasion, western or not. Just one fucking bomb on one city. That's it. Those generals are powerful for sure, but they're also fucking stupid, and since they moved themselves into one city, bomb them to bits.

 

[purves grundy]

This is interesting - sounds a bit like Kim Jong Il of North Korea, who is similarly rarely heard from publically.

Is President Than-Shwe no longer truly running the country, I wonder? Or at least not the true power behind the throne? Or is he ill or incapacitated or something?

He's not usually referred to as president, usually just by his miltary titles of senior general and commander-in-chief. He is suffering from a number of medical ailments. The highest political office is that of Prime Minister - like I said earlier, he - U Soe Win - is almost dead (lieukemia(sp?) iirc) Everything goes thorugh Than Shwe though, who is as reclusive as Kim jong Il, yeah.

There's currently a lot of jostling for the top posts. I can't remember which one - maybe Aung Thaung (very hardline) - recently said "The fruit is ripe my friends. Now we wait for it to fall." Many had hoped that this would create splits which could be exploited during the current crisis, it seems not. They've come this far, they're not going to give up now.

 

[ymu]

UK Ambassador reckons Aung San Suu Kyi is still under house arrest not prison because of the guard presence still in the street. Just on News24.

Said UK had no influence but didn't name and shame the states that did. Fucking politicians.

 

[fela fan]

Interesting idea. They have the largest standing army in the world. They're busy updating all their military technology, spending billions and billions of dollars a year. And of course have nuclear weapons.

What, to you, would be a *proper* army?

And why on earth would china enter a war with the US or UK over burma??? Not a chance.

However big their army is, it's hopelessly out of date technologically compared to any western power. And why would they even think about using nuclear weapons because the US bombed one city in burma?

In any case, china have more savoir faire than the US or UK.

 

[poster342002]

Any third world war will be over the US and the middle east. Not over burma and china.

I somehow doubt China's going to stand by and watch one of it's key regional allies and oil-supplier get invaded or nuked by the western powers. The mid-east could all of a sudden look like an irrelavance if this kicks off.

 

[ymu]

Rumours that China has been talking to democracy leaders - expert interviewee is agreeing that it's plausible, but complex... BBC News 24

 

[ymu]

And why on earth would china enter a war with the US or UK over burma??? Not a chance.

However big their army is, it's hopelessly out of date technologically compared to any western power. And why would they even think about using nuclear weapons because the US bombed one city in burma?

In any case, china have more savoir faire than the US or UK.

fela, the US was determinedly isolationist until WWII.

Could we take general debate to another thread, please? It's making it harder to pick up news/action posts.

 

[Crispy]

The thought has occured to me as well There would be some innocent people killed but in this case it might be worth it.
Of course the difficult question is who should do it.

I shall raise the matter at my club. I know a few trustworthy captains who can give us safe passage around the horn. Give me two months to gather the right men, and I believe we're in with a chance.

 

[fela fan]

I somehow doubt China's going to stand by and watch one of it's key regional allies and oil-supplier get invaded or nuked by the western powers. The mid-east could all of a sudden look like an irrelavance if this kicks off.

Who's talking about invasion or nuclear stuff? Just one bomb on the new city, that's all.

I'm not being entirely serious here, just offering an alternative to the bullshit measly words being offered by countries as to how to deal with the 'burmese situation'.

 

[poster342002]

Does anyone seriously think that nuking the Burmese capital would simply end there? I'm telling you - the use of nuclear weopons anywhere would unleash a global crises the likes of which we've never seen. One that perticular genie is out of the bottle, it's not going back in.

 

[purves grundy]

UK Ambassador reckons Aung San Suu Kyi is still under house arrest not prison because of the guard presence still in the street. Just on News24.

Said UK had no influence but didn't name and shame the states that did. Fucking politicians.

Ah that's interesting and reassurring. Would've been madness to move her, maybe they said it to split the protests. I've been to Insein Prison and it's horrific. She's much safer in her villa with her shortwave radio.

 

[ymu]

Bono name-dropping in favour of actual content ... Fuck's sake - does the man have no shame.

http://news.ninemsn.com.au/article.aspx?id=300565

Bono calls for support for Burma
Thursday Sep 27 23:54 AEST

Irish rock star Bono, whose group U2 has written a song about Burma pro-democracy leader Aung San Suu Kyi, has appealed for "prayers for the Burmese people" and said he "slept uneasily" after watching pictures of the violent crackdown of the peaceful protest.

"It is extraordinary to see the Buddhist monks isn't it? Their non-violence may, I pray, win out over the ugliness of the situation," he said.

"There is jeopardy. I slept uneasily last night and I'm sure everyone else that watched did too." The singer, speaking in London, said he had met and corresponded with Suu Kyi.

"I have a little bit of a relationship with Aung San Suu Kyi. I've met her family and corresponded with her. U2 actually wrote a song - Walk On - for her."

"I've always followed her progress and that of the Burmese people.

She is a study in grace and they are a study in patience."

Bono said everyone should offer their support to the Burmese people.

 

[poster342002]

Who's talking about invasion or nuclear stuff? Just one bomb on the new city, that's all.

I'm not being entirely serious here, just offering an alternative to the bullshit measly words being offered by countries as to how to deal with the 'burmese situation'.

The only sort of bomb powerful enough to annihalate a major city is a nuke. Or one of those new Russian bombs that do the same amount of damage. Either way - world goes tits-up big time if anything like that is tried.

 

[fela fan]

fela, the US was determinedly isolationist until WWII.

Could we take general debate to another thread, please? It's making it harder to pick up news/action posts.

I'm sorry mate, from my position the latest news is only gonna be blood and more blood. I'm personally more interested in what the world is going to do to help the burmese people. Coz if they don't, then after x amount of carnage the people will once again be cowed back into a life of despair and non-freedom. And the world, including urban will once again forget about them.

This story is about much more than the latest newsfeed and everyone's subconscious desire for bad news. I've started numerous threads about burma down the years, and it's only now that there's bloodshed that the thread goes beyond one or two pages.

 

[ymu]

I'm sorry mate, from my position the latest news is only gonna be blood and more blood. I'm personally more interested in what the world is going to do to help the burmese people.

Yeah - that's why I'm suggesting we keep this thread clear for news and action - not random musings about what China might or might not do if the US decided to bomb the junta when we know they never will.

It's making it hard to see the other posts, that's all.