Woolwich soldier killed (was "Did cops just shoot 2 dead in woolwich?")

[butchersapron]

how clear do i have to make this...jihadists should not be running about hacking soldiers heads off in london or Damascus, British soldiers should not be running about hacking peoples heads off either . Not even nazi heads , or japanese heads, or Malayan communist heads, or Maus Maus heads or Argentinian heads . And not Islamic heads. But the fact is they both do . And to me theres fuck all difference who does it . And what bemuses me is the attempts by various quarters in Britain to occupy the moral high ground when it comes to the entire business of running around chopping your enemies head off like a fucking lunatic .

No difference. All the same. Until the brits are victims. It shows that your whole ieda is based on some beheadings being better than others - and of course, it's not the beheading that you don't like, it's the reaction of british people around beheadings.

 

[Athos]

Cowards for attacking an innocent man who can't fight back?

Are you suggesting that any combatant who carries the advantage in an asymmetrical conflict is necessarily a coward?

 

[telbert]

But they expected to die yesterday and were very willing to die (as well as murder). By chance, they are both alive. If they survive they will spend decades in prison. They left home yesterday to kill kuffars and sacrifice their lives.

If they had sneakily murdered and hid, expecting to get away with it, you might have a case for saying they are cowards, but that's not what happened at all. They nonchalantly waited for armed Plod and their own probable demise. It seems they hoped to take one or two Plod with them, but they showed absolutely no sign of wanting to escape or survive.

They drove a vehicle on the pavement at an unsupecting unarmed man,knocked him over and then they both hacked him to death.Take away the jihadist thing and every newspaper story today would contain the word coward. And they would be right.

 

[butchersapron]

Are you suggesting that any combatant who carries the advantage in an asymmetrical conflict is necessarily a coward?

Are you suggeting this is something really important and worth discussing?

 

[thedockerslad]

Poor muslims couldn't even afford a axe.

 

[telbert]

Poor muslims couldn't even afford a axe.

Nurse!! He's out of his bed again.

 

[butchersapron]

Yeah they were cowards. Pathetic to not give the other bloke a chance cowards (immediate cowardice) , pathetic cowards who thought their life was more important than anyone elses (philosophical/theological cowardice) - wasting your life ain't brave, it's cowardice (kiddy cowardice).

 

[Casually Red]

No difference. All the same. Until the brits are victims. It shows that your whole ieda is based on some beheadings being better than others - and of course, it's not the beheading that you don't like, it's the reaction of british people around beheadings.

no it seriously is the fucking beheadings I dont like, and I take exception to the fact that sections of the British public only seem not to like some of them . How you arrived at such a twisted conclusion from anything Ive said is a fucking mystery .

 

[butchersapron]

no it seriously is the fucking beheadings I dont like, and I take exception to the fact that sections of the British public only seem not to like some of them . How you arrived at such a twisted conclusion from anything Ive said is a fucking mystery .

Where is your anti beheading campaign. Your general horror. No, we find it being a general vice of the brits and a delight for them to ignore it.

 

[Casually Red]

Are you suggesting that any combatant who carries the advantage in an asymmetrical conflict is necessarily a coward?

itthere seems to be a lot of it on here . I fucking hate jihadists but I dont regard them as cowards . A failure to jump aboard that one seems to get you labelled and accused of all sorts.

 

[Casually Red]

Yeah they were cowards. Pathetic not give rhe other bloke a chance cowards, pathetic cowards who thought their life was more important than anyone elses - wasting your life ain't brave, it's cowardice.

i see were your coming from now, they should have challenged him to a duel in order not to be seen as cowards in your eyes .

 

[Athos]

Are you suggeting this is something really important and worth discussing?

Not especially, no. But then I don't take 'always being right on the internet' as seriously as you.

I was interested in Frogwoman's idea of cowardice, that's all. Sorry to have derailed the thread from your thrilling cryptic spat with Casually Red.

 

[kenny g]

A shitty way to kill someone.

 

[Casually Red]

I suppose but what makes them cowardly I guess is the fact that their victim had absolutely no chance of survival.

that certainly doesnt make someone a coward.

 

[treelover]

Ok.. allow me to set you all straight.. after yesterdays horrific brutal murder of our fallen hero Lee Rigby, the individuals you accuse of being part of the English defence league actually aren't ANY part of EDL. my partner is in the forces they're good friends of mine,& they went with all intentions of it being a peacful protest & it was on thier part..Several of them got verbally attacked by UFA brandishing & waving Afghani flags & being allowed to do so by the police..my friends who WAS being peaceful, go sent away & told to put thier st George cross flag away .. PC Crowd gone mad.. I'm proud of all of them for ( however small) they made a stand & stood up for our lads & lasses in our armed forces!!! They didn't use violence so what's the problem? Min

looks like some tension in Sheff, though still confusing what happened, surprised national media hasn't picked up on it.

ah Look North are saying it was EDL

 

[Anudder Oik]

i see were your coming from now, they should have challenged him to a duel in order not to be seen as cowards in your eyes .

No, they should have just killed themselves and got their miserable existances over with and done everyone else a favour.

Your stance is ultra leftist, you come across like a hipocrite. We can't mourn or feel angered about this violent act because there are other acts, miles away, that we don't react the same to because we don't fucking see them. You are abstract.

 

[telbert]

A shitty way to kill someone.

Yeah,so much shittier than the nice ways.

 

[Casually Red]

A shitty way to kill someone.

I agree. Absolutely nobody deserves to die like that .

 

[butchersapron]

Not especially, no. But then I don't take 'always being right on the internet' as seriously as you.

I was interested in Frogwoman's idea of courage, that's all. Sorry to have derailed the thread from your thrilling cryptic spat with Casually Red.

You didn't sound interested, you sounded dismissive.

Don't be bruised though - that is actually a great idea for a thread.

 

[telbert]

that certainly doesnt make someone a coward.

of course it does.

 

[Frumious B.]

If they've been brainwashed enough to carry out a suicide attack, which this was, perhaps they sincerely believe the 72 virgins in paradise bollocks. So perhaps choosing death doesn't require so much courage? I dunno, being an atheist I find it hard to see mortality and the afterlife from a god-botherer's POV.

 

[butchersapron]

If they've been brainwashed enough to carry out a suicide attack, which this was, perhaps they sincerely believe the 72 virgins in paradise bollocks. So perhaps choosing death doesn't require so much courage? I dunno, being an atheist I find it hard to see mortality and the afterlife from a god-botherer's POV.

I'm not sure anyone isn't saying they weren't muslims and radically driven muslims with their own muislim derived agenda.

 

[likesfish]

There scum mothing brave about them hope they like prison food they will never get put especially as jihadist nonsense has no end state

 

[Casually Red]

Your stance is ultra leftist, you come across like a hipocrite. We can't mourn or feel angered about this violent act because there are other acts, miles away, that we don't react the same to because we don't fucking see them. You are abstract.

bollocks, im certainly not an ultra leftist and absolutely nowhere have I even suggested you shouldnt feel angry or mourn over it . Thatd be inhuman . Nobody deserves that kind of death .

 

[Frumious B.]

I'm trying to examine the point about courage and cowardice.

 

[Athos]

You didn't sound interested, you sounded dismissive.

Don't be bruised though - that is actually a great idea for a thread.

I wasn't at all dismissive; I was asking a genuine question. Maybe you're projecting again.

And (with due credit Longfellow) your hard words would only bruise the heart of a child.

 

[butchersapron]

There scum mothing brave about them hope they like prison food they will never get put especially as jihadist nonsense has no end state

Just like,them paki taxis drivers

 

[butchersapron]

I wasn't at all dismissive; i was asking a genuine question. Maybe you're projecting again.

And (with due credit Longfellow) your hard words would only bruise the heart of a child.

Show me that child. And its cleaner.

 

[Casually Red]

of course it does.

nope, a coward is someone who is too afraid to carry out an act for which they would then almost certainly face serious and possibly fatal consequences. While almost everything else thats been said about them is correct cowardice isnt . Thats not any kind of tribute to them . Thats not to say they have some sort of virtuous bravery . They were fanatics who expected to die, not cowards .

 

[thedockerslad]

If they've been brainwashed enough to carry out a suicide attack, which this was, perhaps they sincerely believe the 72 virgins in paradise bollocks. So perhaps choosing death doesn't require so much courage? I dunno, being an atheist I find it hard to see mortality and the afterlife from a god-botherer's POV.

Maybe they got tired of seeing people like themselves being murdered by the ruling classes, and decided to choose their own fate.