Bullfighting in Mexico City has been cancelled

[frogwoman]

I lived in a bullfighting town. It was common during the various feria around the area. Those liking it v those not was about 50:50 split.

I find the cruelty appalling. It is horrific. I don't condone this at all.

But there is an art and spectacle, outside the ring, that is attractive. The costumes, the manipulation of the capes, the horsemanship.

If only it didn't need to include such torture and cruelty.

I understand, but could anything be done in your opinion to make it less cruel though? It's not just what they actually do to the bulls, it's leaving in a box too small to turn around for hours and hours, transporting them long distances etc. Even the ones that are released are often slaughtered afterwards.

I don’t know if it's possible to train a bull like a dog so it can do stuff like showing off the matadors cape skills without having to be injured or stressed, and I get the feeling the bullfighting lobby aren't interested in that. It probably wouldn't be an ideal solution for the bull either tbh

 

[splonkydoo]

Let them do it Costa Rican style as i said....the only thing getting minced there is lads in silly hats

 

[littlebabyjesus]

I dunno. Taunting animals for fun? Shouldn't people grow out of that by about age 10?

 

[dessiato]

I understand, but could anything be done in your opinion to make it less cruel though? It's not just what they actually do to the bulls, it's leaving in a box too small to turn around for hours and hours, transporting them long distances etc. Even the ones that are released are often slaughtered afterwards.

I don’t know if it's possible to train a bull like a dog so it can do stuff like showing off the matadors cape skills without having to be injured or stressed, and I get the feeling the bullfighting lobby aren't interested in that. It probably wouldn't be an ideal solution for the bull either tbh

In N Portugal they have ribbons on the horns which a team of 4 or five people try to remove. The only time I saw it there were more people hurt than bulls. The bulls were only in the ring for up to 15 minutes. I didn't see any animals hurt. That doesn't mean it doesn't happen but I've not seen it.

I don't think it's a solution but it has to be better than torturing them to death.

 

[splonkydoo]

I dunno. Taunting animals for fun? Shouldn't people grow out of that by about age 10?

Well evidently not which is why I suggested one which is far less cruel than the other. What's your solution?

 

[frogwoman]

Let them do it Costa Rican style as i said....the only thing getting minced there is lads in silly hats

Umm...they really don't look like they're having a great time in that video.

 

[tim]

I lived in a bullfighting town. It was common during the various feria around the area. Those liking it v those not was about 50:50 split.

I find the cruelty appalling. It is horrific. I don't condone this at all.

But there is an art and spectacle, outside the ring, that is attractive. The costumes, the manipulation of the capes, the horsemanship.

If only it didn't need to include such torture and cruelty.

A bit like war really the uniforms, choreography and fireworks are amazing. It's just a pity that people get damaged.

 

[frogwoman]

Umm...they really don't look like they're having a great time in that video.

At 1h44 they are grabbing the bulls horns and pulling it around, really not good clean fun tbh

 

[littlebabyjesus]

Well evidently not which is why I suggested one which is far less cruel than the other. What's your solution?

I already offered one solution as a dangerous activity for bored small-townsfolk to do. Cheese chasing.

I'm not quite sure how we've managed it, but somehow most people in the world go through their whole lives without ever tormenting a bull for fun. Not even once. Extraordinary, I know.

 

[frogwoman]

At about 2h19 a guy is standing on a ledge and kicking the bull from behind. That video is actually quite upsetting to watch, not sure how it's much better than a corrida tbh.

 

[littlebabyjesus]

I lived in a bullfighting town. It was common during the various feria around the area. Those liking it v those not was about 50:50 split.

I find the cruelty appalling. It is horrific. I don't condone this at all.

But there is an art and spectacle, outside the ring, that is attractive. The costumes, the manipulation of the capes, the horsemanship.

If only it didn't need to include such torture and cruelty.

I would suggest that a big part of the spectacle is the danger involved. An essential part. The 'Oles' that ring out for manipulation of the cape come because said manipulation is being done in a situation of danger. Take away the danger and you take away the artistry. It's just some bloke in a silly hat pointlessly waving around a piece of cloth.

 

[frogwoman]

I'm not quite sure how we've managed it, but somehow most people in the world go through their whole lives without ever tormenting a bull for fun. Not even once. Extraordinary, I know.

Omg! Really??? Not even pulled its tail once or jabbed it with a stick? How could this happen?

 

[Magnus McGinty]

Do they think it’s macho or something? It’s like having a fight where your opponent has their hands tied behind their back.

 

[JimW]

It's just some bloke in a silly hat pointlessly waving around a piece of cloth

 

[Tanya1982]

Why would the far right be arsed either way? Do they literally just support the most regressive policy of any shit regardless?

Because as with many of their hobby horses, the people they hate are the ones who are against it. They aren’t for it for it’s own sake necessarily - they’ve just noticed that a lot of city people, young people, progressive people, whatever, are the ones who don’t like it.

A bit like the backlash against the National Trust the UK. Those who object to it adding more context to its properties and events aren’t fascinated by history, culture, or architecture. They just enjoy trolling ‘progressives’. The other day, some Mail columnist objected to Henry VIII being described by an exhibition as disabled in his later years - it was a ‘woke attack’ on one of ‘our’ most ‘virile’ figures - rather than simply being an interesting truth about a total cunt, which was entirely relevant to the context of the exhibit.

 

[Magnus McGinty]

If anyone was in any doubt that they’re basically just organised nobheads then this is the fucking proof.

 

[frogwoman]

Do they think it’s macho or something? It’s like having a fight where your opponent has their hands tied behind their back.

Having a fight where the opponent has had a sharp object jabbed into their back shortly before it even starts, and doesn't even know why they are there.

 

[frogwoman]

I would suggest that a big part of the spectacle is the danger involved. An essential part. The 'Oles' that ring out for manipulation of the cape come because said manipulation is being done in a situation of danger. Take away the danger and you take away the artistry. It's just some bloke in a silly hat pointlessly waving around a piece of cloth.

A fair fight would be something like the matador and his assistants taking on a herd of bulls and cows in a field. Part of the reason why the Bull charges as it does is because its in pain from having a rosette with a 8cm dart stabbed into its back as it enters the ring, and starts running round desperately looking for an exit.

If the bullfight could be arranged to take place in a field like the ones where I grew up, with other cows and bulls, where the bull is just chilling, there are plenty of places it could run away to if it wishes and get very quick backup from a bunch of angry cows, I doubt the fight would end that well for the matador lol. I doubt they would actually get anywhere near stabbing it at all.

 

[Tanya1982]

Apparently in the US, it’s still perfectly legal - in fact, desired - to wound horses hooves so the footwork is lighter and the legs come up more dramatically as the horse tries to lessen its agony. While bullfighting in Spanish world is the obvious one when it comes to deliberate physical injury for entertainment, there are many other examples that go largely unremarked.

 

[Magnus McGinty]

Apparently in the US, it’s still perfectly legal - in fact, desired - to wound horses hooves so the footwork is lighter and the legs come up more dramatically as the horse tries to lessen its agony. While bullfighting in Spanish world is the obvious one when it comes to deliberate physical injury for entertainment, there are many other examples that go largely unremarked.

Do they still do the dancing bear shit in wherever that happened?

 

[Tanya1982]

A fair fight would be something like the matador and his assistants taking on a herd of bulls and cows in a field. Part of the reason why the Bull charges as it does is because its in pain from having a rosette with a 8cm dart stabbed into its back as it enters the ring, and starts running round desperately looking for an exit.

If the bullfight could be arranged to take place in a field like the ones where I grew up, with other cows and bulls, where the bull is just chilling, there are plenty of places it could run away to if it wishes and get very quick backup from a bunch of angry cows, I doubt the fight would end that well for the matador lol. I doubt they would actually get anywhere near stabbing it at all.

I remember being about 15, getting stoned in a field round the back of Croydon one summer, while visiting a cousin for the day. Glorious hot afternoon. We didn’t realise there was a bull further down the field, and eventually it made itself known. We were over that barbed wire fence so fast I tore the back of my T-shirt from the hem to the neck.

 

[frogwoman]

Apparently in the US, it’s still perfectly legal - in fact, desired - to wound horses hooves so the footwork is lighter and the legs come up more dramatically as the horse tries to lessen its agony. While bullfighting in Spanish world is the obvious one when it comes to deliberate physical injury for entertainment, there are many other examples that go largely unremarked.

Yeah US rodeo stuff is really bad, as are their laws on animal welfare in general, even with stuff like de-clawing cats ffs. I hadn't heard of that but it doesn't surprise me at all.

 

[Magnus McGinty]

I remember being about 15, getting stoned in a field round the back of Croydon one summer, while visiting a cousin for the day. Glorious hot afternoon. We didn’t realise there was a bull further down the field, and eventually it made itself known. We were over that barbed wire fence so fast I tore the back of my T-shirt from the hem to the neck.

There's loads of people killed by cows in the UK. Been in the news recently. Needs regulating where people are free to walk vs being killed.

 

[Tanya1982]

Do they still do the dancing bear shit in wherever that happened?

Don’t know.

Primates is the one that really upsets me. During one of my orangutan YouTube binges, I saw recent footage from some theme park in the Midwest where a very distressed orangutan on a lead was being forced to act as the foil to a particularly cuntish handler, while a crowd laughed and cheered.

 

[frogwoman]

I remember being about 15, getting stoned in a field round the back of Croydon one summer, while visiting a cousin for the day. Glorious hot afternoon. We didn’t realise there was a bull further down the field, and eventually it made itself known. We were over that barbed wire fence so fast I tore the back of my T-shirt from the hem to the neck.

Yeah I doubt most of those pricks would last long trying to torture a bull just chilling in its natural setting.

 

[frogwoman]

Don’t know.

Primates is the one that really upsets me. During one of my orangutan YouTube binges, I saw recent footage from some theme park in the Midwest where a very distressed orangutan on a lead was being forced to act as the foil to a particularly cuntish handler, while a crowd laughed and cheered.

Yeah insta is full of 'cute' videos of wild and often endangered animals being forced to wear clothes and do unnatural stuff, for thousands of likes. Don't get me started on that shit. Seen it with frogs as well.

 

[Magnus McGinty]

Yeah insta is full of 'cute' videos of wild and often endangered animals being forced to wear clothes and do unnatural stuff, for thousands of likes. Don't get me started on that shit. Seen it with frogs as well.

Can work out not good. Some woman got her face bitten off because her mate decided a chimpanzee was basically a baby or domesticated pet.

 

[frogwoman]

Tanya1982 Horses can be just as terrifying as Bulls though. In the summer me and my mate went to the river and had a picnic and a herd of feral horses came up and started helping themselves including eating a whole cheese still in its wrapper which I tried to pull out of its mouth unsuccessfully. First one came up and then before we knew we were surrounded.

 

[Magnus McGinty]

Never walk behind one.

 

[Tanya1982]

Yeah insta is full of 'cute' videos of wild and often endangered animals being forced to wear clothes and do unnatural stuff, for thousands of likes. Don't get me started on that shit. Seen it with frogs as well.

There were all the D words in that orangutans face - despair, distress, disbelief, depression. Soulful eyes - so similar to us you’d have to be sociopathic not to read it instantly. It was so fucking obvious I couldn’t quite understand why not a single person in that audience noticed or objected. There were kids there too - I’d have been in tears if anyone had taken me to witness that cruelty as a child. I know I wouldn’t have simply sat there - I’d have made such a scene I’d have ended up being escorted out if I hadn’t already left. Not one person in this seven or eight minutes of video did anything other than laugh, cheer, whistle, and catcall.