I thought it meant 'kiss my arse' but apparently it means 'kill me, ayatollah'... or so demu was telling me.
Beating the Fascists: The authorised history of Anti-Fascist Action
- Thread starter cogg
- Start date
I thought it meant 'kiss my arse' but apparently it means 'kill me, ayatollah'... or so demu was telling me.
cantsin
Well-Known Member
(PM for you)
bignose1
Searchlight Spoiler
see middle above
Steve... I was taking the Mickey too , mate... Chill out.... The Matron hadn't really taken my weighted, studded club , with the insanely cruel and unnecessary twisty pointy end, out of its oaken leather-bound velvet-lined box !
Don't fret Steve, your long heroic role in the Squad will always give you a place of fond respect in my memory. And I actually still think "No Retreat" is a great rollicking read - great anti-fascist propaganda which will help mobilise younger anti-fascists for a long time
- it just seems clear that Hann made an awful lot of his contribution up. But that's not your fault Steve - Hann even fooled his own long term partner with his heroic tales.
SWALK indeedy comrade .
Don't fret Steve, your long heroic role in the Squad will always give you a place of fond respect in my memory. And I actually still think "No Retreat" is a great rollicking read - great anti-fascist propaganda which will help mobilise younger anti-fascists for a long time
- it just seems clear that Hann made an awful lot of his contribution up. But that's not your fault Steve - Hann even fooled his own long term partner with his heroic tales.
SWALK indeedy comrade .
Red Storm
M14
I've read No Retreat and BTF. Both good books and both have helped me form my ideas of anti fascism.
I'm from the new breed of Manchester Anti Fascists and a co-ordinator in the new Manc AFA. We're all only just discovering all these mad in fights which is strange when we hold all the old guard in such high regard when really we don't know any of you. We're not in your league (yet) as an organisation we're 18 months old but stories we know of your exploits back in the day are what have inspired us although we didn't really know of any of it when we started out.
I'm starting to try and connect the dots of the old lot to make sure we don't make any of the same mistakes! Just stumbled on this thread which is proving interesting.
I'm from the new breed of Manchester Anti Fascists and a co-ordinator in the new Manc AFA. We're all only just discovering all these mad in fights which is strange when we hold all the old guard in such high regard when really we don't know any of you. We're not in your league (yet) as an organisation we're 18 months old but stories we know of your exploits back in the day are what have inspired us although we didn't really know of any of it when we started out.
I'm starting to try and connect the dots of the old lot to make sure we don't make any of the same mistakes! Just stumbled on this thread which is proving interesting.
Red Storm
M14
As a side note: we voted against having a Northern launch of BTF, which we were asked by Freedom Press to do, out of loyalty. Now we've all read the book perhaps it was the wrong decision as BTF is such a good book but I don't think any new lot joining need to read the Hann stuff.
Good to know, Red Storm, that a new generation in Manchester are taking up the torch. Different times, different needs and tactics of course. I appreciate that all the in-fighting and bitching between the old guard must be a bit off-putting ... but that is, and ever will be, the Left, I'm afraid - it just has to be accepted and worked round to achieve anything - as we had to do ourselves back in the day.
For your informaton, Tilzey's contribution to No Retreat is pretty accurate, and I agree newer anti fascists don't really need to concern themselves with the quibbling over what did and didn't happen in Hann's account - it still captures well the overall flavour of the times.
The account of the Manchester Squad in BTF is very accurate, though for obvious reasons lots of other "good bits "couldn't be published. BTF is obviously much more analytical, and quite understandably much more London focussed, as well - a heavier tome altogether - with a wider purpose than No Retreat.
Please Don't let our old timer squabbles put you off - when it mattered we all managed to do the job in hand well - the later squabbles are unimportant.
Best of luck to you all.
For your informaton, Tilzey's contribution to No Retreat is pretty accurate, and I agree newer anti fascists don't really need to concern themselves with the quibbling over what did and didn't happen in Hann's account - it still captures well the overall flavour of the times.
The account of the Manchester Squad in BTF is very accurate, though for obvious reasons lots of other "good bits "couldn't be published. BTF is obviously much more analytical, and quite understandably much more London focussed, as well - a heavier tome altogether - with a wider purpose than No Retreat.
Please Don't let our old timer squabbles put you off - when it mattered we all managed to do the job in hand well - the later squabbles are unimportant.
Best of luck to you all.
Fedayn
Well-Known Member
I take it it appeared today?
Signed by J. Favourite...
Fedayn
Well-Known Member
Information for all his many, many, old friends, RM has been very ill indeed. I went for a laughter -filled trip with him this Tuesday around old haunts (including a trip to see Dessie's (spectacular) grave at Southern Cemetary), prior to an important hospital visit the next day . On Wednesday 20th he has just been given the all clear after previous radical surgery. Now a very happy man indeed ! I'm sure all his old comrades will want to wish him well.
bignose1
Searchlight Spoiler
So pleased and relieved that Roys got the all clear...was at my grans grave last week which is next to Dessies...which is just a few yards from Sir Matt Busbys ..another few yards from LS Lowry and...Billy Meredith...so in very good company. Which places did you visit..was it a bit like a Ripper tour..or similar
Honesty forces me to admit that a large part of the days grand "tour" was down to my attack of what Trotsky once described as "Geographic cretinism",
Yep, I got hopelessly lost just trying to navigate between Reddish and Southern Cemetary ! Well... it's years since I've been to Manchester, and the brain cells are a lot sparser now !
But yeh Steve, bit of an idea there mate... "Squad .. Vicious but Fair..Tours " - all the highlights of the blood and gore across Manchester and the North West - it could have legs that one -with a crash helmetted , masked, tour guide !
I'll pass on your regards to RM, Steve. Needless to say he is on Cloud 9 at present - so there was no need to look for a spare plot after all !
Roy is not out of the woods yet, but he is now determined to take the availability of more time "On Planet" to write up his own autobiography - as he said, its got it all from the reader attractiveness big sales viewpoint-- adventure, crime , politics, violence, mad escapades, mystery, and he forcefully insists .... LOTS AND LOTS AND LOTS AND LOTS... etc...OF EXPLICIT SEX (lucky bastard !).
Yep, I got hopelessly lost just trying to navigate between Reddish and Southern Cemetary ! Well... it's years since I've been to Manchester, and the brain cells are a lot sparser now !
But yeh Steve, bit of an idea there mate... "Squad .. Vicious but Fair..Tours " - all the highlights of the blood and gore across Manchester and the North West - it could have legs that one -with a crash helmetted , masked, tour guide !
I'll pass on your regards to RM, Steve. Needless to say he is on Cloud 9 at present - so there was no need to look for a spare plot after all !
Roy is not out of the woods yet, but he is now determined to take the availability of more time "On Planet" to write up his own autobiography - as he said, its got it all from the reader attractiveness big sales viewpoint-- adventure, crime , politics, violence, mad escapades, mystery, and he forcefully insists .... LOTS AND LOTS AND LOTS AND LOTS... etc...OF EXPLICIT SEX (lucky bastard !).
Red About Town
Well-Known Member
Will back issues of the Fighting Talk and Red Action magazine ever be put up online to read?
butchersapron
Bring back hanging
Fighting talk were put on line - missing a few. The site that had them is now down, i hope someone saved them and put them up elsewhere.
sihhi
Tyranny, like hell, is not easily conquered
I have a copy of the first ever Fighting Talk.
You can see the last issue of Fighting Talk in 2000 here
http://replay.web.archive.org/19990220004528/http://www.geocities.com/CapitolHill/Senate/5602/
Can anyone help with this? A now deleted blog had:
Is this information true?
Does anyone have extra information about him in the 80s and 90s? Was he actually a member of Red Action? Did he write any articles in Red Action bulletin/ magazine?
He was very active in Newham, he joined Labour at some point in the 1990s, now he's high up in East Ham Constituency Labour party and the greasy pole of London Labour.
He gives this kind of interview on the basis of his past antiracist experience http://www.guardian.co.uk/uk/2010/nov/09/how-many-more-roshonara-choudhrys
This is his face now http://mgov.newham.gov.uk/mgMiniSite.aspx?UID=199
You can see the last issue of Fighting Talk in 2000 here
http://replay.web.archive.org/19990220004528/http://www.geocities.com/CapitolHill/Senate/5602/
Can anyone help with this? A now deleted blog had:
Is this information true?
Does anyone have extra information about him in the 80s and 90s? Was he actually a member of Red Action? Did he write any articles in Red Action bulletin/ magazine?
He was very active in Newham, he joined Labour at some point in the 1990s, now he's high up in East Ham Constituency Labour party and the greasy pole of London Labour.
He gives this kind of interview on the basis of his past antiracist experience http://www.guardian.co.uk/uk/2010/nov/09/how-many-more-roshonara-choudhrys
This is his face now http://mgov.newham.gov.uk/mgMiniSite.aspx?UID=199
Wasn't Unmesh Desai working for the "Newham Monitoring Project" yet another GLC quango, in the early 80's when he had a leading role in AFA organisationally , being on its Steering Group ? I certainly don't think he was in RA though - much too respectable even then.
If it's the Unmesh I think he is, I recall he took responsibility for assembling 100 or so celebrity names for a half page AFA advert in about 86 , an ANL style thing, in the Guardian basically saying "we all oppose Fascism etc" - BUT he FORGOT to include in the advert the intended request to send AFA cash ! So it cost a lot and brought us in nowt - VERY annoying at the time ! I recall Unmesh as basically a good bloke, very likeable - but obviously politically ambitious.
If it's the Unmesh I think he is, I recall he took responsibility for assembling 100 or so celebrity names for a half page AFA advert in about 86 , an ANL style thing, in the Guardian basically saying "we all oppose Fascism etc" - BUT he FORGOT to include in the advert the intended request to send AFA cash ! So it cost a lot and brought us in nowt - VERY annoying at the time ! I recall Unmesh as basically a good bloke, very likeable - but obviously politically ambitious.
sihhi
Tyranny, like hell, is not easily conquered
I forgot to add 'Monitoring Project' to Newham.
The blog where it said he was Red Action was southpawpunch.blogspot.com - it is now dead.
The reason for all this is that the Newham Councillors, aswell as cutting services and jobs left right and centre, agreed to award a 4% pay rise to their aleady overpaid Mayor Sir Robin Wales.
He fits in well into an ex-NMP type of thing: Asad Rehman became George Galloway's adviser, Barry Mussenden became an OBE/civil servant in charge of Equality and Partnerships in the Department of Health, Piara Powar became head of the CRE's Let's Kick Racism Out of Football/Kick It Out, then Football Against Racism in Europe, funded by the Premier League etc.
Sort of different to AFA and RA's politics- that's why I asked about Unmesh.
Yes Unmesh was certainly around during the 80' and did travel with Red Action for a while. Not sure if he was actually a member...Im sure someone from London will clarify.
Still recall his quote in defence of Searchlight whilst Class War were being excommunicated from the AFA fold....'Searchlight is my Bible'
Divisive Cotton
Now I just have my toy soldiers
I'm sure at one point Unmesh Desai was in the running to take Tony Banks' old seat
The39thStep
Urban critical thinker
I knew Unmesh from the late 70s /early 80s. Very dry and witty, he was one of a number of Asian anti fascists , Hardy Desai was another.Then he was slim and always seemed to wear combat trousers, Was around the squads but not sure if was ever a RA member.
Unmesh and his ilk are quite an interesting social grouping I think - unlike the rest of us having to fit in anti fascist work around our day jobs , and in danger of losing said jobs if we fell fowl of the law - Unmesh and many others managed to be both active anti fascists/radicals - but also held comfy quango jobs which got them paid for those activities too - nice work if you could get it !
There was a whole class of "radical" academics too , like the SWP's Alex Callinicos ( of "That's not my function in the Party" fame) and the IMG's Norman Geras, the SWP's Colin Barker, also David Jaffe, etc, etc, who managed to posture in the leading ranks of the "revolutionery Left" for decades , but never took personal risks - yet found the various Left journals a perfect venue for their career building theory pontification .
Most of em are professors now of course. I always found this merging of the personal career building with supposed radical politics pretty iffy. If things in the 70's had turned as nasty as they easily could have done, "Renegade Kautskyites" to a man I strongly suspect -(to coin an ancient olde Trot term). But maybe I'm being unfair...Not.
There was a whole class of "radical" academics too , like the SWP's Alex Callinicos ( of "That's not my function in the Party" fame) and the IMG's Norman Geras, the SWP's Colin Barker, also David Jaffe, etc, etc, who managed to posture in the leading ranks of the "revolutionery Left" for decades , but never took personal risks - yet found the various Left journals a perfect venue for their career building theory pontification .
Most of em are professors now of course. I always found this merging of the personal career building with supposed radical politics pretty iffy. If things in the 70's had turned as nasty as they easily could have done, "Renegade Kautskyites" to a man I strongly suspect -(to coin an ancient olde Trot term). But maybe I'm being unfair...Not.
The39thStep
Urban critical thinker
Ironically Callinicos wrote an article in ISJ about the new middle classs in the 1980's which was primarily directed at Labour's professional activists.
Joe Reilly
Well-Known Member
Unmesh was involved with RA in the very early days but drifted. Relations resumed in 1985 with the foundation of AFA. He actually proposed that RA be allotted an extra seat on the founding steering committee, which RA refused. He was instrumental in creating the student base for AFA Mark 1, but when the decision was made to orientate to and accomodate working class recruits, he tried to set up a rival outfit called (having a?) LARF. I think he was still with the NMP in 1993, following the Welling Riot when it denouced RA for 'hi-jacking AFA' in the London Evening Standard.
On the credit side, after the 1986 conference fiasco involving Class War, he atoned, at least partly the following year when RA was targetted for expulsion by the types mentioned elsewhere in the thread, who saw AFA as a potentially very lucrative quango - but for that to happen it would be necessary to ditch anti-fascism first.
Nigel Irritable
Five, Ten, Fifteen Years
To be fair to those radical academics who stuck at it, for the bulk of them being known as a revolutionary socialist was not good for their career prospects. That's part of the reason for the very quick and very sweeping rise of post-whatever thought in left academia - it was much more profitable to swap the socialism stuff for such meaningless waffle as "an emancipatory politics". It was less damaging to your employment prospects to be "out" as a communist lecturer then most other things, but they'd still have been materially better off by keeping their yaps shut.
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