Ukraine

[goldenecitrone]

How much is RT paying these days btw?

To Putin's ringpiece? Can't be a pleasant job, squeezing out all that shit day in and day out.

 

[Eastern-Odyssey]

well, looks like Blackwater are in town . Helping the junta hold the line against the Easties in Donetsk

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...lk-U-S-mercenary-outfit-deployed-Donetsk.html

those are definitely American and NATO type weapons theyre armed with . And if they harm a hair on a single demonstrators head Id say its very likely the tanks could roll .

Interesting that the Mail picked up on that story, I posted it last week. Kind of disregarded it as the normal conspiracy stories that are generated during events like this. However, being it started on a few Russian/Ukrainian live Journal blogs and later in a few Ukrainian news websites instead of the standard libertarian news, it's either Russian's attempting to stir the shit, or a valid claim. It's more than likely Ukrainian security forces, or taken in Crimea and passed of as Donetsk.

 

[butchersapron]

Yes, highly trained mercenaries in that sort of local army surplus store get up wandering around with no tactical sense or awareness. Most definitely.

 

[TomUS]

The land based one written off early Obama, switched to a naval deployed system that really does need to work.

What do you mean, really does need to work? I've seen no evidence that the sea based system works either. It's as bullshit as the land system. Putin, don't worry about it.

 

[gosub]

What do you mean, really does need to work? I've seen no evidence that the sea based system works either. It's as bullshit as the land system. Putin, don't worry about it.

EU has managed to get 2 treaties through since Obama pulled the land one and this whole Ukraine thing is as much about the associate EU membership as anything else. Not so worried about Putin but a proper missile counterstrike system for NATO is fucking desirable

 

[frogwoman]

butchersapron that crititack piece was good but what did they mean about a "national-cultural renaissance"? do you reckon?

 

[Doctor Carrot]

well, looks like Blackwater are in town . Helping the junta hold the line against the Easties in Donetsk

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...lk-U-S-mercenary-outfit-deployed-Donetsk.html

those are definitely American and NATO type weapons theyre armed with . And if they harm a hair on a single demonstrators head Id say its very likely the tanks could roll .

FFS CR, why do you take everything the press say in support of Russia at face value? More to the point why the fuck did you link to the DM in the expectation it will be true? It makes people click on it, people like me read the comments below and makes me read shit like this from the comment section.

The guy holding up the sign "NATO Good buy"... does he mean "good bye"? And these are the people the EU wants to open doors to so they can all fIood into Britain?

It's beyond parody.

Has anyone else noticed how this situation has very much drifted down the order of news lately? It's not even on the BBC's main website anymore.

 

[likesfish]

well, looks like Blackwater are in town . Helping the junta hold the line against the Easties in Donetsk

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...lk-U-S-mercenary-outfit-deployed-Donetsk.html

those are definitely American and NATO type weapons theyre armed with . And if they harm a hair on a single demonstrators head Id say its very likely the tanks could roll .

Think they are called xes now or it might be a squiggle the mercenaries formely known as blackwater
If they are the answer its a bloody stupid question
The abm plan is cold war paranoia trying to deal with the "iranian" and annoy russia also,poimt out to the chineses that their carrier killing ballistic missile yeah we have an app for that

 

[TomUS]

EU has managed to get 2 treaties through since Obama pulled the land one and this whole Ukraine thing is as much about the associate EU membership as anything else. Not so worried about Putin but a proper missile counterstrike system for NATO is fucking desirable

NATO already has a counterstrike system. If it sees the missiles coming in it sends theirs going out. This ICBM defense system is BS.

 

[Cloo]

My dad's actually going back to work in Kiev this week; he's spoken the his colleagues and they say that things are pretty much business as usual in town, so they're not going to relocate or anything.

 

[ViolentPanda]

yep, that's it. And anyways, the problem wouldn't have arose, if the EU hadn't been meddling.

Don't be so naive.
The problem has been brewing for almost a century (at the very least), and the EU's involvement is tangential to the problems of Russo-Ukraine relations.

 

[ViolentPanda]

You seem to use the word definitely a lot especially about stuff you know little about.

1. The uniforms that I can identify are DEFINITELY Russian
2. The weapons I can identify are DEFINITELY Russian

But hey you have a habit of accepting the most bizarre press stories as gospel if you believe they will back up your position.

How much is RT paying these days btw?

The only clearly-visible weapon in that sequence of pictures on the Mail website (pic 4 of 9) is very definitely a recent-model Kalashnikov, so "definitely" are NOT American.
Although good mercs will use local weapons to get around logistics issues, but even so, CR's claim that there are definitely NATO or American weapons on show is balls.

 

[Eastern-Odyssey]

The purge continues. Reported leader of the Young Guard and aid to pro-Russian oligarch and politician Viktor Medvedchuk. The guy there with the heavies from the Ukrainian police is Oleg Lyashko leader of the Radical Right party and the main advocate of the ban on the Parties of Regions and the Ukraine Communist Party. http://www.ukrinform.ua/ukr/news/lyashko_zatrimav_luganskogo_separatista_klinchae_va_video_1916350.



Interestingly completely unreported in Western, independent and Ukrainian news Viktor Medvedchuk house was burned down just before the leader of the leader of the Ukraine Communist Parties house was burned down. As it was never reported, I only know because Dmitro Yarosh the leader of Right Sector has a picture of it on his VK page, giving a little hint at who was more than likely behind it. After the arrest of the pro-Russian Donetsk governor last week it would seem that the new powers in Kiev seem intent on clamping down on separatism from the Russian speaking community, something completely unreported in the Western press. Ironically now they have an good excuse with Russia's occupation of Crimea. Nonetheless, I get the impression through certain events that their is a clear division between the two groups now vying for power in Kiev and suspect that Right Sector have close connections to the police, army and secret service ever since the protests. Being such a far right politician such as Oleg Lyashko is leading the arrest, it only adds to my speculation.

 

[8ball]

Don't be so naive.
The problem has been brewing for almost a century (at the very least), and the EU's involvement is tangential to the problems of Russo-Ukraine relations.

I think pointing out that a bees' nest has been looking quite angry for a while doesn't mean that poking it with a stick had nothing to do with the reaction.

 

[Fuchs66]

The only clearly-visible weapon in that sequence of pictures on the Mail website (pic 4 of 9) is very definitely a recent-model Kalashnikov, so "definitely" are NOT American.
Although good mercs will use local weapons to get around logistics issues, but even so, CR's claim that there are definitely NATO or American weapons on show is balls.

Yep a 100 series AK, which as I mentioned earlier is the type used by the Russian troops hastely formed local militias.

 

[ViolentPanda]

I think pointing out that a bees' nest has been looking quite angry for a while doesn't mean that poking it with a stick had nothing to do with the reaction.

Like I said though, tangential. The fact is that Russian (and American) interference in post-Soviet Ukraine is at the root of this, as is Ukraine's history of oppression under the Russia-dominated Soviet Union and under the Tsars. It's always been about the eastward neighbour attempting to control the Ukraine - sometimes directly, sometimes through proxies like Yanukovich.

 

[ViolentPanda]

Yep a 100 series AK, which as I mentioned earlier is the type used by the Russian troops hastely formed local militias.

Damn those hastily-formed local militias. We would have got away with it if it hadn't been for them!

 

[gosub]

NATO already has a counterstrike system. If it sees the missiles coming in it sends theirs going out. This ICBM defense system is BS.

Some of the cards in the deck, that won't be good enough

 

[Naiwen]

Don't be so naive.
The problem has been brewing for almost a century (at the very least), and the EU's involvement is tangential to the problems of Russo-Ukraine relations.

By stirring up more trouble with Russia. Don't think EU should have anything to do with Ukraine.

 

[Doctor Carrot]

Eastern-Odyssey Can you elaborate on who/what the Young Guard is? Google tells me it was an anti fascist organisation in Ukraine during WW2, it also tells me it's the youth wing of Putin's United Russia party.

 

[Doctor Carrot]

Don't think EU should have anything to do with Ukraine.

But Russia should?

 

[Naiwen]

But Russia should?

Yes, because Ukraine belonged to the URSS and the Russian Empire before, so it's their right to claim it back. And Ukraine has never been a member of the EU before, so why should it go with the EU?

 

[Doctor Carrot]

Yes, because Ukraine belonged to the URSS and the Russian Empire before, so it's their right to claim it back. And Ukraine has never been a member of the EU before, so why should it go with the EU?

 

[ViolentPanda]

By stirring up more trouble with Russia. Don't think EU should have anything to do with Ukraine.

"More trouble"?
As it is, Ukrainians, whether "ethnic Russians" or "ethnic Ukrainians" are pissed off with their power elites following the bear, because all it has meant in post-Soviet times is resource theft, governmental corruption and higher taxes, just as all it meant in Tsarist times was much the same. As for during the Soviet era, well between 8 and 10 million of us died so that Russian bellies got filled. The Holodomor on its own is a good enough reason to tell Russia to fuck off.

 

[ViolentPanda]

Yes, because Ukraine belonged to the URSS and the Russian Empire before, so it's their right to claim it back. And Ukraine has never been a member of the EU before, so why should it go with the EU?

"Belonged"? Are you a moron, or just an ahistoric arse? Ukraine doesn't belong to Russia, and never has, neither by conquest or by agreement.
And please don't spout any shit about the Kievan Rus. The Rus were Scandinavian proto-Russians, not Russians themselves.

 

[Naiwen]

"More trouble"?
As it is, Ukrainians, whether "ethnic Russians" or "ethnic Ukrainians" are pissed off with their power elites following the bear, because all it has meant in post-Soviet times is resource theft, governmental corruption and higher taxes, just as all it meant in Tsarist times was much the same. As for during the Soviet era, well between 8 and 10 million of us died so that Russian bellies got filled. The Holodomor on its own is a good enough reason to tell Russia to fuck off.

And the EU isn't doing it with Ukraine? Oh come on, everybody does it, including the EU. So why criticize Russia for it? And do you think EU is doing things out of their own heart or for self-gain and resource gain? Resource again and self-gain.

Yes, Ukraine belonged to Russia, the Soviet Union actually, you're the moron there who's too pro-West.

 

[barney_pig]

Anything else to add to that fascinating analysis or is that it?

From the poster who think Ireland s a part of the uk, a fascinating and well informed contributor.

 

[ViolentPanda]

And the EU isn't doing it with Ukraine? Oh come on, everybody does it, including the EU.

Yes, Ukraine belonged to Russia, the Soviet Union actually, you're the moron there who's too pro-West.

As I've said earlier, the main interference in Ukraine hasn't been from the EU, but from the US and Russia, both with the intent of using Ukraine as a gaming chip in their power politics. While the EU has similar intentions, they're constructed less around the idea of power blocs, and more around the idea of harnessing Ukraine's human assets (Russian and American interference has so far done little of this, content merely to let Ukraine moulder while her power elites steal everything). The EU also has a pragmatic grasp of realpolitik in play - offer fellowship rather than border fences, and what appear to be tangible benefits to "the working man".

 

[ViolentPanda]

From the poster who think Ireland s a part of the uk, a fascinating and well informed contributor.

Reminds me of a teacher I knew...

 

[Naiwen]

As I've said earlier, the main interference in Ukraine hasn't been from the EU, but from the US and Russia, both with the intent of using Ukraine as a gaming chip in their power politics. While the EU has similar intentions, they're constructed less around the idea of power blocs, and more around the idea of harnessing Ukraine's human assets (Russian and American interference has so far done little of this, content merely to let Ukraine moulder while her power elites steal everything). The EU also has a pragmatic grasp of realpolitik in play - offer fellowship rather than border fences, and what appear to be tangible benefits to "the working man".

And the EU isn't stealing everything? You're delusioned if you think this. Both Russia, and the EU and the US, are interfering, in my opinion and wouldn't let Urkraine decide for herself.

I hope you're not one of those who think the EU is perfect eh?