Opening up a fireplace

[nogojones]

I would make sure the arched bricks are bonded together well before doing anything else. Then start by carefully removing the bodged up bits between the arch and the yellow bricks. The rest can then be removed but probably best to drill the mortar out between the bricks rather than thrashing at them with a hammer and chisel.

Victorian houses were sometimes built with shit mortar. It's hard to judge the quality of yours, give it a good poking and see if it starts falling apart easily.

If it doesn't, I'd say you're good to go and just break out your kango/SDS. If it looks a bit shit invest in a lintle half a brick bigger than either side of your blue line - they're cheep, carefully chop out that section and fit the lintle. Re-point all the bits above, then break out your SDS. The worst that will happen is you loose the original arch. You'll have to make a decision where your lintle will go, hight wise.

Once it's open you can get your chimney tested for leaks/ damage/brickfalls.

Are you looking to put an open fire or burner in there? If it's a burner check out what the HETAS regs are in terms of hearth size clearence space of the burner etc... This might inform your chouce of where you put a lintle if you have to.

 

[Leafster]

I'm not an expert. My two fireplaces both have a curved iron bar below the arched bricks and it looks as these were put in place at the time the fireplaces were build as they extend into the vertical brickwork either side.

My house was built ca. 1930 and the brickwork appears to be in much better condition than yours. I wonder if your brickwork on the left has been redone where the iron bar would have previously slotted in as the bricks look a different colour.

I think I would get a brickie in to look at it before attempting to take out too many bricks.

 

[ska invita]

Well hard times are here and winter is coming so I need to consider winter heating.

I live in a small thirties house with a bricked up fireplace in the front room with an original fireplace in my bedroom connected to the one below.

It’s a rented house but no regular inspections.

So on a whim I got my big hammer out and smashed the opening clear and removed all the crap inside. Hoovered the soot out. View attachment 340434View attachment 340436

Doing it on a whim (not even pissed) has led to a lot of dust. Plus rubble. The hoover appears blocked.

However this project, unfinished as it is, will get finished.

I’m thinking of just putting a angle iron trim on the hole and plastering up to it.

Then stick a grate in there and get a fire guard. Bit of paint and all good. Get the chainsaw out and go foraging.

I can either say to the landlord “it was always there” or stick a bit of whiteboard over it and distract him.

Anyone need any rubble?

missed this thread first time
status update on the chimney please TC

 

[danski]

Might be something of use here

Chimney Safety Checklist

When chimneys fall into disrepair, they can quickly threaten the safety of your home. This checklist will help evaluate how adequately your chimney has been built and maintained over the years.

www.oldhouseonline.com

I googled ‘19th century chimney construction’ and saw a ton of pictures like yours

Ah, shit, didn't realise it was a US site. Sorry.

 

[BoatieBird]

I've got loads of washing to dry so the burner is on. Cosy

 

[keybored]

Thanks for the replies so far. Have exposed higher.

The iron would have been put in there by someone worrying about the arch failing. And it is now relying on the yellow brick.

If it was me I'd want to get the plaster off a substantial portion of the wall above and see what the brickwork is like. I'd not be surprised if the mortar is in a bad state - it often is around old flues - and the proper thing to do would be to rebuild the arch and/or put a new lintel in, as well as sorting out any dodgy brickwork above. I'd be careful.

How's it looking? There are no loose bricks. The lime mortar seems mostly sound, but some bits will give if I really dig at it with a screwdriver. There were what appeared to be shims in the mortar directly below the brick arch, pulled one out and it turned out to be a piece of slate. I think the bricks above the arch are supposed to take some stress from the arch and again they aren't loose/mortar doesn't seem too bad. I was only going to expose as high as the arch (or lintel if there was one) but I'm thinking of exposing the whole chimney breast now.

I'm not an expert. My two fireplaces both have a curved iron bar below the arched bricks and it looks as these were put in place at the time the fireplaces were build as they extend into the vertical brickwork either side.

My house was built ca. 1930 and the brickwork appears to be in much better condition than yours. I wonder if your brickwork on the left has been redone where the iron bar would have previously slotted in as the bricks look a different colour.

I think I would get a brickie in to look at it before attempting to take out too many bricks.

I think you're right and the bar is original. The brick might look a different colour because I hit it with the breaker. I dug out some more mortar and it does in fact extend all the way across and into both left and right jambs. It's about 12mm thick and seems solid. That's the higher dotted line on my earlier picture. The lower line is a thinner piece of metal that is only on top/slightly beyond the yellow bricks and could be some kind of plate to block the flue(?). Random bits of masonry and tile are jammed between the two metal parts.

Victorian houses were sometimes built with shit mortar. It's hard to judge the quality of yours, give it a good poking and see if it starts falling apart easily.

If it doesn't, I'd say you're good to go and just break out your kango/SDS. If it looks a bit shit invest in a lintle half a brick bigger than either side of your blue line - they're cheep, carefully chop out that section and fit the lintle. Re-point all the bits above, then break out your SDS. The worst that will happen is you loose the original arch. You'll have to make a decision where your lintle will go, hight wise.

Once it's open you can get your chimney tested for leaks/ damage/brickfalls.

Are you looking to put an open fire or burner in there? If it's a burner check out what the HETAS regs are in terms of hearth size clearence space of the burner etc... This might inform your chouce of where you put a lintle if you have to.

It's going to be a multi-fuel burner and putting a lintel below the existing arch might not leave quite enough room, will have to check with the guy installing it. Putting one above the arch is going to be more of an endeavour with acros and shit.

 

[TopCat]

missed this thread first time
status update on the chimney please TC

The hole remains. I have to reorganise the room. Then look at the framing. The aim is to have it lit before Christmas.

 

[WouldBe]

Thanks for the replies so far. Have exposed higher.

View attachment 350500


View attachment 350501


How's it looking? There are no loose bricks. The lime mortar seems mostly sound, but some bits will give if I really dig at it with a screwdriver. There were what appeared to be shims in the mortar directly below the brick arch, pulled one out and it turned out to be a piece of slate. I think the bricks above the arch are supposed to take some stress from the arch and again they aren't loose/mortar doesn't seem too bad. I was only going to expose as high as the arch (or lintel if there was one) but I'm thinking of exposing the whole chimney breast now.


I think you're right and the bar is original. The brick might look a different colour because I hit it with the breaker. I dug out some more mortar and it does in fact extend all the way across and into both left and right jambs. It's about 12mm thick and seems solid. That's the higher dotted line on my earlier picture. The lower line is a thinner piece of metal that is only on top/slightly beyond the yellow bricks and could be some kind of plate to block the flue(?). Random bits of masonry and tile are jammed between the two metal parts.

View attachment 350505



It's going to be a multi-fuel burner and putting a lintel below the existing arch might not leave quite enough room, will have to check with the guy installing it. Putting one above the arch is going to be more of an endeavour with acros and shit.

Looks like the lengthways bricks below the arch were added later. The arch should be strong enough to support itself without any metal to support it.

When I opened up the chimney in the back room I fastened a length of timber to each brick on the row above where I wanted the lintle to go. No need for acros.

 

[nogojones]

Quick hijack, sorry.

View attachment 350473

Thanks for the replies so far. Have exposed higher.

View attachment 350500


View attachment 350501


How's it looking? There are no loose bricks. The lime mortar seems mostly sound, but some bits will give if I really dig at it with a screwdriver. There were what appeared to be shims in the mortar directly below the brick arch, pulled one out and it turned out to be a piece of slate. I think the bricks above the arch are supposed to take some stress from the arch and again they aren't loose/mortar doesn't seem too bad. I was only going to expose as high as the arch (or lintel if there was one) but I'm thinking of exposing the whole chimney breast now.


I think you're right and the bar is original. The brick might look a different colour because I hit it with the breaker. I dug out some more mortar and it does in fact extend all the way across and into both left and right jambs. It's about 12mm thick and seems solid. That's the higher dotted line on my earlier picture. The lower line is a thinner piece of metal that is only on top/slightly beyond the yellow bricks and could be some kind of plate to block the flue(?). Random bits of masonry and tile are jammed between the two metal parts.

View attachment 350505



It's going to be a multi-fuel burner and putting a lintel below the existing arch might not leave quite enough room, will have to check with the guy installing it. Putting one above the arch is going to be more of an endeavour with acros and shit.

Nah. You don't need an acro. Choose your hight, kango that row out, fit the lintel, point everything up. The chimney won't collapse because you take a row of bricks out for an hour. If one or two in the row above loosen, just cement them in when you're doing the lintel.

But yeah, check the HETAS spec's from your fella installing in. You'll need it to be "so far" out, have so much headroom and sidespace as well. There's also things like a hearth of a certian thickness. Concrete and tile or slate will work. I found an old broken snooker table and cut the thick slate from it into three sections, which worked great for my space. If you do use slate make sure it's not one big bit as heat will expand and crack it.

 

[teuchter]

keybored I reckon follow nogojones advice about lintels etc.

This prompted me to dig out some photos of a chimneybreast in my place, firstly as uncovered after removing the plaster then various stages of repair. All the bricks I replaced just came out by hand and the mortar was in an awful state in places. Hence my advice of caution. But looks like yours are in a better condition.





I am not a brickie; please don't judge my work too harshly.

 

[tommers]

I dug out our old fireplace in our old house. Somebody had filled the bottom in with concrete and then bricked up the space to make it smaller. That's whats happened there.

 

[TopCat]

I lit the fire tonight. Alarming amount of smoke spilling into the room. More thought needed.

 

[MickiQ]

I lit the fire tonight. Alarming amount of smoke spilling into the room. More thought needed. View attachment 352127

Have the fucking chimney swept before you suffocate yourself.

 

[TopCat]

Have the fucking chimney swept before you suffocate yourself.

I think I may have got the chimney cap wrong. I will get up the roof in the morn. Smells nice though although I have all windows open etc.

 

[cupid_stunt]

I lit the fire tonight. Alarming amount of smoke spilling into the room. More thought needed.

You mad bastard!

FFS, get a professional in to check it out.

 

[og ogilby]

I'm thinking of upgrading my working fireplace to a woodburning stove. Probably cost me something like 2k to get a good one installed, but will it be worth it? I'm pretty sure I can get the wood for nothing, so no issue there.


It's only a smallish front room but the existing fire is going to struggle to heat it on its own without the radiator on, would a stove make a big difference?

 

[teuchter]

Home wood burning pollution expected to rise due to UK cost of living crisis

Seventy years after 1952 London smog, energy crisis could increase winter stove and open fire use

www.theguardian.com

 

[Supine]

You mad bastard!

FFS, get a professional in to check it out.

You don’t need an expert to know the coal is supposed to burn on a grill so air can rise through it. It also needs to be higher to get a funnelling effect from entering the chimney - which draws the smoke away from the room.

 

[Pickman's model]

I think I may have got the chimney cap wrong. I will get up the roof in the morn. Smells nice though although I have all windows open etc.

yeh for once supine has it right, the fire shouldn't be on the floor.

 

[Sweet FA]

I lit the fire tonight. Alarming amount of smoke spilling into the room. More thought needed. View attachment 352127

Could you get cheap camping fire thingy to put in there? 12 quid.

 

[TopCat]

I ordered a grate. Also found that the fireplace opening is too big hence the smoke. I am going to adjust with a foil barrier and check. If that does it then a new lintel of some kind and bring the height down and maybe the width.

It’s a sod not working from home anymore. Finding time for stuff like this!

 

[tep]

I'm thinking of upgrading my working fireplace to a woodburning stove. Probably cost me something like 2k to get a good one installed, but will it be worth it? I'm pretty sure I can get the wood for nothing, so no issue there.


It's only a smallish front room but the existing fire is going to struggle to heat it on its own without the radiator on, would a stove make a big difference?

View attachment 352667

probably - but you can get a lot of wood for £2000 plus the fittings and chimmney liner and signing off (if you go down that route) . plus the newer woodburners get through a lot of wood very quickly (to meet defra requirements they burn hot and fast).

 

[nogojones]

I lit the fire tonight. Alarming amount of smoke spilling into the room. More thought needed. View attachment 352127

That's a huge fucking hole for a small fire. No wonder it's not been drawn up the chimney.

Like said, you'll need to raise it considerably off the ground and I'd also consider a lintel a couple of rows down from your top bricks and refill with another course of bricks. You could also add a column of bricks either side to narrow the opening. You wouldn't even need to cement them in as it's just reducing the size of your hole to draw the air - and smoke up.

But please also get your chimney swept and a smoke test done as well as a fire guard, especially if you're burning wood.

 

[nogojones]

I ordered a grate. Also found that the fireplace opening is too big hence the smoke. I am going to adjust with a foil barrier and check. If that does it then a new lintel of some kind and bring the height down and maybe the width.

It’s a sod not working from home anymore. Finding time for stuff like this!

You got there before I did

 

[TopCat]

Cheers nogojones

 

[cupid_stunt]

You don’t need an expert to know the coal is supposed to burn on a grill so air can rise through it. It also needs to be higher to get a funnelling effect from entering the chimney - which draws the smoke away from the room.

Yes, but you do need an expert to sweep a chimney and check it's still safe to use, when it hasn't been used for donkeys years.

During a professional chimney inspection, you will have experienced eyes on your system to check for creosote buildup, flue blockages, leaks, cracks, damage, and other issues that could cause costly problems or increase your risk of fire or carbon monoxide poisoning.

 

[Supine]

Yes, but you do need an expert to sweep a chimney and check it's still safe to use, when it hasn't been used for donkeys years.

Can’t be that hard

 

[Pickman's model]

Cheers nogojones

Good auld nog

 

[ddraig]

I'm thinking of upgrading my working fireplace to a woodburning stove. Probably cost me something like 2k to get a good one installed, but will it be worth it? I'm pretty sure I can get the wood for nothing, so no issue there.


It's only a smallish front room but the existing fire is going to struggle to heat it on its own without the radiator on, would a stove make a big difference?

quoted around £2.5k for widening, slab, liner and stove install last week

 

[teuchter]

Had to ask my downstairs neighbours to refrain from burning stuff in their 'rediscovered' fireplace a few years back, when my flat started filling up with smoke thanks to various holes in the flues (including some deliberately made for ventilation when the fireplaces were taken out of use).

Same can happen unseen in attic spaces. Smoke is one thing but red hot cinders are another....