A disproportionate amount of perpetrators of this type of crime are men. Why is their race deemed important but their gender irrelevant?
Rotherham child rape gangs: At least 1400 victims
- Thread starter Ole
- Start date
hot air baboon
Well-Known Member
.....aceess and vulnerability is like arguing about why a bank robber knocks off a building society instead of a bank...the isssue is why is the robbery commissioned in the first instance...what creates the "demand"...
.…the idea that the perpetrators of these crimes do so in a cultural vacuum insulated from a society drenched in sexualised images of overwhelmingly white girls, in which little girls are sold t-shirts emblazoned with "Porn Star", let alone the interent generally......come off it ... what message is that sending....
..and ftr...
However, evidence presented to us suggests that there is a model of localised grooming of Pakistani-heritage men targeting young White girls.
This must be acknowledged by official agencies, who we were concerned to hear in some areas of particular community tension, had reportedly been slow to draw attention to the issue for fear of affecting community cohesion.
House of Commons Home Affairs Committee
Child sexual exploitation and the response to localised grooming
Second Report of Session 2013–14
http://www.publications.parliament.uk/pa/cm201314/cmselect/cmhaff/68/68i.pdf
.…the idea that the perpetrators of these crimes do so in a cultural vacuum insulated from a society drenched in sexualised images of overwhelmingly white girls, in which little girls are sold t-shirts emblazoned with "Porn Star", let alone the interent generally......come off it ... what message is that sending....
..and ftr...
However, evidence presented to us suggests that there is a model of localised grooming of Pakistani-heritage men targeting young White girls.
This must be acknowledged by official agencies, who we were concerned to hear in some areas of particular community tension, had reportedly been slow to draw attention to the issue for fear of affecting community cohesion.
House of Commons Home Affairs Committee
Child sexual exploitation and the response to localised grooming
Second Report of Session 2013–14
http://www.publications.parliament.uk/pa/cm201314/cmselect/cmhaff/68/68i.pdf
Grandma Death
Reconfiguring & Reconstructing
I'm not suggesting gender isn't irrelevant. But we are talking about race. Feel free to open up a discussion about gender if you wish.
Pickman's model
Starry Wisdom
one down, one to go
brogdale
Coming to terms with late onset Anarchism
Are "we" talking about race?
A rare moment on MSM this morning with R4's "Today" programme interviewing a woman of Pakistani origin who felt able to discuss aspects of Pakistani culture that might engender abusive attitudes towards (young) vulnerable girls/women including those in their own 'community'. Yet again though, there appeared to be little consideration of the cultural drivers behind the wilful and dangerous disregard of the victims of CSE prevalent within the local state/police charged with their protection.
Grandma Death
Reconfiguring & Reconstructing
Had a lengthy conversation with my mate last night who's Asian (of Sri Lankan heritage) he argued in general Pakistani culture is misogynistic. He also suggested if we can say the met is institutionally racist we can say the same about the Pakistani community . My issue with this is this entire debate about culture is quite offensive. I readily accept misogynistic attitudes exist in the Pakistani community as it does throughout society. I accept its degrees of too. But what drove these men was sex, power and vulnerability. I won't accept they did it because they were misogynistic because not all misogynists comitt crimes like this. Secondly why aren't we having this debate about white attitudes and the high level peado rings. In fact such a debate arguably takes the heat off the states failings. We need to be focusing why these girls were in the position they were and why the police and local authority ignored the girls.
dolly's gal
killing things
is anyone actually buying the excuse the police and other authorities have come up with, in that they let what was going on happen because they thought intervening would be construed as racist? because that reeks of extreme bullshit to me
Race certainly can come into these exploitiv cases, look at where dirty old men go for Sex Tourism, Thailand, not Africa, look at where Liberated White Middle-age women go to find love and express heir sexuality, AFRICA. Two different continents.
'If only you were blonde with blue eyes i'd be enjoying this so much more'
nino_savatte
No pasaran!
The racialisation of crime and the media's focus on race with regards to this issue is reminiscent of the mugging scare. That's all. Keep up.
What about the victims?
happie chappie
Well-Known Member
Why?
Because there is no allegation that men are getting away with this type of crime because investigators are frightened of appearing misogynistic.
nino_savatte
No pasaran!
Perhaps some of my detractors agree with Daniel Hannan?
happie chappie
Well-Known Member
Well, the independent report said it was a factor.
It has also been suggested that it was a factor in other similar cases such as that in Derby.
nino_savatte
No pasaran!
No? How do you know that? More importantly, why the media's emphasis on 'race'? This is about male attitudes to women and children and it cuts across all cultures.
nino_savatte
No pasaran!
Which leads to the inevitable and flawed conclusion that black people are genetically predisposed to criminality. You're familiar with racial profiling. Right?
But child sex abuse isn't a problem exclusive to men from Pakistan. Nor is Paedophile gangs. So why should their race be 'questioned' but Jimmy Savile's race not? Can you see the trap you're falling into here?
I guess no black man was arrested for anything in the last ten years.
So why did Jimmy Savile get away with it?
hot air baboon
Well-Known Member
...we covered off the Jimmy Savile point a few pages back.....urban75 is across it...!
happie chappie
Well-Known Member
likesfish
You can't park here sir
Look at who got locked up they didnt have money or power or connections but they were all of pakistani orgins.
Of course race is going to play a part especially if people were claiming its racist to claim pakistani nonce gangs were targeting white girls.
The offical report makes it clear people were reluctant to deal with it because it sounds like old fashioned white slavery myths racist bollocks
Of course race is going to play a part especially if people were claiming its racist to claim pakistani nonce gangs were targeting white girls.
The offical report makes it clear people were reluctant to deal with it because it sounds like old fashioned white slavery myths racist bollocks
happie chappie
Well-Known Member
You’re falling into a trap.
No one denies white men are paedophiles or there are white paedophile gangs.
But are Pakistani men statistically more likely to commit gang-related crimes of sexual exploitation and brutal sexual slavery than, say, white men?
If so, why (and what is to be done about it?)
I don’t know the answer either of these questions by the way.
Ole
Well-Known Member
You are alleging he got away with it because he was a man and investigators were afraid of being construed as sexist for investigating a man?
A lot of bad reasoning being thrown around here.
Of course not, but to be fair, it doesn't seem the police and civil authorities are actually saying this themselves, contrary to the suggestions of the media reporting of this case.
Useful to read the relevant sections of the independent inquiry report.
bmd
Island in the stream.
As far as the whole race thing goes I think this: that people who wish to behave in ways that the law disallows will find ways to get around those laws. These men used the authorities fear of being labelled as racist as a way to carry on their behaviours.
I think the impact of that may be that less Pakistani/Indian/Asian men were investigated for these crimes. That all of this has come to light now, in this way must be having a terrible effect on those communities and be a field day for racists. So really, the police, social services and council have brought this on those communities as well as those girls by not doing their job in the first place.
I think the impact of that may be that less Pakistani/Indian/Asian men were investigated for these crimes. That all of this has come to light now, in this way must be having a terrible effect on those communities and be a field day for racists. So really, the police, social services and council have brought this on those communities as well as those girls by not doing their job in the first place.
His powerful position and his race are unconnected?
Seems odd to racialise one crime but not the other.
I'm falling into no trap. Statistically men are more likely to commit this crime than women. Finding out which race are the worst offenders doesn't solve the problem. It just shifts focus from one group onto another.
comrade spurski
Well-Known Member
And there lies the problem...1400 kids abused by asian men and you discuss race, 600 or so children abused by saville, dozens by rolf harris, dozens by clifford, dozens by hall, hundreds by cyril smith...all white men, and no discussion of race takes place...why is that?
Oh yeah I forgot...its an issue of race cos you say so cos you somewhere that pakistani men are disproportionately involved.
Screw facts, screw reality...just spout shit with no proof and scream pc gone mad at anyone who disagrees.
The issue is not race...it is the abuse of children ffs
happie chappie
Well-Known Member
I’m not sure what your argument is.
The independent report said race was a factor. If you disagree then it’s up to you to say why and then take it up with Professor Jay, not me.
By the way, you've still not answered my questions.
dolly's gal
killing things
the independent report said it was a factor based on discussions with the police and other agencies though. ergo that conclusion was drawn because the police involved said it was a factor. which in my mind, reeks of bullshit.
since when have the police cared about being construed as racist? if they gave one single fuck about that their stop and search stats wouldn't be as they are.
furthermore, if they were concerned about community cohesion, why did they allow 1,400 kids to be abused. were those children/their parents not part of that same community?
nah, it's a convenient excuse, an afterthought if you will...
happie chappie
Well-Known Member
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