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A thank you to Brexiteers.

Yossarian said:
The Project Fear Horse is dead? :(

I thought it had retired to a nice farm somewhere because there wasn't any work left for it to do.
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You would be forgiven for thinking that. But, planet remain - buoyed by the ‘Bregret’ polling- clearly believe the time has come to let its stallion loose again. But, as with the attempt to use the nag to force a second referendum it’s doomed to fall at the first fence and be carted off to the pedigree chum factory.
 
Smokeandsteam said:
No amount of thrashing or flogging the Project Fear Horse is going to save it you know?

The IMF Report - on which your article is based - does indeed make clear that Britain’s economic growth would likely have been stronger had the country voted to remain but it also shows a) that Britain’s growth was mediocre before the vote and will continue to be mediocre for some time to come, and that b) between 2016 and 2024 Britain’s economy will have grown at almost exactly the same rate as Germany’s.

The reasons for the collapse in living standards, our disintegrating productivity and the current cost of living crisis are multiple and overlapping. The idea that Brexit is to blame is laughably stupid. Repeating it over and over again in shriller terms does not change the essential stupidity of the statement.
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Your post reminded me of this graph
FhCSlkKWQAA2YaK

From this New Statesman article (archive.ph link here)

Interesting for how significant it shows the 2008 crisis to have been.
 
inva said:
Your post reminded me of this graph
FhCSlkKWQAA2YaK

From this New Statesman article (archive.ph link here)

Interesting for how significant it shows the 2008 crisis to have been.
Click to expand...

Yes, the 2007 financial crisis, disproportionately affected the UK and has had a longer run effect as the graph below indicates. This shouldn’t surprise anyone given the collapse of the UK’s manufacturing base, low levels of investment and the emphasis placed by the Thatcherites and Blairites on the financial services sector, but it’s been consistently underplayed by the commentary on the economy.

 
Smokeandsteam

it would be polite if you, you know, actually replied and gave us your opinion:

bimble said:
It’s not to blame for all our economic ills obvs but has it made these things you’re listing (living standards growth productivity etc) better or has it made these things worse or made no difference at all.
which is it what do you think.
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bimble said:
Brexit has had no impact on the economic situation in this country is that what you think?

Or, it’s only made it a bit shitter, not a lot.
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or have you got bimble on ignore?
 
Smokeandsteam said:
Happy Anniversary to all of the posters on this thread :thumbs:

As a treat, here’s news of the latest crime of the Brexshiteers…starting the war in Ukraine!!

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Man is an arse. The EU's response to thee April Fool's exercise that was the precursor to the invasion , the EU was days behind in its response and was less accurate than even the Sun had been several days earlier. After the actual invasion he was calling for more EUrope, whilst completely ignoring French and Dutch extremely rapid deployment to NATO's border in Romania.
 
Smokeandsteam said:
No amount of thrashing or flogging the Project Fear Horse is going to save it you know?

The IMF Report - on which your article is based - does indeed make clear that Britain’s economic growth would likely have been stronger had the country voted to remain but it also shows a) that Britain’s growth was mediocre before the vote and will continue to be mediocre for some time to come, and that b) between 2016 and 2024 Britain’s economy will have grown at almost exactly the same rate as Germany’s.

The reasons for the collapse in living standards, our disintegrating productivity and the current cost of living crisis are multiple and overlapping. The idea that Brexit is to blame is laughably stupid. Repeating it over and over again in shriller terms does not change the essential stupidity of the statement.
Click to expand...
Agree with much of this, but there's something of a contradiction in what you say. On the one hand you say that the IMF report does make clear that the UK's economic growth would likely have been stronger had it retained membership of the supra state, but on the other you say that the idea that leaving is to blame for for weak/negative economic growth is laughably stupid.

As it happens I was always under the impression that Brexiteers always accepted that weakened economic growth would be a price worth paying for the sovereignty? Was the lexiteer position different? Did lexiteers think that brexit would lead to accelerated economic growth?

I'm also always amused when supporters of brexit cast the exiting as having no impact on the actual existing rotten fundamentals of the UK economy; kind of begs the question...well, what was the point, then?
 
bimble said:
I hope they haven’t got me on ignore I think more likely my question is just too annoying so it has to be ignored, until 2039 or something.
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You aren’t on ignore Bimble. If you read the post you replied to you’ll see that I wrote “The IMF Report - on which your article is based - does indeed make clear that Britain’s economic growth would likely have been stronger had the country voted to remain but it also shows a) that Britain’s growth was mediocre before the vote and will continue to be mediocre for some time to come, and that b) between 2016 and 2024 Britain’s economy will have grown at almost exactly the same rate as Germany’s.”
 
If things were going well instead of being in the shitter I wonder if the same people would be explaining that it was entirely because of a complex web of different factors totally unrelated to Brexit, and you'd be a fool to think otherwise
 
bimble said:
So it’s made things worse but blaming it - all on its own - is stupid. Blaming it as a contributing factor, a driver for some of our decline, for making things somewhat worse, is fine. Ok then, we basically agree.
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Brexit, as enacted by the Tories, has contributed to the current problem. But, as the IMF report makes clear, over a medium term period (2016-2024) it’s pretty negligible. The same report by the way indicates that the UK will grow more quickly than the EU by 2027.

The point I’m making, which planet remain seems determined to ignore, is that blaming Brexit for the economic decline of the UK is economically illiterate.
 
brogdale said:
I think it's safe to assume that cunts like Mogg have already benefitted hugely.
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of course moved his money to nearest European centre whilst preaching the benefits of leaving to the working man

less immigrants , better wages and taking back control

hmm the experiment is not working but some people will defend it to the end
 
aye food on the shelves now because loads of people cannot afford the prices because getting rid of Boris let the hard exiters take over and fuck the country over completely

and the next replacement is ruining every public service

Success
 
brogdale said:
Agree with much of this, but there's something of a contradiction in what you say. On the one hand you say that the IMF report does make clear that the UK's economic growth would likely have been stronger had it retained membership of the supra state, but on the other you say that the idea that leaving is to blame for for weak/negative economic growth is laughably stupid.
Click to expand...
No. I don’t say that. I say “The IMF Report - on which your article is based - does indeed make clear that Britain’s economic growth would likely have been stronger had the country voted to remain but it also shows a) that Britain’s growth was mediocre before the vote and will continue to be mediocre for some time to come, and that b) between 2016 and 2024 Britain’s economy will have grown at almost exactly the same rate as Germany’s.”


brogdale said:
As it happens I was always under the impression that Brexiteers always accepted that weakened economic growth would be a price worth paying for the sovereignty? Was the lexiteer position different? Did lexiteers think that brexit would lead to accelerated economic growth?
Click to expand...

For LeFT supporters the view was always that leaving opened up the possibility of economic growth through rebuilding and prioritising a national economy based on public ownership, investment in infrastructure via a national investment bank and via strengthened collective bargaining arrangements: all things within reach at the time of the vote, all things still within reach if the political will and organisation can be mustered to fight for it.

brogdale said:
I'm also always amused when supporters of brexit cast the exiting as having no impact on the actual existing rotten fundamentals of the UK economy; kind of begs the question...well, what was the point, then?
Click to expand...

You’ll have to show where that’s been argued on our side.
 
Spymaster said:
In fairness it was only the summer of 2021 when people on this thread were posting pictures of empty supermarket shelves, screaming "BREXIT DONE IT, NOT COVID" and trying to convince us that there'd never be full supermarkets again.

They were wrong about pretty much everything.
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Tbh they were very lucky that Covid came along and masked the disaster that brexit was going to be - what’s been left is just things getting steadily worse bit by bit.
 
Spymaster said:
In fairness it was only the summer of 2021 when people on this thread were posting pictures of empty supermarket shelves, screaming "BREXIT DONE IT, NOT COVID" and trying to convince us that there'd never be full supermarkets again.

They were wrong about pretty much everything.
Click to expand...

Yup. I also seem to remember project remain attacking workers for fighting for pay rises in areas previously low paid due to the free movement of labour on the basis that it would create inflation.

They seem to not think that anymore…
 
:hmm: hmm who on project remain was fighting against high pay for workers

if you link to a tory minister the party that gaves us Brexit, I'm going to be a little suspicious


any promises for higher wages from the leave side at least Tory related was bullshite as the last few years has shown
 
Ax^ said:
:hmm: hmm who on project remain was fighting against high pay for workers

if you link to a tory minister the party that gaves us Brexit, I'm going to be a little suspicious


any promises for higher wages from the leave side at least Tory related was bullshite as the last few years has shown
Click to expand...
Scroll back on this very thread Ax.
 
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