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Ukraine

camouflage said:
By the way all these pics of Putin flexing his abs and doing manly things mean fuck-all. If anything you're just laughing at the Russian population in general for being impressed by such things in their leadership.

Better some bloke that fancies himself as 'proper hench' than some bloke that looks like one of the pigs in the film Animal Farm thrown in a suit and falling about again.
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Oh stop being so po-faced. If you don't find Putin strutting around the place with his flabby tits out amusing, then I feel sorry for any poor soul that has to stand next to you at a bar for an extended period.
 
cynicaleconomy said:
Oh stop being so po-faced. If you don't find Putin strutting around the place with his flabby tits out amusing, then I feel sorry for any poor soul that has to stand next to you at a bar for an extended period.
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Sure it's amusing, but when someones saying something about the situation in Ukraine, answering with a picture of the big bald lobster strutting about on a horse as if that's an answer just fails to satisfy. It's worse than ad hominim, it's.... lolcat dismissal, surely there are better more enlightening criticisms of Putin to be made in response...
 
Pickman's model said:
p01dg935.jpg
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No, Mr. Bond, I expect you to die.
 
camouflage said:
Sure it's amusing, but when someones saying something about the situation in Ukraine, answering with a picture of the big bald lobster strutting about on a horse as if that's an answer just fails to satisfy. It's worse than ad hominim, it's.... lolcat dismissal, surely there are better more enlightening criticisms of Putin to be made in response...
Click to expand...

/orders pint and hurries away as quickly as possible.


Btw, you assume that the Russian population are actually impressed by Putin's antics. I doubt that very much.
 
treelover said:
They will be, until the economy takes a dive instead of Putin.
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why would that happen, is it because "The Russians only have money now because of all those energy resources /sneer. That's not real wealth /sneer, that's just /sneer sneer, Gas wealth. /sneer".

Does Russia making money from having a valuable resource and selling it to people mean that it's only a matter of time now before that big stupid bear falls down a peg or two, and we can go back to pity/hating them for losing the cold war, and feel once again superior.

If the UK had lots of energy wealth I bet we would have put it to good use and not just squandered it on neo-liberal fuckwittery to the benefit of cronies and big business............ oh.
 
camouflage said:
why would that happen, is it because "The Russians only have money now because of all those energy resources /sneer. That's not real wealth /sneer, that's just /sneer sneer, Gas wealth. /sneer".

Does Russia making money from having a valuable resource and selling it to people mean that it's only a matter of time now before that big stupid bear falls down a peg or two, and we can go back to pity/hating them for losing the cold war, and feel once again superior.

If the UK had lots of energy wealth I bet we would have put it to good use and not just squandered it on neo-liberal fuckwittery to the benefit of cronies and big business............ oh.
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Oh yeah, its fucking boomtime for Russians now and all the new found wealth is in no way being held by a handful of men.
 
Teaboy said:
Oh yeah, its fucking boomtime for Russians now and all the new found wealth is in no way being held by a handful of men.
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What my Russian colleague told me was that under Putin (who he did not like at all) people were experiencing the first bit of stability they'd known since Gorby came to power. If that stability gets threatened, Putin may find his political capital disappearing rapidly.
 
Gov candidates approved by Rada:

Official website announced new gov at 1540 local (1340 GMT)
http://www.kmu.gov.ua/control/uk/publish/article?art_id=247059066&cat_id=244276429

Affiliations not given but Svoboda well placed (leader not in it). Boxer's party not party to gov. They-crucified-me-in-the-woods man, Bulatov, Minister for Youth & Sport.

Freedom guys, with links so u can put a face to a xenophobic nationalist who may be a fascist-without-an-organised-working-class-to-break:
Sich, 1 of the 2 Vice-Prime Minister (there's also First Vice-Prime Minister) http://www.svoboda.org.ua/diyalnist/novyny/048333/
Tenyuk, "acting" (gov website) for defence http://www.svoboda.org.ua/diyalnist/novyny/048339/
Schveik (as in good soldier), farming http://www.svoboda.org.ua/diyalnist/novyny/048336/
Mok'nik, Ukraine's greenman http://www.svoboda.org.ua/diyalnist/novyny/048334/
Mak'nitski, chief prosecutor http://www.svoboda.org.ua/diyalnist/novyny/048204/

Tenyuk head of navy 2006-10, blocking Russian fleet in Crimea during Georgia War.

Also head of National Security & Defence Council is leader of Self-Defence militia, Parubi. He co-founded the forerunner of Svoboda with its present leader; now in Yulia's party.


Now in English http://www.kmu.gov.ua/control/en/publish/article?art_id=247059301&cat_id=244314975
Both these gov links, & en.wiki, miss out 2 Ministers, Sob'oleyv & Tchorn'ofol
 
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Teaboy said:
Oh yeah, its fucking boomtime for Russians now and all the new found wealth is in no way being held by a handful of men.
Click to expand...

Dunno about that, but I read an article recently that made what I feel was an interesting point. While the games were overshadowed by Russia being sexually conservative, and lots of talk about corruption and how many billions were spent on the games (thisisanoutrage!!!mad!) most of that spend actually went on infrastructure and construction, development of the area along very Keynesian lines.

Mostly in the West we just read about homophobes and muddy fields, and more describing Putin like he';s a cross between Genghis Khan and Nero. Don't get me wrong in all this, I'm sure there's plenty to criticize about Russia and Putins government, but I grow suspicious and weary of all this remarkably consistent and ever-so reductionist (to the level of a cartoon) Western propaganda about anyone our overlords happen to dislike.

so, let's all just pretend Russias just a big dumb bear and laugh at Putin, the silly man that likes to ride around doing 'man stuff'. And yes, Ukraine has now been liberated by it's hungry masses yearning to be free, and How Dare those dastardly Russians have hundreds of years of deep cultural and economic ties with Ukraine, can't they see that Ukraine needs to join the Euro so their people can be elevated to the level of Greece or Spain?

Think of all the young village-girl prostitutes that will become available once Ukraine joins the EU and starts paying the IMF out of it's nose for ever and ever and never another ruble spent on shitty things like schools or whatever coz it'll all go on austerity. Aren't we kind.

:rolleyes:
 
camouflage said:
Dunno about that, but I read an article recently that made what I feel was an interesting point. While the games were overshadowed by Russia being sexually conservative, and lots of talk about corruption and how many billions were spent on the games (thisisanoutrage!!!mad!) most of that spend actually went on infrastructure and construction, development of the area along very Keynesian lines.

Mostly in the West we just read about homophobes and muddy fields, and more describing Putin like he';s a cross between Genghis Khan and Nero. Don't get me wrong in all this, I'm sure there's plenty to criticize about Russia and Putins government, but I grow suspicious and weary of all this remarkably consistent and ever-so reductionist (to the level of a cartoon) Western propaganda about anyone our overlords happen to dislike.

so, let's all just pretend Russias just a big dumb bear and laugh at Putin, the silly man that likes to ride around doing 'man stuff'. And yes, Ukraine has now been liberated by it's hungry masses yearning to be free, and How Dare those dastardly Russians have hundreds of years of deep cultural and economic ties with Ukraine, can't they see that Ukraine needs to join the Euro so their people can be elevated to the level of Greece or Spain? :rolleyes:
Click to expand...
Who are you talking to here?

You've not read the thread, have you?
 
littlebabyjesus said:
Who are you talking to here?

You've not read the thread, have you?
Click to expand...

Wish I could, couldn't keep up as it moves so fast. Hopefully you get a general idea of my take on this issue generally. Feel free to call me out on any of it. I am interested to learn as much as I can about this issue, but not interested in the whole "Russia is a big stupid bear and Putin is horrid because the newspapers told me so" type stuff.
 
camouflage said:
Dunno about that, but I read an article recently that made what I feel was an interesting point. While the games were overshadowed by Russia being sexually conservative, and lots of talk about corruption and how many billions were spent on the games (thisisanoutrage!!!mad!) most of that spend actually went on infrastructure and construction, development of the area along very Keynesian lines.

Mostly in the West we just read about homophobes and muddy fields, and more describing Putin like he';s a cross between Genghis Khan and Nero. Don't get me wrong in all this, I'm sure there's plenty to criticize about Russia and Putins government, but I grow suspicious and weary of all this remarkably consistent and ever-so reductionist (to the level of a cartoon) Western propaganda about anyone our overlords happen to dislike.

so, let's all just pretend Russias just a big dumb bear and laugh at Putin, the silly man that likes to ride around doing 'man stuff'. And yes, Ukraine has now been liberated by it's hungry masses yearning to be free, and How Dare those dastardly Russians have hundreds of years of deep cultural and economic ties with Ukraine, can't they see that Ukraine needs to join the Euro so their people can be elevated to the level of Greece or Spain?

Think of all the young village-girl prostitutes that will become available once Ukraine joins the EU and starts paying the IMF out of it's nose for ever and ever and never another ruble spent on shitty things like schools or whatever coz it'll all go on austerity. Aren't we kind.

:rolleyes:
Click to expand...

Do you just reply to things in your head rather then what is written?
 
For some strange reason what I have here, but with links, hasn't appeared, so here it is without links - which really defeats the point, What's the rule here on links?

Gov candidates approved by Rada:
LINK
Official website announced new gov at 1540 local (1340 GMT)


Affiliations not given but Svoboda well placed (leader not in it). Boxer's party not party to gov. They-crucified-me-in-the-woods man, Bulatov, Minister for Youth & Sport.

Freedom guys, with links so u can put a face to a xenophobic nationalist who may be a fascist-without-an-organised-working-class-to-break:
Sich, 1 of the 2 Vice-Prime Minister (there's also First Vice-Prime Minister) LINK
Tenyuk, "acting" (gov website) for defence LINK
Schveik (as in good soldier), farming LINK
Mok'nik, Ukraine's greenman LINK
Mak'nitski, chief prosecutor LINK

Tenyuk head of navy 2006-10, blocking Russian fleet in Crimea during Georgia War.

Also head of National Security & Defence Council is leader of Self-Defence militia, Parubi. He co-founded the forerunner of Svoboda with its present leader; now in Yulia's party.


Now in English LINK
Both these gov links, & en.wiki, miss out 2 Ministers, Sob'oleyv & Tchorn'ofol
 
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camouflage said:
let's all just pretend Russias just a big dumb bear and laugh at Putin, the silly man that likes to ride around doing 'man stuff'.
Click to expand...

Once again, you're the one assuming that Russians are actually impressed by that side of Putin's leadership. You are the one that is sneering at the Russians by stereotyping them as gullible in the face of macho posturing. They aren't.

Remember this:

If anything you're just laughing at the Russian population in general for being impressed by such things in their leadership.
Click to expand...
 
cynicaleconomy said:
Once again, you're the one assuming that Russians are actually impressed by that side of Putin's leadership. You are the one that is sneering at the Russians by stereotyping them as gullible in the face of macho posturing. They aren't.

Remember this:
Click to expand...

Sure, happy to dial-down on the idea that all Russians like to see a half nekkid middle-aged man playing with his big gun. But he does have something of a proud following in Russia I understand. More Russians like Putins antics (ironically probably) than like David Camerons face over here anyway. And it's not like Obama doesn't have a fan base of people who are impressed by his pretty speeches or debonair style etc.

Whoever consumes Putins action-man image with delight, it's beside whatever point was being made that a picture of Putin with his shirt off was posted in response to. Somebody likes it, so what if they do. Besides if I was a middle aged white bloke I'd be quite chuffed to feel I could show off my bod in front of the voters. And anyway who doesn't like riding in sub-marines or riding on horses or shooting big guns, what's wrong with it? Good clean fun, that's all. I've seen presidents do worse to be honest.
 
RosyFuture said:
Gov candidates approved by Rada:

Affiliations not given but Svoboda well placed (leader not in it). Boxer's party not party to gov.
Click to expand...
That'll explain the deathly silence on the topic in the Eu & Us media.
The leeked "Fuck the Eu" call is confirmed. The German foreign minister must be licking his wounds and racking his brains on how to Spin this.
 
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frogwoman said:
He's not nearly as popular there as people assume over here
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Not at the moment but it is undeniable that he has been, and for reasons other than Russians being thick and impressed when he takes his shirt off or wrestles a tiger or something.

camouflage is just thinking the world works like a Star Wars film again, but knowing fuck all about what is being discussed. Personally, I think he should piss off and count his bitcoins somewhere, rather than disrupting this thread any more.
 
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