The American mass shooting thread

[Orang Utan]

I've read the Sereny book on Bell. A very uncomfortable and disturbing read which at least tries to get to the heart of why Bell committed the awful crime she did. Of course, no one can condone it, but at least this book attempts to understand why it may've happened and what led Bell to do such a thing. Like I say, an unsettling, but well researched book.

That’s an excellent book and Sereny was an example to us all for her empathy towards humans who do unspeakable things.
The edition of Cries Unheard that I read had an addendum about the Bulger case.
That book, and Blake Morrison’s As If, had a profound effect on my worldview.

 

[Raheem]

Of course, if only all the other six year-old kids had been armed, things might have turned out differently.

 

[Yuwipi Woman]

Not heard of that one. The famous UK case involving 10 year ago killers was this one below (no guns involved though so a bit off topic)

Murder of James Bulger - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

I think this was the case that I vaguely remembered.

 

[petee]

slightly off topic, but don't name your kid "james bulger."

Whitey Bulger - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

 

[Yuwipi Woman]

When a six-year-old boy in Michigan shot and killed a classmate in 2000, he wasn't charged but prosecutors went after three adults in the house where he found the gun.

Busch and his prosecutors quickly concluded there was no criminal case to make against the boy who shot Kayla, saying that under state law, he was too young to be held criminally responsible because he was not capable of forming the intent to kill, which is necessary for criminal prosecution.

But the former prosecutor did pursue charges against adults living in the house where the boy found the gun in a Puma shoebox.

Jamelle James, who prosecutors said owned the stolen pistol, and two other men, including the boy’s uncle, were indicted on federal weapon charges in the aftermath of the shooting.

First-grader Kayla Rolland was fatally shot at school 20 years ago. Here’s how it happened.

Here are key elements of how Kayla Rolland was shot and killed at Buell Elementary School in the Beecher School District on Feb. 29, 2000 -- and the aftermath.

www.mlive.com

Right. There's no reason that a child that age should have been able to lay hands on a gun, let along take it school and use it.

 

[Red Cat]

I've read the Sereny book on Bell. A very uncomfortable and disturbing read which at least tries to get to the heart of why Bell committed the awful crime she did. Of course, no one can condone it, but at least this book attempts to understand why it may've happened and what led Bell to do such a thing. Like I say, an unsettling, but well researched book.

It should go without saying that going some way to understanding isn't the same as condoning.

 

[Tanya1982]

Right. There's no reason that a child that age should have been able to lay hands on a gun, let along take it school and use it.

I agree. The parents (or whoever it was) should get the sentence. I’m not a big prison sort of person generally, but in this case I’d make an exception. If you have a gun in your house, it’s your responsibility to make damn sure that nobody who shouldn’t have it gets their hands on it. If your child uses it to harm someone else, or themselves, that’s on you. Your gun, your house, your child, your responsibility, you go to jail.

It might seem arbitrary and therefore unfair, but until/unless the US brings in proper gun control, saying to parents ‘you’ll do the time’ (every last year of it, including those multiple life sentences the US goes in for in the case of a person causing multiple deaths) might provide the incentive to make sure less kids get their hands on guns that have been kept, unsecured or not secure enough, in their home environments.

 

[likesfish]

If you can’t keep a 6 year old from getting hold of your handgun you shouldn’t have one.

 

[DaveCinzano]

If you can’t keep a 6 year old from getting hold of your handgun you shouldn’t have one.

A six year old or a handgun?

 

[cupid_stunt]

A six year old or a handgun?

Both.

 

[Raheem]

If you can’t keep a 6 year old from getting hold of your handgun you shouldn’t have one.

Thing is, the NRA would probably half agree (not that anyone shouldn't have one, but that the blame lies with individuals).

 

[likesfish]

They claim you cant lock guns away because you might need them instantly.
Same when pointed out that the IDF and the US military when not on operations walk about with out a magazine in.

 

[Yuwipi Woman]

They claim you cant lock guns away because you might need them instantly.
Same when pointed out that the IDF and the US military when not on operations walk about with out a magazine in.

Biometric trigger locks have been timed to release as fast as .3 seconds so that really doesn't make sense, but neither does a 6-year-old shooting a teacher.

 

[likesfish]

Actually someone had the balls to say they needed to keep a magazine in their “emotional support” rifle at all times as dust might get inside and damage it.

It’s an AR15 not a Swiss swatch

 

[Pickman's model]

Actually someone had the balls to say they needed to keep a magazine in their “emotional support” rifle at all times as dust might get inside and damage it.

It’s an AR15 not a Swiss swatch

Sure they can keep a magazine in for that purpose, if they want, but they don't need to have it full of bullets

 

[Pickman's model]

Biometric trigger locks have been timed to release as fast as .3 seconds so that really doesn't make sense, but neither does a 6-year-old shooting a teacher

As I'm sure has already been pointed out, if she'd had a gun this might have ended otherwise

 

[Yuwipi Woman]

As I'm sure has already been pointed out, if she'd had a gun this might have ended otherwise

There's been proposals for requiring trigger locks on all guns, but as usual, we're not allowed to do that because of the paranoia of the right. If you're not going to do any meaningful gun control, trigger locks would at least cut down on kids accidentally (or intentionally in this case) shooting someone.

 

[likesfish]

Sure they can keep a magazine in for that purpose, if they want, but they don't need to have it full of bullets

Unfortunately unless you have some of the transparent magazines nobody can tell if you’ve got rounds in it or not.
That’s why the army treats any weapon with a magazine on as loaded.

 

[Pickman's model]

Unfortunately unless you have some of the transparent magazines nobody can tell if you’ve got rounds in it or not.
That’s why the army treats any weapon with a magazine on as loaded.

It wasn't clear you were talking about the army. With the number of Americans attached to ar15s you might have said a soldier instead of someone.

 

[8ball]

Unfortunately unless you have some of the transparent magazines nobody can tell if you’ve got rounds in it or not.
That’s why the army treats any weapon with a magazine on as loaded.

You could still have a round chambered. Seems like an accident waiting to happen…

 

[likesfish]

possibly hence a magazine in is a loaded state and Normal Safety Procedures are drilled into you.

 

[8ball]

possibly hence a magazine in is a loaded state and Normal Safety Procedures are drilled into you.

Not as safe as always treating a gun like it’s loaded, but can see how that would pose practical difficulties in the military.

 

[spitfire]

You can take the mag out and still have one in the breech so I was taught to treat all guns as live unless they were literally in pieces.

 

[likesfish]

Not as safe as always treating a gun like it’s loaded, but can see how that would pose practical difficulties in the military.

it was more a response to the American idiots who want to carry an AR15 in public.

 

[8ball]

it was more a response to the American idiots who want to carry an AR15 in public.

Fair enough, apols for tangent.

Maybe we need separate threads for mass shootings, non-mass shootings, en-masse shootings* and general US gun situation discussion.

* - not to mention Mass shootings (Catholic speciality), en passant shootings (aka drive-bys) and shootings by small children and animals

 

[bcuster]

6 family members, including baby, shot dead at home in targeted 'massacre': Sheriff

Six people were gunned down at a central California home in what the sheriff is calling a targeted attack.

abcnews.go.com

 

[editor]

6 family members, including baby, shot dead at home in targeted 'massacre': Sheriff

Six people were gunned down at a central California home in what the sheriff is calling a targeted attack.

abcnews.go.com

This is really sick. A 6 month old baby, FFS.

Six people were gunned down at a central California home in what the sheriff called a targeted and likely gang-related attack.

Among those killed in the "horrific massacre" were a 17-year-old mom and a 6-month-old baby, Tulare County Sheriff Mike Boudreaux told reporters. Both were shot in the head, he said.

"We do have survivors," the sheriff said, adding that it's not yet clear how they survived.

 

[bcuster]

After Man Kills His Wife, Mother-in-Law, Five Children, Then Self, Obituary Memorializes Him as a Family Man

On Jan. 4, police discovered the bodies of eight members of a Utah family dead from gunshot wounds

people.com

 

[petee]

After Man Kills His Wife, Mother-in-Law, Five Children, Then Self, Obituary Memorializes Him as a Family Man

On Jan. 4, police discovered the bodies of eight members of a Utah family dead from gunshot wounds

people.com

holy fuck

this entire psychotic mantra of moms and dads and jesus (and guns and football and capitalism) and i hate to link to the post but this detail doesn't seem to be in the People article

A glowing obituary for a Utah man who is suspected of killing his entire family in a murder-suicide plot said he “made it a point to spend quality time with each and every one of his children” — as an online fundraiser bizarrely replaces him with an image of Jesus in a family photo.

https:// nypost.com /2023/01/16/obit-praises-utah-dad-michael-haight-who-killed-wife-5-kids/

i seriously think i'm gonna put my fist through something

an obit published in the Spectrum did not mention the killings and painted an angelic picture of the shooter, saying he “excelled at everything he did” after graduating from high school in 1998 as a “Sterling scholar in business.”

“He achieved the rank of Eagle Scout,” the tone-deaf piece said.

 

[wemakeyousoundb]

8 shot at MLK car show and family fund day event

there was a disagreement of some sort between two parties, and unfortunately, they chose to resolve that with guns

FFS