what no annual poppy bunfight thread?

[ddraig]

convicted neo nazi laying poppies yesterday

http://www.hopenothate.org.uk/blog/insider/a-national-disgrace-4117

 

[Sasaferrato]

Good article here:

"Why are Veterans For Peace walking on Sunday 9th November?

We think that the annual campaign run by The Royal British Legion has little to do with remembrance and is waged in order to promote unquestioning support for the military and war. We have been told by the RBL that the official ceremony is only to remember British war dead and that foreign veterans are not welcome. We want to remember all of those killed in war including civilians and foreign soldiers. We also want to send a clear message that we have experienced war and it should not be glorified."


http://www.independent.co.uk/news/u...ry-whitepoppy-wreath-to-cenotaph-9833246.html

Even elite troops can lose their nerve, it can happen to the very best.

Anyone who feels that war is never the only option is a clown. Their wreath of white poppies would soon have been red, as the Nazi tanks crushed the bearer.

As for his whining that the MOD obtained an injunction to prevent him from breaking the law, he can consider himself lucky that he wasn't jailed for breach of the Official Secrets Act, which he signed. Signing a document such as the OSA is in effect giving your word, and a man who does not stand by his word isn't much of a man.

If someone feels that they can no longer serve, there is a mechanism whereby they may leave.

The engagements in Iraq and Afghanistan were of dubious legality and morality. If one's conscience dictates that they can no longer serve, then there is a mechanism to do so. Of course, if you are intent on generating the maximum publicity, then you 'refuse to soldier'. Self publicists 'refuse to soldier', everyone else quietly makes their case and leaves.

I sense a thwarted 'Andy McNab' here.

 

[andysays]

Bit incongruous to apply them to invading armies attempting the permanent occupation and subjugation of their neighbours though?

What about those members of the British armed forces who were already part of an occupying and subjecting force, but were killed attempting to resist an invading army seeking to displace them and become the new occupying and subjecting force in British colonies? Or those who were killed resisting the various post WWII wars of independence in those colonies?

They, as individuals, are just as worth of rememberance, but their role can hardly be described simply as

"they gave our lives for us"
"they fought so we could be free"
"they did their duty"

So to include those statements when remembering all Britain's war dead, wherever and whenever they died, strikes me as being clearly partial and ideological.

 

[DotCommunist]

do we remember those who died putting down the mau mau? The dead of the malayan 'emergency'?

 

[Pingu]

tbh i didnt see much remembering of british/french/tc dead on Volkstrauertag. each country remembers its own

 

[coley]

on another thread, this sites ex military were vehemently denying they had swallowed any propaganda in the army. Denying the existence of such a thing.

Still do.

 

[DotCommunist]

and fish have no word for water

 

[andysays]

do we remember those who died putting down the mau mau? The dead of the malayan 'emergency'?

"they gave our lives for us"
"they fought so we could be free"
"they did their duty"

 

[Thimble Queen]

Even elite troops can lose their nerve, it can happen to the very best.

Anyone who feels that war is never the only option is a clown. Their wreath of white poppies would soon have been red, as the Nazi tanks crushed the bearer.

As for his whining that the MOD obtained an injunction to prevent him from breaking the law, he can consider himself lucky that he wasn't jailed for breach of the Official Secrets Act, which he signed. Signing a document such as the OSA is in effect giving your word, and a man who does not stand by his word isn't much of a man.

If someone feels that they can no longer serve, there is a mechanism whereby they may leave.

The engagements in Iraq and Afghanistan were of dubious legality and morality. If one's conscience dictates that they can no longer serve, then there is a mechanism to do so. Of course, if you are intent on generating the maximum publicity, then you 'refuse to soldier'. Self publicists 'refuse to soldier', everyone else quietly makes their case and leaves.

I sense a thwarted 'Andy McNab' here.

Surely everyone, particularly ex-soldiers who have first hand experience of war, has the right to remember in their own way. You seem really angry about this.

 

[LiamO]

Tell me at republican commemorations do they remember the British soldiers who died?

Of course they don't.

They make it very clear exactly who they are commemorating - and why. They do not expect non-republicans to wear Easter Lilies either.

Nor would they ever be so shameless, so delusional as to hijack one of the western world's most well-known anti-war songs for their own militaristic ends like this ...

 

[LiamO]

Tell me at republican commemorations do they remember the British soldiers who died?

https://amp.twimg.com/v/603f78be-951d-4524-8914-f9d2498c3cf4

this won't embed. It's the Sinn Fein mayor of Dublin (a former IRA volunteer and prisoner) explaining his decision to attend a Remembrance day service in his home town.

 

[sleaterkinney]

do we remember those who died putting down the mau mau? The dead of the malayan 'emergency'?

Or even stuff like Suez.

 

[friedaweed]

Even though they helped win the Battle of Waterloo and smash Boney.

I thought it was Shakin Stevens who knocked Boney M off the all time longest number one spot. I didn't know it was the bloody Germanz I bet it was Tangerine Dream wasn't it

 

[dylanredefined]

Of course they don't.

They make it very clear exactly who they are commemorating - and why. They do not expect non-republicans to wear Easter Lilies either.

Nor would they ever be so shameless, so delusional as to hijack one of the western world's most well-known anti-war songs for their own militaristic ends like this ...

No idea what they were thinking, I agree it is horrible an original version would have been fine.

 

[frogwoman]

On 9th May every year in Russia and ex soviet states there is a parade to mark the defeat of fascism, there is quite plainly an ideological bias to it as the implications are that Putin is doing the same thing, the state celebration is quite clearly not just about remembrance, and in my opinion it is the same here

 

[DotCommunist]

^^^ and the very people who here swear blind its just remembrance and its just poppies are quick to smirk at jonny foriegners crude propaganda

 

[Lo Siento.]

The writer is basically hating the fact the British are doing something he doesn't like.
It is a national day of remembrance for the war dead of this nation. Not a fluffy day of war is bad m'kay.

Hang on, weren't you and coley claiming above that it wasn't about nationalism and militarism?

 

[dylanredefined]

Hang on, weren't you and coley claiming above that it wasn't about nationalism and militarism?

If you think the remembrance service is about glorification of the military and the UK you haven't been to many.

 

[Lo Siento.]

If you think the remembrance service is about glorification of the military and the UK you haven't been to many.

I think the statement I was directly responding to was nationalist and militarist.

 

[FridgeMagnet]

Wait, so if somebody said "they gave our lives for us" about a _bad_ army that would be bad because it was glorifying them. But otherwise it's not glorifying anything. Er.

 

[Lo Siento.]

Wait, so if somebody said "they gave our lives for us" about a _bad_ army that would be bad because it was glorifying them. But otherwise it's not glorifying anything. Er.

This same group of posters are warbling around claiming that "the army isn't political, it's a neutral organisation that just serves the nation", as if their believing the latter doesn't utterly contradict the former. Can't expect much in terms of consistency, can you?

 

[butchersapron]

If you think the remembrance service is about glorification of the military and the UK you haven't been to many.

I've been to around 20. That you can't see it i says it all.

 

[frogwoman]

This same group of posters are warbling around claiming that "the army isn't political, it's a neutral organisation that just serves the nation", as if their believing the latter doesn't utterly contradict the former. Can't expect much in terms of consistency, can you?

It just serves the nation, nothing to do with nationalism

 

[weltweit]

This same group of posters are warbling around claiming that "the army isn't political, it's a neutral organisation that just serves the nation", as if their believing the latter doesn't utterly contradict the former. Can't expect much in terms of consistency, can you?

I am not sure if I am in that group of warblers - but the armed forces (the army is just one of three) serves the UK government and the UK government is supposed to serve the people. Senior armed forces people are expected to remain removed from politics while in office.

 

[DotCommunist]

lady on the news just suggested smashing the entire moat of poppies would be an appropriate metaphor for all the crushed and broken bodies of the fallen!

controversial for ITV news. Shiela Hancock, never heard of her.

 

[Lo Siento.]

I am not sure if I am in that group of warblers - but the armed forces (the army is just one of three) serves the UK government and the UK government is supposed to serve the people. Senior armed forces people are expected to remain removed from politics while in office.

Yes, you most certainly are. And this post is an excellent example of it.

 

[frogwoman]

Supposed to serve the people lol

 

[dylanredefined]

Supposed to serve the people lol

Here we see the British army oppresing the workers

 

[Thimble Queen]

UKIP candidate lays poppy wreath emblazoned with UKIP logo at Chatham memorial service. http://www.kentonline.co.uk/medway/news/storm-over-ukip-poppy-wreath-26696/

 

[weltweit]

.. And this post is an excellent example of it.

Is there anything incorrect about that post in your opinion?