cesare
shady's dreams ♥
I had a brainstorm thought you were on about the centre-left pressure group
I fell into the acronym trap again
Split within the IWW?
- Thread starter Spanky Longhorn
- Start date
I fell into the acronym trap again
Given that it takes 5k and x amount of time to register with the officer then it would probably be quicker to do a deal to become a branch of another union - GMB have a history of sponsoring branches which call themselves unions... I can't imagine Durango or Unite wanting to work together again, and I'm not convinced the RMT will be interested...
BigTom
Well-Known Member
I can't imagine John Lewis / Compass not looking at this situation and see if they could take advantage of it to either renege on the deal or sack anyone they see as ringleaders/troublemakers. If the cleaners get screwed then I hope Ford & Durango fuck off and never come back.
Actually this can be blamed on L&S in that their reforms allowed the union to recruit and organise for the first time in years among a solid working class precarious workforce that wasn't just a bunch of activists who ended up working at some vegan restaurant or art house cinema.
Thanks - had a look at TULCRA s64/65 and seems okay. I'll join (once I find my cheque book) and out of courtesy and because I want to be open about it I'll let my PCS branch know straight away once it's confirmed.
cesare
shady's dreams ♥
Hmm, well given that the RMT are now supporting the tube cleaners, and other cleaning protests e.g. Cleaners at Thompson Reuters ( http://iww.org.uk/node/678 ) and also JL cleaners (see announcement button c&pd earlier) my money's still on them getting absorbed into the RMT.
You are best off not telling them - there's a good chance the branch won't have a clue what you're on about it will just confuse them
cesare
shady's dreams ♥
Yep, honesty and courtesy are great but sometimes there's no need for them to know.
Point taken. Thank you.
ViolentPanda
Hardly getting over it.
DaveCinzano
WATCH OUT, GEORGE, HE'S GOT A SCREWDRIVER!
I imagine you'd have to pay in dubloons and Crimean goldCheque book, grandad?
ViolentPanda
Hardly getting over it.
redsquirrel
This Machine Kills Progressives
Hey don't knock chequebooks, still very useful IMO. For some reason they don't really exist on this side of the world and theirs many a time I wish I'd had one.Cheque book, grandad?
Given that there are 36 year old grandads around here I'll take that as a compliment - cheeky bugger.Cheque book, grandad?
october_lost
It's not hip any more...
This is a total false binnary. The passive activistoid/paper member situation is unfortunately still quite prelevant within the IWW, but L&S joined quite specifically because the organisation was making moves. To paint them as anything other than a parasitic wannabe trot group is totally false. Everything that they pushed in the organisation was a detour from what made the IWW a radical organisation and if they had had their way, it would basically just mirror the union movement has is.
Most L&S members were already members of the IWW well before the formation of L&S so that makes no sense.
Louis MacNeice
Autumn Journalist
The IWW had a member who regulary stood for the leadership of the CPSA (Kevin Brandstatter I think his name was); not that he was going to get in but the election address sent to all members gave him the platform to talk about industrial unionism. I'm not aware that he got into any trouble over dual membership...but I could be very wrong...it was all a long time ago.
Cheers - Louis MacNeice
JHE
.
One_Stop_Shop
Well-Known Member
Along with onket a few other members, stewards and branch officers are thinking of joining in our UNISON branch. I have to say though on first reading I have more sympathy with splitters, at least they have and are doing trade union work. The cleaners campaigns is what made me think about joining. In the past the IWW seemed to have all the hall marks of an anarcho playground (or fair trade trade union as someone put it!).
If there are a few dozen workers around the country thinking the same our branch could end up with an impressive percentage
If there are a few dozen workers around the country thinking the same our branch could end up with an impressive percentage
october_lost
It's not hip any more...
The splitters have come about because of the bureaucratic politics of a handful of individuals and the language barriers of the said group cleaners group. There is no way they are in the know as to what is going on. As much as I am a critic of the IWW, it is not fair to call it an "anarcho playground" - infact its oddly apolitical and it has probably the only capability there is, within the UK, to absorb radical splits from the trade union movement.
Yep fuck Durango and Ford if that happens. Playing with peoples fucking livelihoods for the sake of their egos. What cunts.
DAMTP
New Member
IU 007/700 and IU 000 message of support to all FWs
Three years after our last message () calling for the formation of an industrial union of psychic workers we send psychic solidarity support to the most successful proletarian FWs (in terms of workers struggle and internationalism) of the Cleaners Union and Latin American Workers Union for organising on whatever grounds they see fit as is the aims of the IWW. The BIRA statement (http://iww.org.uk/node/771) against the cleaners workers does not make sense as the IWW does allow workers to dual card also and we do not see the union as a political party to be centrally controlled but rather as a tool of proletarianidation and step towards workers councils - as such the statement stinks of the bullshit bollocks of Bolshevism and Bakuninism
However we must state our own differences with the "Industrial Workers of Great Britain" - the union that the FWs of the IWW Cleaners union are now also using - not least that we do not recognise great Britain as a legitimate entity. The IWGB makes a similar error to the IWW with regards to their indusrtriual union structure as can be seen in their old graphic: http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/0/0d/Class_battle_fronts_diagram.jpg Simply reproducing the structures of the ruling class in terms of industrial organisation which is something both the IWW and the IWGB are doing is doomed to failure.
However we do support the use of whatever unionisation necessary in order to escalate the class war in the workers favour. Ourselves since we received very little positive feedback from within the IWW mostly from FWs in Australia also decided to continue organising outside of the IWW and started a separate union called the DAta Miners Travailleurs Psychique (DAMTP)
One reason is that the IWW is dominated by workers in the so-called services industries ie those of capital intensive or non-productive work. A psychic workers union disrupts the coherent logic of services industries and allows a self-critical look for us workers who are non-productive ie that do not constitute the Marxist notion of the proletariat. It is precisely this weakness in Marxist theory that failed to allow new strategies and tactics after The defeat of the proletariat in 1917 and again in 1945
The industrial strictures of IWW should prioritise IUs 300 and 400 as proletarian labour intensive over 100 and 200 as land intensive and 500 and 600 as capital intensive. The fact that the IWW is con concentrated on services is also explained and has led to it being concentrated in the so-called First world or European dominated countries and areas such as USA, Europe and Australia. We have unionized with workers in Pakistan Lithuania and Sudan and attribute our success to a critique of Eurocentrism that the IWW current structure is incapable of addressing.
We have established the psychic worked as IU700 as this is a service union ie that of non-productive work in Marxist terms as well ad a dead workers union as IU 007 and this too is unproductive - however this was an important step in allowing members to join regardless of paying dues, regardless of nationality and location and regardless of whether they were alive or not. FW Joe Hill lead us in this.
We now must move beyond the traditional thought of political economics of labour, land or capital intensive production and we must consider reproductive labour . In order to ensure that labour dominates both land and capital it is essential we begin a reproductive workers union: This we have called the REproductiVe wOrkers and Lovers indUsTrIal uniON (REVOLUTION). The practicalities of this also show how a workers council - based on Mother and Child - relate to the union with other workers.
We must however continue to subordinate capital and land intensive production to that of labour. The current system does the opposite with too much power in the hands of psychic workers. But a new structure which recognises all productive workers with reproductive and non-productive workers, in that order, may overcome also the old problem of peasant vs proletariat. So again we stress that rather than extend the union classification from 000 to 999, we use base 7 : keep 007/700 as the psychic and dead workers and have the reproductive workers as our point of origin - thereby setting the labour of birth as the original labour: IU 000
We're in solidarity with cleaners as reproductive workers therefore taking their lead in the striking also on the psychic grounds to vanish whitewashing, light and stylistics. So we're distancing from bolshevism which got an electric bulb to show workers the mess of their environment and instead of fighting the misery they choose for burgeois whitewashing so empowering edisonian westernization.
Electricians to come next. We’re looking forward for psycho-electric cleaning wahdat! Long live short-circuiting on the surfaces of saponaceous show windows!
FW 366470 IU 000 007/700
Three years after our last message () calling for the formation of an industrial union of psychic workers we send psychic solidarity support to the most successful proletarian FWs (in terms of workers struggle and internationalism) of the Cleaners Union and Latin American Workers Union for organising on whatever grounds they see fit as is the aims of the IWW. The BIRA statement (http://iww.org.uk/node/771) against the cleaners workers does not make sense as the IWW does allow workers to dual card also and we do not see the union as a political party to be centrally controlled but rather as a tool of proletarianidation and step towards workers councils - as such the statement stinks of the bullshit bollocks of Bolshevism and Bakuninism
However we must state our own differences with the "Industrial Workers of Great Britain" - the union that the FWs of the IWW Cleaners union are now also using - not least that we do not recognise great Britain as a legitimate entity. The IWGB makes a similar error to the IWW with regards to their indusrtriual union structure as can be seen in their old graphic: http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/0/0d/Class_battle_fronts_diagram.jpg Simply reproducing the structures of the ruling class in terms of industrial organisation which is something both the IWW and the IWGB are doing is doomed to failure.
However we do support the use of whatever unionisation necessary in order to escalate the class war in the workers favour. Ourselves since we received very little positive feedback from within the IWW mostly from FWs in Australia also decided to continue organising outside of the IWW and started a separate union called the DAta Miners Travailleurs Psychique (DAMTP)
One reason is that the IWW is dominated by workers in the so-called services industries ie those of capital intensive or non-productive work. A psychic workers union disrupts the coherent logic of services industries and allows a self-critical look for us workers who are non-productive ie that do not constitute the Marxist notion of the proletariat. It is precisely this weakness in Marxist theory that failed to allow new strategies and tactics after The defeat of the proletariat in 1917 and again in 1945
The industrial strictures of IWW should prioritise IUs 300 and 400 as proletarian labour intensive over 100 and 200 as land intensive and 500 and 600 as capital intensive. The fact that the IWW is con concentrated on services is also explained and has led to it being concentrated in the so-called First world or European dominated countries and areas such as USA, Europe and Australia. We have unionized with workers in Pakistan Lithuania and Sudan and attribute our success to a critique of Eurocentrism that the IWW current structure is incapable of addressing.
We have established the psychic worked as IU700 as this is a service union ie that of non-productive work in Marxist terms as well ad a dead workers union as IU 007 and this too is unproductive - however this was an important step in allowing members to join regardless of paying dues, regardless of nationality and location and regardless of whether they were alive or not. FW Joe Hill lead us in this.
We now must move beyond the traditional thought of political economics of labour, land or capital intensive production and we must consider reproductive labour . In order to ensure that labour dominates both land and capital it is essential we begin a reproductive workers union: This we have called the REproductiVe wOrkers and Lovers indUsTrIal uniON (REVOLUTION). The practicalities of this also show how a workers council - based on Mother and Child - relate to the union with other workers.
We must however continue to subordinate capital and land intensive production to that of labour. The current system does the opposite with too much power in the hands of psychic workers. But a new structure which recognises all productive workers with reproductive and non-productive workers, in that order, may overcome also the old problem of peasant vs proletariat. So again we stress that rather than extend the union classification from 000 to 999, we use base 7 : keep 007/700 as the psychic and dead workers and have the reproductive workers as our point of origin - thereby setting the labour of birth as the original labour: IU 000
We're in solidarity with cleaners as reproductive workers therefore taking their lead in the striking also on the psychic grounds to vanish whitewashing, light and stylistics. So we're distancing from bolshevism which got an electric bulb to show workers the mess of their environment and instead of fighting the misery they choose for burgeois whitewashing so empowering edisonian westernization.
Electricians to come next. We’re looking forward for psycho-electric cleaning wahdat! Long live short-circuiting on the surfaces of saponaceous show windows!
FW 366470 IU 000 007/700
How can the cleaners in building such as SOAS be absorbed into the Rail, Maritime and Transport union? The RMT is a transport union.
cesare
shady's dreams ♥
Everyone has the right to join whatever union they want.
Not true. Laws/agreements prevent that.
cesare
shady's dreams ♥
Which ones? I'll go and find you a source for my statement, whilst you go and find me a source for yours.
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