Are you an anarchist but not a member of an anarchist organisation?

[brogdale]

I know it had miners (oops, crossposted with CC there), what else should I know about? May have mentioned this before but All the Devils are Here is an interesting book about Kent, doesn't really tell much about the proud radical tradition though.

Oooh...sounds like i'm going to have to sketch out the chapter headings of the book I'll never write!

Much of Kent's radical history is very historical and some of it not really 'indigenous' as it were, but here goes with the stories of resistance:

1. The anti-Roman imperial warfare/'guerrilla resistance' of the Cantiaci to the various invasions of the imperialists culminating in defeat to the imperialists at the Battle of Medway.

2. The Peasants' revolt ( Wat Tyler's rebellion) against the taxes levied to fight war.

3. Jack Cade's rebellion in 1450 in which the "Captain of Kent" led peasants in a revolutionary attempt to take the state from the monarchy who corruptly imposed taxes for war.

4. As Count Cuckula mentioned above, various instances of revolutionary communities that emerged when the 'world was turned upside down' including the Diggers' community at Cox Hall near Dover.

5. The Nore (Chatham) Naval mutiny which, under Richard Parker, transformed from the 'normal' reasons for mutiny into a more explicit, revolutionary, republican action.

6. As iona mentioned above, the1830 Swing Riots protesting mechanisation, the Poor Law and starvation wages were sparked in East Kent in the Elham Valley between Canterbury and Folkestone.

7. The 1838 Battle of Bossenden wood, which I've already wittered about here, in which the rural poor, led by Sir William Courtenay, in villages around Faversham & Canterbury rebelled against their employers and ended up engaged in "the last rising of the agricultural labourers and the last battle fought on English soil."

8. Post WW1 radicalism including the 1920 NFDDSS activism and agitation of the ex-servicemen employed at the Woolwich Arsenal that spooked the authorities into forming the state controlled RBL.

9. The collieries of the Kent coalfield opened and expanded after WW1 and the demand for skilled labour meant that many of the most militant miners from the traditional coalfields who were sacked/black-listed for 1926 action found work in Kent. This tradition of militancy stayed with the Kent miners through to 1984.

and I'm sure that there's far more!

 

[HoratioCuthbert]

I'm an anarchist

I'm inactive
Im a carer
fuck you
im tired


Thats the anarchist carer poem

I dunno how this whisky fuelled nonsense got any likes at all jfc
Yeah more just being all the way up here and with child, hid will come together one day. Although maybe less on the whisky so
I don’t incapacitate masel before then.

 

[BristolEcho]

Soldiers?

I feel it's a bit more complicated. I felt I was targeted by the army at quite a young age, I didn't join, but I can obviously see how people get sucked into that. You could make the same arguments for the other services, but I don't see it as the same.

I wouldn't organise with someone who was actively in the army.

 

[AmateurAgitator]

Oooh...sounds like i'm going to have to sketch out the chapter headings of the book I'll never write!

Much of Kent's radical history is very historical and some of it not really 'indigenous' as it were, but here goes with the stories of resistance:

1. The anti-Roman imperial warfare/'guerrilla resistance' of the Cantiaci to the various invasions of the imperialists culminating in defeat to the imperialists at the Battle of Medway.

2. The Peasants' revolt ( Wat Tyler's rebellion) against the taxes levied to fight war.

3. Jack Cade's rebellion in 1450 in which the "Captain of Kent" led peasants in a revolutionary attempt to take the state from the monarchy who corruptly imposed taxes for war.

4. As Count Cuckula mentioned above, various instances of revolutionary communities that emerged when the 'world was turned upside down' including the Diggers' community at Cox Hall near Dover.

5. The Nore (Chatham) Naval mutiny which, under Richard Parker, transformed from the 'normal' reasons for mutiny into a more explicit, revolutionary, republican action.

6. As iona mentioned above, the1830 Swing Riots protesting mechanisation, the Poor Law and starvation wages were sparked in East Kent in the Elham Valley between Canterbury and Folkestone.

7. The 1838 Battle of Bossenden wood, which I've already wittered about here, in which the rural poor, led by Sir William Courtenay, in villages around Faversham & Canterbury rebelled against their employers and ended up engaged in "the last rising of the agricultural labourers and the last battle fought on English soil."

8. Post WW1 radicalism including the 1920 NFDDSS activism and agitation of the ex-servicemen employed at the Woolwich Arsenal that spooked the authorities into forming the state controlled RBL.

9. The collieries of the Kent coalfield opened and expanded after WW1 and the demand for skilled labour meant that many of the most militant miners from the traditional coalfields who were sacked/black-listed for 1926 action found work in Kent. This tradition of militancy stayed with the Kent miners through to 1984.

and I'm sure that there's far more!

This is really interesting stuff. And yes, it was Jack Cades' uprising I was referring to regarding the Archbishop of Canterbury being beheaded I believe.

Thankyou for sharing all this info. That would be a brilliant book aswell.

 

[AmateurAgitator]

I wasn't intending to bad mouth Kent! I grew up there and there are so many things I love about the place and very many of the people who live there. Indeed, there are certain parts of the county which will always feel like home whenever I visit.

But much of it does also feel, as you say, reactionary and conservative. This is only an impression mind, the only actual evidence I have is anecdotal and based upon things I've directly experienced.

I'm also aware that Kent has it's own proud history of protest and rebellion stretching all the way back to Wat Tyler. So again, I wasn't meaning to denigrate the county's radical credentials!

I didn't know about the Kent ACG but am pleased to hear it exists and is intending to grow and become more active.

I live on the road so I never know how long I'll be staying in any one area. This makes it difficult to get too involved with any local group. Having said that, I have family and friends in Kent and I often visit. I'm not sure if there is much I could do to help but I'd be interested in meeting. And if I there is anything I can do then there's a good chance I'd be up for doing it. Maybe next time I'm about I'll send you a pm. In the meantime I'll simply offer my best wishes for the Kent ACG and hope that you can have an influential and inspirational effect in the area.

Nice. Thankyou. It would be good to meet up with another likeminded person.

 

[AmateurAgitator]

There's no mention of the Archbishop of Canterbury being beheaded or executed in the wikipedia article about the Jack Cade rebellion. But I'm sure I heard something like that about Canterbury, might have been lords, or other King's men, who were executed. Certainly, the Bishop of Salisbury was executed, and the Lord High Treasurer was beheaded at Cheapside in London.

 

[Pickman's model]

There's no mention of the Archbishop of Canterbury being beheaded or executed in the wikipedia article about the Jack Cade rebellion. But I'm sure I heard something like that about Canterbury, might have been lords, or other King's men, who were executed. Certainly, the Bishop of Salisbury was executed, and the Lord High Treasurer was beheaded at Cheapside in London.

It was in London the archbishop was killed in 1381 iirc

 

[Monkeygrinder's Organ]

Simon Sudbury - Wikipedia

en.m.wikipedia.org

The Archbishop of Canterbury was beheaded during the 1381 Peasants Revolt so maybe it's that one that's being referred to.

 

[brogdale]

Simon Sudbury - Wikipedia

en.m.wikipedia.org

The Archbishop of Canterbury was beheaded during the 1381 Peasants Revolt so maybe it's that one that's being referred to.

Yep, that's it; 69 years before Jack Cade it was Way Tyler's lot that set about the beheadings...

rebels entered the Tower of London, killing Simon Sudbury, Lord Chancellor, and Robert Hales, Lord High Treasurer, whom they found inside.

 

[AmateurAgitator]

Not wanting to derail this thread and make it all about history, but I'd love to know more about that Digger's community at Cox Hall. Don't know if that's possible though.

 

[brogdale]

Not wanting to derail this thread and make it all about history, but I'd love to know more about that Digger's community at Cox Hall. Don't know if that's possible though.

AFAIK, there's not much certain evidence out there.
Most sources claim that Cox Hall or Hill was NW of Dover, up on the hill near Sheperdswell (i think) or at Linton, Maidstone. which is maybe confusing it with Cox Heath?
I'll try to find out some more...but not had much luck so far.

 

[klang]

anarchist veg box scheme

is that still going?

 

[AmateurAgitator]

AFAIK, there's not much certain evidence out there.
Most sources claim that Cox Hall or Hill was NW of Dover, up on the hill near Sheperdswell (i think) or at Linton, Maidstone. which is maybe confusing it with Cox Heath?
I'll try to find out some more...but not had much luck so far.

Thankyou brogdale. This is very interesting. It was a long time ago, and ofcourse this is hidden history in a sense.

 

[brogdale]

Thankyou brogdale. It was a long time ago, and ofcourse this is hidden history in a sense.

This is a footnote from Hill's The World Turned Upside Down:



...but you're right, we've probably derailed enough now...maybe you'd like to start a Radical Kent thread over in History? I'd chip in

 

[AmateurAgitator]

maybe you'd like to start a Radical Kent thread over in History? I'd chip in

Good idea. The thread is up now.

 

[Rob Ray]

Any modern anarchist books people would recommend? I was going to start a new thread recently, but think it's okay to ask here.

Just to cut it down a bit, how modern you meaning, where on the line between intro-knowledgeable and, particularly in the latter case, any particular strand? Eg. for a modern take inquiring about trends in anarchism in the latter part of the 2010s Anarchism is Movement is interesting, but maybe not so easygoing for a newbie. Fighting for Ourselves is fairly accessible and relatively modern, but specific to anarcho-syndicalism. About Anarchism and Anarchy in Action are broadly good for intros, but only modernish (latter 20th century). I'd rate Rebel Alliances for a class struggle anarchism overview (albeit it's a little overly harsh on what actually counts), and maybe Bookchin for ecological stuff though again, ageing somewhat in terms of the word "modern".

 

[hitmouse]

Not wanting to derail this thread and make it all about history, but I'd love to know more about that Digger's community at Cox Hall. Don't know if that's possible though.

Do we need an "are you a digger but not a member of a digger organisation" thread?

Just to cut it down a bit, how modern you meaning, where on the line between intro-knowledgeable and, particularly in the latter case, any particular strand? Eg. for a modern take inquiring about trends in anarchism in the latter part of the 2010s Anarchism is Movement is interesting, but maybe not so easygoing for a newbie. Fighting for Ourselves is fairly accessible and relatively modern, but specific to anarcho-syndicalism. About Anarchism and Anarchy in Action are broadly good for intros, but only modernish (latter 20th century)

Has anyone read Milstein's Anarchism and its Aspirations? That sounds like it might fit the description of "decent intro text from the past decade". But then I've not read it so idk. I quite like Milstein but I'm sure people can find things to kvetch about in their work?

 

[brogdale]

Do we need an "are you a digger but not a member of a digger organisation" thread?

Oh gawd...you'll have the allotment crowd in here, then!

 

[Sue]

Do we need an "are you a digger but not a member of a digger organisation" thread?

Oh digger.

 

[rich!]

is that still going?

yeah, week 82 last week

we're still doing ~80 boxes a week, currently 2/3 of those are solidarity boxes for people in need, and 1/3 are paid for by people who want a veg box.

 

[AmateurAgitator]

Theres a vegan restaurant place in Canterbury called the Veg Box. I've known them to be atleast sympathetic to anarchism aswell. Funny that.

 

[Pickman's model]

Theres a vegan restaurant place in Canterbury called the Veg Box. I've known them to be atleast sympathetic to anarchism aswell. Funny that.

Not all vegan places take the same enlightened attitude - take the fascist cup cake place in Camden for example Are Neo-Nazis Running a Vegan Cupcake Shop in London? - VICE

 

[petee]

Are Neo-Nazis Running a Vegan Cupcake Shop in London?

i'll take "sentences i never imagined" for $100, Alex

 

[A380]

It was in London the archbishop was killed in 1381 iirc

Simon Sudbury - Wikipedia

en.m.wikipedia.org

The Archbishop of Canterbury was beheaded during the 1381 Peasants Revolt so maybe it's that one that's being referred to.

Despite the warm fuzzy feeling many on the left have about the Peasants Revolt (Yay Watt Tylor and Red Dicken!) including me sometimes, given it serves as a kind of marker for the death of feudalism (to be replaced by, erm checks notes, capitalism) it's often forgotten it there was a significant amount of racism in the forms of attacks on Flemish immigrants in London by the revolutionaries...

Here to suck the fun out of everything,

 

[Rob Ray]

Oh forgot probably the two major titles in terms of public consumption of the last few years: The Government of No-one by Ruth Kinna as a general trade intro and the full-on 744-page academic tome Handbook of Anarchism by Carl Levy, the latter of which is horrifically expensive but obviously should not under any circumstances be downloaded for free via any sites that rhyme with wibgen.

 

[hitmouse]

Oh gawd...you'll have the allotment crowd in here, then!

yeah, week 82 last week

we're still doing ~80 boxes a week, currently 2/3 of those are solidarity boxes for people in need, and 1/3 are paid for by people who want a veg box.

Incredibly prescient post, that! Clearly we have at least one poster who can check the "I am a member of a digger organisation" option, then.

 

[danny la rouge]

The Government of No-one by Ruth Kinna as a general trade intro and

Is the Kinna book any good? The only one of hers I read gave too much space to “anarcho”-capitalism and primitivism at every step, as if they were major contradictions to the current of anarchist thought. I found that quite annoying.

 

[steeplejack]

I'm much more sympathetic to anarchism and anarchist ways of organising since I joined the boards 20 years ago, not really a joiner now though. If anarchists are working on an issue and I can be useful in achieiving something, then I would contribute.

I agree with others who say that labels such as "anarchist", "Marxist", "communist" are from two centuries ago and not really at all helpful in navigating the bad hand we've all been dealt in 2021. The again I'm not sure what you do about that- have a re-brand and call your self "Consensus" or "Working it Out" weith associated sound logo and branded leisurewear / hi vis jackets?

fuck that.

 

[Rob Ray]

Is the Kinna book any good? The only one of hers I read gave too much space to “anarcho”-capitalism and primitivism at every step, as if they were major contradictions to the current of anarchist thought. I found that quite annoying.

Haven't read it myself but the KSL review wasn't too scathing.

 

[Dom Traynor]

I'm much more sympathetic to anarchism and anarchist ways of organising since I joined the boards 20 years ago, not really a joiner now though. If anarchists are working on an issue and I can be useful in achieiving something, then I would contribute.

I agree with others who say that labels such as "anarchist", "Marxist", "communist" are from two centuries ago and not really at all helpful in navigating the bad hand we've all been dealt in 2021. The again I'm not sure what you do about that- have a re-brand and call your self "Consensus" or "Working it Out" weith associated sound logo and branded leisurewear / hi vis jackets?

fuck that.

Consignia would be good.