Artists pimps random cars at night with fantastic results

[ViolentPanda]

Taking London as an example. It's pretty easy to get from any point A to any point B within a reasonable time with departures happening every ten mins for buses, every twenty mins for trains and every few minutes for tubes. And travelling by car can be hampered by gridlock.

Well it isn't really anything like that outside of cities. Apart from the heavy traffic at peak times.

As someone who's mobility-impaired (about 1 in 9 Londoners are), my choices are limited. I can take buses (and pay the physical cost later), or I can use the 25% or so of rail and tube stations that are fully-accessible. This doesn't just affect disabled people, either. It's a bastard for people with shopping and/or children and/or buggies, as well as some older folk.
I know London's public transport is a jewel compared to most rural and provincial services, but compared to most other Euro-capitals it's an inaccessible disgrace. I've just come home from Berlin where the local transport authority (VBB) berates itself for being only 90% accessible!

 

[Citizen66]

As someone who's mobility-impaired (about 1 in 9 Londoners are), my choices are limited. I can take buses (and pay the physical cost later), or I can use the 25% or so of rail and tube stations that are fully-accessible. This doesn't just affect disabled people, either. It's a bastard for people with shopping and/or children and/or buggies, as well as some older folk.
I know London's public transport is a jewel compared to most rural and provincial services, but compared to most other Euro-capitals it's an inaccessible disgrace. I've just come home from Berlin where the local transport authority (VBB) berates itself for being only 90% accessible!

Fair enough. My point wasn't really to sing London's praises. Well only in the context of comparing it to places where a 20-30 min car drive takes over two hours on public transport with various changes.

 

[ViolentPanda]

Fair enough. My point wasn't really to sing London's praises. Well only in the context of comparing it to places where a 20-30 min car drive takes over two hours on public transport with various changes.

Yup. My parents, if they wish to visit the nearest large town (17 miles away), have a choice of two scheduled buses a day - that's it. 20 minute drive, or 45-60 minutes on a single-decker that is usually full by the time it gets to their village.

 

[teuchter]

This is why we should all be "anti car". That's the kind of situation our pro car society creates.

 

[Citizen66]

This is why we should all be "anti car". That's the kind of situation our pro car society creates.

Public transport was cut from above though to encourage car ownership.

 

[teuchter]

I know.

 

[SpamMisery]

As someone who's mobility-impaired (about 1 in 9 Londoners are)...

Wtf nearly 10% are mobility impaired?!! What's the criteria for that? Way higher than I would have guessed at.

 

[Puddy_Tat]

Wtf nearly 10% are mobility impaired?!! What's the criteria for that? Way higher than I would have guessed at.

That might be an under-estimate.

Some figures (including 2011 census data) here

There are 9.4 million disabled people in England, accounting for 18 per cent of the population

Less than 8 per cent of disabled people use wheelchairs. The majority of impairments are not visible

of course those figures were before the DWP / Atos policy of encouraging voluntary euthanasia was quite so far advanced...

 

[xenon]

Wtf nearly 10% are mobility impaired?!! What's the criteria for that? Way higher than I would have guessed at.

Have a think. Also almost 1 in 9 is more than 10%

Wheelchairs, crutches, sticks, frames, guide dogs, canes, need of support worker. Temp or otherwise. You might not see a lot of them about p'raps... Go figure.

 

[ViolentPanda]

Wtf nearly 10% are mobility impaired?!! What's the criteria for that? Way higher than I would have guessed at.

Mobility-impaired basically means having to use walking aids of one sort or another, or alternative means such as wheelchairs and mobility scooters. 1 in 9 is conservative,and the original numbers (undertaken by JRT I believe) were drawn up in 2009 and only included those with permanent mobility issues, not those with conditions such as osteo or rheumatoid arthritis that are exacerbated seasonally. The percentage will only increase, as we have an ageing population. People may not see a lot of people with mobility problems. Perhaps it's worth reflecting why - part of the problem is that without transport that caters to our needs, we're trapped indoors.

 

[SpamMisery]

Also almost 1 in 9 is more than 10%

Sorry. Initially I wrote "10%" then I remembered how pinickerty people on urban were and hurriedly added the word "almost".

Anyway, cheers VP. Still find it surprising

 

[ViolentPanda]

This is why we should all be "anti car". That's the kind of situation our pro car society creates.

TBF, that's how local public transport in north Norfolk has been at least as long as I can remember (40-odd years) - people there were pushed into a car culture on the basis of their being no alternative a decade at least before Thatcher started fiddling with rural transport.

 

[fredfelt]

Mobility-impaired basically means having to use walking aids of one sort or another, or alternative means such as wheelchairs and mobility scooters. 1 in 9 is conservative,and the original numbers (undertaken by JRT I believe were drawn up in 2009 and only included those with permanent mobility issues, not those with conditions such as osteo or rheumatoid arthritis that are exacerbated seasonally. The percentage will only increase, as we have an ageing population. People may not see a lot of people with mobility problems. Perhaps it's worth reflecting why - part of the problem is that without transport that caters to our needs, we're trapped indoors.

To me it seems that provision of decent cycle infrastructure is often seen as being at odds with enabling mobility for the mobility impaired - but I don't think this needs to be the case.

For people who use mobility scooters and wheelchairs decent cycle lanes should be perfect - you have a flat surface away from motorised traffic. In practice I've no idea of how useful they actually are, but while living in Holland you'd regularly share the cycle path with people on mobility scooters. There's also ailments which can diminish when cycling and also relieved through cycling, parkinson's and some forms of arthritis come to mind.

It's not going to be suitable for everyone, but I think our failure to provide anything near a decent cycle network has a negative impact on a much broader segment of society than just the stereotypical lycra clad cyclists.

 

[ViolentPanda]

To me it seems that provision of decent cycle infrastructure is often seen as being at odds with enabling mobility for the mobility impaired - but I don't think this needs to be the case.

For people who use mobility scooters and wheelchairs decent cycle lanes should be perfect - you have a flat surface away from motorised traffic. In practice I've no idea of how useful they actually are, but while living in Holland you'd regularly share the cycle path with people on mobility scooters. There's also ailments which can diminish when cycling and also relieved through cycling, parkinson's and some forms of arthritis come to mind.

It's not going to be suitable for everyone, but I think our failure to provide anything near a decent cycle network has a negative impact on a much broader segment of society than just the stereotypical lycra clad cyclists.

Having just returned from Berlin, I was impressed at the fact of a lot of (powered) tricycle use, and the fact that bike-shops pretty much all catered for a very diverse customer base, including disabled people. And yep, mobility scooters and powered wheelchairs using the cycle lanes in Berlin seemed absolutely natural.