Should there be an energy/fuel payment strike in the UK?

[Sasaferrato]

We've always been quarterly in arrears.

 

[rutabowa]

We've always been quarterly in arrears.

Which I think will be the same rate as a prepay meter, it's only direct debit that has superficially cheaper deals... but I used to not keep on top of quarterly bills and end up getting extra charges.

 

[Sasaferrato]

Which I think will be the same rate as a prepay meter, it's only direct debit that has superficially cheaper deals... but I used to not keep on top of quarterly bills and end up getting extra charges.

It comes, it gets paid. Life is too short to fret about things you can't control.

 

[existentialist]

We've not paid the water bill because it's that, the electric or the council tax and the other two will get us in more trouble if we don't pay them. Doubt I'm the only person in that position. Never mind the bits of the economy that rely on people's disposable income.

I have no doubt that the bars to entry are legion, and it's probably a ludicrously hoop-jumping exercise, but...

WaterSure scheme – help with paying water bills

Watersure is a scheme to help save money with your water bill, if you get certain benefits and you have three or more children under 19 or someone in your house has a medical condition that means more water gets used.

www.citizensadvice.org.uk

 

[girasol]

For all that's worth the #PowerOff thing is happening tonight at 10pm for 10 minutes. Given that most people are not on twitter, I'm not sure how widely know it is or how effective it will be - if millions did switch off then maybe, but it's probably going to be in the 1000s. Im going to do it anyway, see what happens.

https://twitter.com/hashtag/PowerOff

Also, saw this on DM today

Martin Lewis warns 'civil unrest isn't far away' due to cost of living

Martin Lewis, who built a loyal following for his financial advice, said lower earners have nothing left to cut back on and that rising levels of inflation have left people unable to pay for food and heating.

www.dailymail.co.uk

Money Saving Expert Martin Lewis warns 'civil unrest isn't far away' as cost of living crisis grips Britain and demands Rishi Sunak does more to 'keep people fed and warm'​

 

[girasol]

According to someone on Twitter

"for anybody thinking this didn't work, think again. The UK pumped storage had to be used to balance the grid frequency. Roughly 10% of the capacity. Once it's used, it can't be re-used for many hours. Next time do it at 8, them again at 9. More people the better."

Not sure how they know this or if it's true. I think it'll happen again next week, maybe more people will join.

 

[muscovyduck]

According to someone on Twitter

"for anybody thinking this didn't work, think again. The UK pumped storage had to be used to balance the grid frequency. Roughly 10% of the capacity. Once it's used, it can't be re-used for many hours. Next time do it at 8, them again at 9. More people the better."

Not sure how they know this or if it's true. I think it'll happen again next week, maybe more people will join.

Wasn't in a position to do it this week because I didn't plan ahead. If it's actually 'worked' (and if this is true this would probably count under my definition of 'worked') I'll make sure I'm ready for it next time.

 

[David Clapson]

4 weeks ago a French bank warned of civil unrest in the UK:

U.K.’s Wealth Gap and Housing Costs Risk Civil Unrest, BNP Says

Britain is the second most unsustainable of 36 major economies, with tensions from high housing and childcare costs coupled with wealth inequalities undermining social mobility and threatening to provoke civil unrest.

www.bloomberg.com

12ft |

12ft.io

Seems to me it's a matter of when, not if. Anyone care to make a prediction? Crop failure and war will keep driving food prices up. As for fuel...fuck knows. Does anyone anticipate a mass uprising here? Are the Tories making contingency plans?

The Bloomberg story, in full:

U.K.’s Wealth Gap and Housing Costs Risk Civil Unrest, L’Atelier BNP Says​

• Researcher says U.K. near bottom on economic sustainability
• Analysis measures nation’s success in delivering wealth

By Philip Aldrick 24 March 2022, 00:01 GMT
Britain is the second most unsustainable of 36 major economies, with tensions from high housing and childcare costs coupled with wealth inequalities undermining social mobility and threatening to provoke civil unrest.

That is the conclusion of a new metric designed by L’Atelier BNP Paribas, an independent research subsidiary of the French bank. It aims to measure the success of nations in delivering wealth, moving beyond the blunt estimate of aggregate output captured by gross domestic product.

Only Latvia fared worse than the U.K. John Egan, chief executive officer of L’Atelier BNP Paribas, said the U.K. ranked so poorly due to its high cost of accommodation, which includes rents, mortgages and associated taxes, and limited support for childcare.

In London, more than half of net income is spent on housing on average compared with 25% in Berlin. That “puts pressure on households and limits social mobility,” Egan said. Germany placed sixth in the index.

With economic gains concentrated among a relatively small group and others struggling with basic living expenses, the U.K. “is failing to provide an economy able to support the core promise of equitably distributed, merit based social mobility that is integral to a healthy capitalist democracy in the medium to long term,” the report said.

Despite being the fifth largest economy on the world with solid headline GDP growth, the U.K. is at risk of “social unrest, protest and extremism,” the report said.

It noted that millennials -- those aged between 26 and 40 --are the first generation who can expect to be poorer than their parents. That’s because housing is expensive relative to incomes, inflation is at a 30 year high, and real wages are falling.

The U.S., the world’s largest economy, fared little better than the U.K, ranking 31 out of 36. Weaker economies, such as Italy, ranked higher due mainly to their lower cost of housing. Italy ranked 9th, and France 15th. Luxembourg is the most sustainable economy.

The Telegraph story, in full:

Spiralling prices risk causing unrest across Britain, warns French bank. L’Atelier BNP Paribas says UK economy is among Europe’s most fragile By Louis Ashworth 24 March 2022 • 6:39pm

The cost of living crisis risks sparking social unrest in Britain because its economy is one of the most fragile in Europe, a subsidiary of a French investment bank has warned.

L’Atelier, part of BNP Paribas, said that there is a danger of "social unrest, protest and extremism" after the UK ranked 35th out of 36 countries for its ability to deliver higher wages, lower costs and social mobility.

Only Latvia performed worse, with Spain, Greece and Lithuania making up the rest of the bottom five.

It came after the Office for Budget Responsibility warned British households face the sharpest slump in living standards on record, with inflation at a 30-year-high and tax rising.

L’Atelier’s sustainable economic barometer attempts to measure countries on their ability to drive social mobility by equitably distributing the fruits of their economic growth.

The UK’s poor score “indicates a reduced capacity to facilitate social mobility and is a strong indicator of future socio-economic protest and instability”, the report said.

It pointed to soaring inflation, wage rises that cannot keep up with the rising cost of living, and record-high prices for housing and rent.

L’Atelier said: “Combined, these factors mean the UK is failing to provide an economy able to support the core promise of equitably distributed, merit based social mobility that is integral to a healthy capitalist democracy in the medium to long term.”

Luxembourg, Norway, Sweden and Austria topped its ranking, while larger economies including the United States, Japan and Canada performed more poorly.

John Egan, chief executive of L’Atelier BNP Paribas, said: “Looking at the UK, it’s clear that improving GDP figures disguise a deeper economic failure. The low British score tells us that the UK economy is failing to deliver equitable opportunity to people living in the country.

“Some factors are unavoidable – the Covid bailouts increasing the already significant deficit, or the global downturn affecting macroeconomic measures. But others, such as the high cost of essential ingredients of living such as housing, could be fixed with the right set of policies.”

 

[platinumsage]

Why would a French bank have it’s finger in the pulse of the average (or revolutionary) British resident

People have been predicting this sort of stuff every year since the 2011 riots, which were hardly directly attributable to immediate changes in the economy themselves.

 

[skyscraper101]

Why would a French bank have it’s finger in the pulse of the average (or revolutionary) British resident

People have been predicting this sort of stuff every year since the 2011 riots, which were hardly directly attributable to immediate changes in the economy themselves.

Because it’s in their interest, and that of the French state given how much of it is invested in Britain.

 

[8ball]

This civil unrest business is taking a while to get going.

 

[hitmouse]

People trying to organise towards a date of October 1st:

Don't Pay

A thousand new beginnings

dontpay.uk

 

[srb7677]

The problem with energy bill strikes is that they have us by the balls because so many of us depend upon access to credit to buy cars, pay monthly installments on insurance, and carry us over bad months or manage sudden surprise expenses. And if we renege on our bills our credit rating would be slaughtered. I for one cannot afford to risk that.

 

[MickiQ]

Another of those ideas that sounds good but is inevitably doomed from the get go. Getting a million people to sign up threatening to cancel their DD's if the govt doesn't fold is one thing. Getting a million people to actually cancel them after Oct 1st if it doesn't is a different thing. There is no way that anyone cancelling theirs and then refusing to pay is ever going to be sure that there are 999,999 other people doing the same and they are not one of a small number out on a limb. The electric companies don't have to prosecute a million people they just have to start pursuing the first few hundred and loads are going to fold because there is nowhere they can turn to for support if the courts get as far as them.
Plus sign up now and you have three months to mull the consequences of being on the losing side and deciding "well I won't bother anyway"
And of course the most desperate in society the most likely to stick it out are on prepayment meters so they can't take part anyway. People paying by DD are bit better off and can't afford a bad credit rating.
And giving credit where credit is due I paraphrase SpookyFrank and point out that the people whose support is most needed still have some carrot available and there are enough sticks to beat them with.

 

[Flavour]

This civil unrest business is taking a while to get going.

if the hot weather continues eventually some sort of spark will be set alight. see also: 2011.

 

[8ball]

if the hot weather continues eventually some sort of spark will be set alight. see also: 2011.

The hot weather seemed to stop yesterday.