Ukraine
- Thread starter Zabo
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Pickman's model
Starry Wisdom
Eastern-Odyssey
Active Member
Don't know but being it's on Crimean news and the big Wolfs Hook I'm assuming it's Ukrainian nationalists. Even though the Wolf's Hook is frequently used by Eastern European racists, it's the symbol of three Ukrainian racist group's - Autonomous Resistance, Social National Assembly and Patriots of the Ukraine and being the later two seem a little more political and militant, I would go with the first.
kebabking
Not a Girly Swot, but I like them....
oh thats helicopters alright!
the problem is that the types of helicopters i could identify - Mi-24 HIND attack helicopters, and Mi-8/17 HIP transport helicopters, are both in service with both Russia amd Ukraine, the only 'nudge' is that for a country like Ukraine thats supposed to be on the bones of its financial arse its a lot of helicopters in full working order.
the other caveat is that i don't know enough about the Ukrainian Armed Forces to know whether the helicopters were based in eastern or western Ukraine, or whether the force is mixed, or segregated, or heavily biased towards one national group or another.
that said, if i were a betting man i would not be putting money on this being within the capability of what my understanding is of the current Ukrainian government - i'm afraid i'd be putting my circle around old Vlad on the betting slip...
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Right_Sector
The Wikipedia entry on Right Sector is a whitewash or should that be blackwash..
The Wikipedia entry on Right Sector is a whitewash or should that be blackwash..
agricola
a genuine importer of owls
It is a bit daft to suggest that "poverty and inequality are the root cause of corruption" anywhere, tbh. "Chief symptoms of", perhaps.
Eastern-Odyssey
Active Member
Here read this (you have to translate) but it's Tridant's political manifesto https://docs.google.com/file/d/0B3dnDhv9TDI4MkpHNU1TcHZrSTA/view?sle=true&pli=1 , before you ask, it was linked from Right Setors VK Russian page. http://vk.com/public62043361. I'm assuming it's a general shared manifesto, especially being Right Sector links to it and it looks like directly what's happening in the policy and actions being carried out by the group. Anyway the Manifesto is purely fascist orientated and basically classes anyone subversive to the Ukrainian state, or Ukrainian nationalism as enemies of the state.
kebabking
Not a Girly Swot, but I like them....
BBC reporting 5 IL-76 transport aircraft have landed at 'a military airfield in Crimea' - though not saying whether that airfield was within the Russian Black Sea flleet base or in Ukrainian territory.
Il-76 is a strategic lift aircraft, 50 ton payload or 200(ish) passengers. again, operated by both Russian and Ukraine...
Il-76 is a strategic lift aircraft, 50 ton payload or 200(ish) passengers. again, operated by both Russian and Ukraine...
Eastern-Odyssey
Active Member
More troops arriving, but cant tell the plates in the window of the vehicle.
RosyFuture
will baser instincts win out?
1) Thanks for that. In English that clause is:
"The following are determined exclusively by the laws of Ukraine: . . . 20. the organization and procedure for conducting elections and referendums;"
It's the same clause & wording in both Constitutions:
http://en.wikisource.org/wiki/Constitution_of_Ukraine,_2010 (the one effective before Saturday's amendments)
http://en.wikisource.org/wiki/Constitution_of_Ukraine,_2004 (the one effective after them)
By law does Crimea Rada have the authority to call a referendum for the Autonomous Republic? Or does it need permission from an authority like the UA Rada, or the UA Rada writing a new law?
2) Just a point on acting within the law, here the matter of respecting the constitution. The Constitution of UA existing Friday last week (nor the one chosen the next day), had no way of changing the President by a vote alone in the Rada: what it did on Saturday (before changing the Constitution) was unconstitutional. If the President is in fact impeached there is a process, the famed due process all liberal democrats & constitutional socialists love. Obviously in this the impeached person has the right to challenge evidence supporting the impeachment. But this was denied to him - as so often happens, political control trumps the rule of law.
For information I give the whole of the 2 relevant articles, 108 & 111, of last Friday's Constitution, before it was changed the next day:
"The President of Ukraine exercises his or her powers until the assumption of office by the newly-elected President of Ukraine.
"The powers of the President of Ukraine terminate prior to the expiration of term in cases of:
1. resignation;
2. inability to exercise his or her powers for reasons of health;
3. removal from office by the procedure of impeachment;
4. death."
§111, detailing the impeachment process:
"The President of Ukraine may be removed from office by the Verkhovna Rada of Ukraine by the procedure of impeachment, in the event that he or she commits state treason or other crime.
The issue of the removal of the President of Ukraine from office by the procedure of impeachment is initiated by the majority of the constitutional composition of the Verkhovna Rada of Ukraine.
To conduct the investigation, the Verkhovna Rada of Ukraine establishes a special temporary investigatory commission whose composition includes a special procurator and special investigators.
The conclusions and proposals of the temporary investigatory commission are considered at a meeting of the Verkhovna Rada of Ukraine.
For cause, the Verkhovna Rada of Ukraine, by no less than two-thirds of its constitutional composition, adopts a decision on the accusation of the President of Ukraine.
The decision on the removal of the President of Ukraine from office by the procedure of impeachment is adopted by the Verkhovna Rada of Ukraine by no less than three-quarters of its constitutional composition, after the review of the case by the Constitutional Court of Ukraine and the receipt of its opinion on the observance of the constitutional procedure of investigation and consideration of the case of impeachment, and the receipt of the opinion of the Supreme Court of Ukraine to the effect that the acts, of which the President of Ukraine is accused, contain elements of state treason or other crime." (I added the highlights)
http://en.wikisource.org/wiki/Constitution_of_Ukraine,_2010
3) Obviously what has happened since the agreement of last Friday afternoon has been a blow to the state, a coup. The new constitution means there's a new regime, the state has changed form, & in that sense it has been a political revolution. Foot soldiers in achieving this were the Ukrainian nationalists influenced by fascist history & symbolism. German conservatives & nationalists, not just the small group milieu from which the Hitlerist NSDAP arose, always spoke of the need for a national revolution. This time in UA it has been achieved to a large extent by the boldness & perseverance of Svoboda & others.
What has not changed about the UA state is its capitalist nature. But that doesn't concern almost all the protesters & rebels. As Eastern-Odyssey just said, armed groups of Right Sektor are reported to be seizing businesses from those judged corrupt, thieves or unpatriotic, but the groups or their leaders will simply become capitalists themselves. In fact there were no reports of anyone in Maidan Square or elsewhere demanding that oligarchs & the other super-rich just pay their taxes, let alone have any of their property confiscated by the state or the famed people-in-motion.
Graffito is 'Death to Yids', the Zhids.
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Eastern-Odyssey
Active Member
That's interesting. I posted it here earlier, but you are aware that John McCain is the director of the International Republican Institute, notorious for government meddling. Created by Raegon in the 80's to do what "democratization" work the CIA use to do previously http://rightweb.irc-online.org/profile/International_Republican_Institute. Anyway I can't find the article now and the one that I think it was seems to have mysteriously been removed, but the IRI did a $3 million deal with Ukraine's foreign office to fund political parties a few days before the violence broke out. Nonetheless, Michael Drakmon the head of Ukraine's IRI has a close relation with Valentyn Nalyvaichenko the newly appointed head of security http://www.odnako.org/blogs/vneshne...avitel-ssha-vizivaet-eks-glavu-sbu-na-besedu/.
barney_pig
Po-cha-na-quar-hip
I doubt very musch it will be that clean & tidy.
pocketscience
Well-Known Member
I think once other eastern regions see the deals being brokered by Goldman Sachs between the new Kiev government and the IMF, and none of the "investments" coming their way, they'll opt to go with Russia too. Shoring up geographical borders there will be a lot more messy though.
I can see this being on tender hooks for a long while yet.
Bernie Gunther
Fundamentalist Druid
Does Russia still depend on Ukrainian grain?
I'm guessing not, but what's left to Ukraine is mostly agricultural right?
The Russians were already there. http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-26388057
What will the Turkish and Polish response be?
free spirit
more tea vicar?
fair sized piece on the far right influence on Newsnight just now for anyone interested.
And they appear to be moving more forces in as we speak. Establishing those facts on the ground, Kiev appears to be doing nothing and Obama's speech was less than assertive.
Yes, media appears to be finally catching on.
butchersapron
Bring back hanging
He took $15 billion with him did he? The $15 billion that's still sitting there in the reseverves. And the ability to tax, raise loans etc?
Bernie Gunther
Fundamentalist Druid
Did the 'west' get it?
I thought a bunch of Ukrainians, including a fair proportion of neo-nazis, got it?
I thought a bunch of Ukrainians, including a fair proportion of neo-nazis, got it?
brogdale
Coming to terms with late onset Anarchism
Bankers don't do barricades and shit.
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