Beating the Fascists: The authorised history of Anti-Fascist Action

[miktheword]

One of the analytical points made in the book is that if the only opposition to the centre is coming from the right, the centre will end up responding to and appropriating the right's agenda: "the real potency of the fascist renaissance across Europe is far better judged by how easily its appearance on a national stage can first panic, and then stampede, an erstwhile political centre to the right". This is how the BNP have reacted to Cameron's multiculturalism speech over the weekend:

Yes indeed, worrying times ahead. And in the UK at present the Left in its various groupings is probably as weak as it has ever been in terms of being any kind of mass movement - certainly one with real roots in the organised working class. In this vacuuum the fascists can posture in all sorts of pseudo leftish campaigns - and no doubt will do on a wide front. The German fascists could appear very Left indeed when it suited them in the late 1920's.

At the same time the EDL provocations show they can put plenty of bootboys on the streets too - truly a poisonous mix of ballot box and boot. I'm not at all sure that the Left can easily pull together the forces we could in the 70's and 80's to combat this at present.

Sorry to be gloomy - but we've got a bit of a growing challenge here, that I don't think we've quite faced before.

Ayatollah (speaking as someone who got involved a lot later than you; late 80s to early naughties) regarding the last part of your post;
I think its clear that the Left couldn't pull the same forces as it could in the 70s / 80s. How much of that failure is due to the difference in political organisation and level of struggle, I would say is quite big. As you'll know there were 3 day weeks under a Labour govt, an organised and active NF with a definite manifesto who were a household name as a party at least.
The same is not (yet) true of the EDL. At present, they seem to be lacking in ambition and organisation to be a new NF.

I agree there's a growing challenge, not faced before and not faced up to yet. Whatever the outcome of the EDL, it can be seen as a symptom of a disenfranchised, pissed off white working class, that will rear its head in some other way.

Mobilising street forces / squads is not the way to fight them at the moment I don't think. As well as many racists, there are also a huge number in their ranks who would hate to see themselves a such; I know some have given clumps to others who have been racist on their marches. (I take your point generally though, that if there was an organised fash presence ready to take up the mantle in these interesting political times we have ahead, the Left is in no place to respond; and this more than 15 years after 'Filling the Vacuuum')

A question I want to pose really, in response, (for another thread perhaps,) 'what attempts have there been to engage with EDL, is it seen as futile, are they dismissed as racists, etc? by The Left.

with the NF in the 70s, it was easier to mobilise disparate groups in opposition; of what makes up The Left in this country now, I bet there would be wide disagreements on how to counter, or even utilise the disenchantments of those in the EDL.

 

[ayatollah]

Interesting points Miktheword. Though I have to say I can't really see the EDL as just a bunch of confused disgruntled working class white blokes out for the odd afternoon stroll.. Their specific targetting of the (already demonized)Muslim community - and quite politically clever placards like "women aren't property" - shows a quite clever attempt to play the anti Muslim racist card whilst not get branded as out and out fascists.

I see the EDL street actions as a politically linked "street action" component of the BNP "respectable" ballot box tactic - whether intentional or accidental. Whether linked in the background to the BNP or not - EDL demos certainly give the bootboy fraternity something more interesting to do than election canvassing door to door !

The problem with an electoral strategy for fascists is that winning a few seats on a local council just doesn't give them the power required to invade Poland, or deport ethnic minorities ! It would certainly be interesting to know more about the motivations of those who go on EDL demos - and any BNP input - There are probably quite a mix of motives - as with those who vote BNP.

At the end of the day though a genuine socialist movement is the best defence against the siren appeal to a disgruntled white working class of the "fools socialism" of fascism. Bloody obvious stuff I agree - how to build such a force in the wreckage of the British Left is obviously the challenge.

 

[Red O]

And more:

http://www.ft.com/cms/s/0/ce56c4dc-3478-11e0-9ebc-00144feabdc0.html#axzz1DaXQPhPM

Le Pen daughter applauds Cameron

By Peggy Hollinger in Paris

Published: February 9 2011 18:43 | Last updated: February 9 2011 18:43

Marine Le Pen, the new leader of France’s extreme right National Front, has congratulated David Cameron, UK prime minister, for what she claimed was an endorsement of her party’s views on the failure of multiculturalism and immigration.

Ms Le Pen, elected to lead the National Front last month, said Mr Cameron’s rejection of multiculturalism in a speech in Munich last week marked a clear shift in British and European politics.

“It is exactly this type of statement that has barred us from public life for 30 years,” she told the Financial Times. “I sense an evolution at European level, even in classic governments. I can only congratulate him.”

 

[The39thStep]

And more:

http://www.ft.com/cms/s/0/ce56c4dc-3478-11e0-9ebc-00144feabdc0.html#axzz1DaXQPhPM

Le Pen daughter applauds Cameron

By Peggy Hollinger in Paris

Published: February 9 2011 18:43 | Last updated: February 9 2011 18:43

Marine Le Pen, the new leader of France’s extreme right National Front, has congratulated David Cameron, UK prime minister, for what she claimed was an endorsement of her party’s views on the failure of multiculturalism and immigration.

Ms Le Pen, elected to lead the National Front last month, said Mr Cameron’s rejection of multiculturalism in a speech in Munich last week marked a clear shift in British and European politics.

“It is exactly this type of statement that has barred us from public life for 30 years,” she told the Financial Times. “I sense an evolution at European level, even in classic governments. I can only congratulate him.”

which is exactly the same line as Griffin came out with. The trouble is that within every big lie is a grain of truth, the problem for us us which is the grain of truth and what is our response.


For years the liberal and cobweb left has issued just a straight rebuttal but from a working class view official multiculturalism has been divisive and its the right wing who are benefiting from that division.

 

[Proper Tidy]

For years the liberal and cobweb left has issued just a straight rebuttal but from a working class view official multiculturalism has been divisive and its the right wing who are benefiting from that division.

Innit

 

[audiotech]

Yeah, let's ban US baseball caps.

 

[LiamO]

Yeah, let's ban US baseball caps.

... and just allow english ones...

Look audiotech, do you find this whole 'failure of multiculturalism' issue problematic? If so,why not state your case instead of hiding behind snide, drive-by comments?

 

[treelover]

Snide comments are this boards bread and butter, its also funny when some people make consistent comments about the alienation, etc of the working class they are smeared, while others who say the same thing perhaps in more detail are lauded or agreed with.

 

[past caring]

Cry me a river....

 

[LiamO]

Snide comments are this boards bread and butter, its also funny when some people make consistent comments about the alienation, etc of the working class they are smeared, while others who say the same thing perhaps in more detail are lauded or agreed with.

so stop fuckin crying and make your point... stand your corner... man/woman up ffs.

How do you expect other posters to follow your cryptic whinging? Ihave no idea what you are on about.

 

[ayatollah]

It's a short leg that doesn't reach the knee



Hey, cryptic or what, figure that out LiamO !

 

[Citizen66]

Well i'm stumped.

 

[Demu]

Hi Ayatollah, good to hear you are still around.

Have you got hold of the book yet?

Apparently the printers are still having to deal with threats of legal action from the partner of Hann after the book revealed the truth about his past.

I believe that a clear and unequivocal response has been made via her solicitors carter ruck which sets the facts of the matter before her. I doubt any competent laywer would advise her to proceed after receiving this.

Perhaps her friends at Searchlight will finally tell her the truth….I doubt it.

Funnily enough, according to Hann’s CV in No Retreat, he was an activist in Manchester, while you were still in the North West…..I kid you not!

 

[ayatollah]

Hi DEMU - Yes still around - just very old and knackered .... gawd wot's that just dropped off now !....

Still not got hold of Beating the Fascists - (order with Amazon - still "out of stock"). Yes , at least from this thread's information, Hann does appear to have been that figure all too common on the Left - the street fighting fantasist. I certainly never met him.

Still, maybe some of his stuff in "No Retreat" is true... ? I have to say I still think the book is a good rollicking read - I liked Tilzey's bit anyway . I just view it as useful anti-fascist propaganda . After all - I was very inspired as a young man by Victor Serge's excellent "memoires of a revolutionary" -- but as far as I know the bugger made most of it up ! His old comrades probably read it and said "that bloody Victor - never made it out of the pub" .

The thing I was really gobsmacked about in Tilzey's tales in "No Retreat" is his account of being "accidentally" on the NF coach in Aytoun street when it was rudely attacked by outraged young workers (in old SWP parlance) ! I'd Never heard that story before ! To think our long association could so easily have been ended before it began by a lobbed brick on Big Noses head if he hadn't ducked when the coach windows went in ! - allegedly.

 

[Blagsta]

After all - I was very inspired as a young man by Victor Serge's excellent "memoires of a revolutionary" -- but as far as I know the bugger made most of it up !

Really? Never heard that before. Excellent book. Anyone shed any more light on this?

 

[bignose1]

Hi DEMU - Yes still around - just very old and knackered .... gawd wot's that just dropped off now !....

Still not got hold of Beating the Fascists - (order with Amazon - still "out of stock"). Yes , at least from this thread's information, Hann does appear to have been that figure all too common on the Left - the street fighting fantasist. I certainly never met him.

Still, maybe some of his stuff in "No Retreat" is true... ? I have to say I still think the book is a good rollicking read - I liked Tilzey's bit anyway . I just view it as useful anti-fascist propaganda . After all - I was very inspired as a young man by Victor Serge's excellent "memoires of a revolutionary" -- but as far as I know the bugger made most of it up ! His old comrades probably read it and said "that bloody Victor - never made it out of the pub" .

The thing I was really gobsmacked about in Tilzey's tales in "No Retreat" is his account of being "accidentally" on the NF coach in Aytoun street when it was rudely attacked by outraged young workers (in old SWP parlance) ! I'd Never heard that story before ! To think our long association could so easily have been ended before it began by a lobbed brick on Big Noses head if he hadn't ducked when the coach windows went in ! - allegedly.

That you Penney....fuck me youve got some fucking nerve...big nose... youd give jimmy durante a run for his money. You can be as gobsmacked as you want you skinny prick and you should know you led the fucking attack.

 

[ayatollah]

Hi Steve. Good to hear you are in such fine fettle. If you read futher back on this thread to page 34 you'll see I've been busy defending your heroic anti-fascist credentials (which I do stand by Steve ).

Not many people on this thread (and others) have had a good word to say for you Steve ... but I do.........Twaaaaaatttt !
Just a joke Bignose ! (with acknowledgement to the great Punk Poet , John Cooper Clarke)

Fair point on the Schnozzel front - but who but people over 100 years old would remember Jimmy Durante !

The extra amusing thing (not covered in No Retreat ) about the pre "Battle of Lewisham" Manchester morning "event" (apart from your astonishing role - as told in No Retreat of course) , ie, the Aytoun street "do" is that Mike Luft of Searchlight fame was arrested immediately afterwards - but eventually aquitted of all charges. Later he bitterly complained to me that the fash had mistaken his bearded visage for mine ! - and he had been just standing around observing events ! (only too true) He also claimed that he had organised a "team of Indian wrestlers" to attack the Fash coach - "but they were forced to call their daring op off because of the rough types who did do the job" ! He did actually say that - I kid you not - What a guy !

 

[bignose1]

Hi Steve. Good to hear you are in such fine fettle. If you read futher back on this thread to page 34 you'll see I've been busy defending your heroic anti-fascist credentials (which I do stand by Steve ).

Not many people on this thread (and others) have had a good word to say for you Steve ... but I do.........Twaaaaaatttt !
Just a joke Bignose ! (with acknowledgement to the great Punk Poet , John Cooper Clarke)

Fair point on the Schnozzel front - but who but people over 100 years old would remember Jimmy Durante !

The extra amusing thing (not covered in No Retreat ) about the pre "Battle of Lewisham" Manchester morning "event" (apart from your astonishing role - as told in No Retreat of course) , ie, the Aytoun street "do" is that Mike Luft of Searchlight fame was arrested immediately afterwards - but eventually aquitted of all charges. Later he bitterly complained to me that the fash had mistaken his bearded visage for mine ! - and he had been just standing around observing events ! (only too true) He also claimed that he had organised a "team of Indian wrestlers" to attack the Fash coach - "but they were forced to call their daring op off because of the rough types who did do the job" ! He did actually say that - I kid you not - What a guy !

Hi JP Glad you took it in the right vein. Hows it going. Talk of a squad reunion might be some way off but I if I ever bump into Ms Mole Ill give her your regrads....firmly but fairly... Squad Motto

 

[ayatollah]

I'm fine Steve - just a lot older. But aren't we all.

The motto was "Vicious but Fair" as I recall ! (From the Monty Python sketch about the "Dinsdales" ie. the Krays... as in "Yeh he nailed my head to a coffee table ... but I deserved it mind you ... always vicious but fair, the Dinsdales" )

Yes , a Squad reunion... lovely. Reminds me of an ancient Private Eye cartoon of a group of genteel middle class aged folks in classic cardigans,twinsets and pearls, slippers, flying geese on the wall, having a lovely cuppa and cakes round a table ... with the line "I just love these Angry Brigade Reunions , don't you Mavis "

 

[bignose1]

I'm fine Steve - just a lot older. But aren't we all.

The motto was "Vicious but Fair" as I recall ! (From the Monty Python sketch about the "Dinsdales" ie. the Krays... as in "Yeh he nailed my head to a coffee table ... but I deserved it mind you ... always vicious but fair, the Dinsdales" )

Yes , a Squad reunion... lovely. Reminds me of an ancient Private Eye cartoon of a group of genteel middle class aged folks in classic cardigans,twinsets and pearls, slippers, flying geese on the wall, having a lovely cuppa and cakes round a table ... with the line "I just love these Angry Brigade Reunions , don't you Mavis "

Yeah Vicious but Fair...some laffs a few tears...plenty of cunning plans...I loved our plotting sessions...wouldnt say we were up there with Army of Crime but we were a tight bunch and Ive great memories. Remember that first day in Strangeways we looked like we were out of Oliver with the clobber they gave us..
Ps How old would Jolley be now..

 

[ayatollah]

I'll always remember sitting in the cells after the trial, with you and the other Rochdale case lads . "let's play I Spy to pass the time" you suggested. " I Spy something beginning with "C".

We just couldn't bloody guess it. How many bloody objects could there be in a cell for gods sake ?

"What is it then Tilzey ?" we demanded.

"Convicts" you triumphantly announced !

How we laughed !.... or something

 

[Anudder Oik]

I liked the account by Liam O of the events at Jubilee Gardens. It would have been a valid addition to the book IMHO.

Anyone got any reminiscences of Waterloo? Like to hear more about it.

 

[bignose1]

I'll always remember sitting in the cells after the trial, with you and the other Rochdale case lads . "let's play I Spy to pass the time" you suggested. " I Spy something beginning with "C".

We just couldn't bloody guess it. How many bloody objects could there be in a cell for gods sake ?

"What is it then Tilzey ?" we demanded.

"Convicts" you triumphantly announced !

How we laughed !.... or something

My dad was a tailor, my grandfather was a tailor and my great great grandfather was a tailor...so I thought Id follow suit...

Just walked from where i work and came across the spot where (ahem).. Isaacs(of you'd better check me out Im connected fame !!) got his final (cough) warning..I laff thinking back of his dogs exiting a rapid stage left..all bark and dribble but definately nowhere in the loyalty stakes ...community justice at its finest.

 

[bignose1]

Shell island circa 1979...you were well impressed when I correctly identified the indigenous but rare natterjack toad...I have a few talents and frog spotting is one of them. I am also pretty good on fish(obviously).

I also recall being ticked off by you on numerous occasions for saying 'tricky isaac'(no relation to previously mentioned)

 

[ayatollah]

I still remember at my school (many years ago now) , if another kid wouldn't share a chocolate bar his fellow pupils would often say "you jew " in reproach , with no real understanding at all of what that hateful expression really meant. Hopefully British culture has advanced considerably since then - but given the BNP election showing in Barnsley yesterday, maybe not.

 

[malatesta32]

Crivvens, just read through the whole of this thread which took 2 sittings. Noticed someone had pasted the review by ‘Malatesta’ in it (#529). Not sure why the review is ‘sniffy’ as it says that the book is a good read (and its been reread several times here).
Joe Reilly rightly pointed out the error in our naming Graeme Atkinson as being the one charged by the SWP to dissolve the squads, it was John Deason according to Tilzey (p88). Apologies. The web quotes were to show that the fascists took AFA very seriously and that the new book is not exaggerated hooligan stuff as some will no doubt accuse it of being.

From experience AFA Northern Network was much more anarchist especially in places like Liverpool and Bolton. The book does focus more on London and Red Action and it is debatable that it gives an in-depth description of the activities up north. The idea of ‘writing your own’ is admittedly problematic as many people could not fill a book - as Tilzey and Hann’s book showed – but there is also the issue of time as well as memory.

Reading the posts from this thread there are already great stories like Liam’s #809 as well as more organisational stuff like Ayatollah #839. Researching the ‘Malatesta’ articles revealed there is a serious lack of photo documentation on the web as well. What should also be noted is how funny some of the stories are- BTF and No Retreat are very entertaining reads despite any criticisms.

It could be a good idea to get a website/blog to collate recollections from anti-fascists from the day, as well as those ongoing to do with the EDL. Easy enough. These could eventually be ordered, edited and published. There is a dearth of books on physical opposition to fascism but a great many stories floating about. Every antifascist has 1 good 1 at least! It needs to be organised as oral history projects are organised on a purely subjective basis but contextualised by an overall commentary. This is something we would be interested in helping co-ordinating. Anyone else?

 

[LiamO]

Write yer own...

Reading the posts from this thread there are already great stories like Liam’s #809 as well as more organisational stuff like Ayatollah #839. Researching the ‘Malatesta’ articles revealed there is a serious lack of photo documentation on the web as well. What should also be noted is how funny some of the stories are- BTF and No Retreat are very entertaining reads despite any criticisms.

It could be a good idea to get a website/blog to collate recollections from anti-fascists from the day, as well as those ongoing to do with the EDL. Easy enough. These could eventually be ordered, edited and published. There is a dearth of books on physical opposition to fascism but a great many stories floating about. Every antifascist has 1 good 1 at least! It needs to be organised as oral history projects are organised on a purely subjective basis but contextualised by an overall commentary. This is something we would be interested in helping co-ordinating. Anyone else?

Beaten to it!

BTF took years to write and a long time to publish. This was necessary because of the scope and size of the project and was, IMO, well worth it.

Rather than a website/talking shop I would favour a straight forward...

"I am/we are compiling a book of anecdotal recollections of the anti-fascist struggle in the 80's & 90's. It will be readily available (and probably free of charge) as an e-book within 3 months. It will be an organic document in that it will grow with time, so people can add to it as it goes on.

If you would like to contribute... do feel free to do so. If you would prefer a protracted, circular debate about who has the right to publish what, on behalf of whom... do feel free to g'way and fuck yourself"

There is a time for 'democracy' and inclusive discussion... and a time for just getting on and doing a thing.

 

[malatesta32]

agreed liam. i would say you were off to flying start with yr post mentioned earlier. im just trying to sound out what other antifascists feel about documenting the ongoing struggle as well as the AFA years similar. with the last of international brigaders etc its a timely reminder that we aint getting any younger and this oral history is vital to preserve. the antifascist struggle still goes on.
i think BTF is a cracker- i started reading it again this morning and it is funny in parts. that aspect should never be excluded cos even tho we were often in scarey stiautions we still maintained a sense of humour!
[

 

[manny-p]

Beaten to it!

BTF took years to write and a long time to publish. This was necessary because of the scope and size of the project and was, IMO, well worth it.

Rather than a website/talking shop I would favour a straight forward...

"I am/we are compiling a book of anecdotal recollections of the anti-fascist struggle in the 80's & 90's. It will be readily available (and probably free of charge) as an e-book within 3 months. It will be an organic document in that it will grow with time, so people can add to it as it goes on.

If you would like to contribute... do feel free to do so. If you would prefer a protracted, circular debate about who has the right to publish what, on behalf of whom... do feel free to g'way and fuck yourself"

There is a time for 'democracy' and inclusive discussion... and a time for just getting on and doing a thing.

Nice one, look forward to reading it.

 

[manny-p]

I still remember at my school (many years ago now) , if another kid wouldn't share a chocolate bar his fellow pupils would often say "you jew " in reproach , with no real understanding at all of what that hateful expression really meant. Hopefully British culture has advanced considerably since then - but given the BNP election showing in Barnsley yesterday, maybe not.

This was still happening in 2004 when I was still in school. So sadly not.