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#occupy London....

treelover said:
Do these conspiracy theorists have an active hatred for jews or is it more abstract, they don't seem like C18 types or even the more 'gentile' League Of St George

There does seem to be lot of the latter (abstractions) on the OLSX facebook page, tentacles and all that...
Click to expand...

it's alex jones/david icke type cultists. usually not part of the orgaised far right (or organised anything beyond tieing their own shoelaces tbh...) some of them probably are, tho they are involved in nothing and cotnrol nothing beyond loon/fundie sites on the internet ...
 
that was at Rutita

so, Froggie are they fully anti-semetic or just looking to explain the world so it make sense, to them anyway...
 
treelover said:
that was at Rutita

so, Froggie are they fully anti-semetic or just looking to explain the world so it make sense, to them anyway...
Click to expand...

some are just idiots who've smoked too much weed and watched the x-files a few too many times, others are full on anti-semitic twats to be honest (there's some fucking vile shit on the david icke site), some are both ... to be honest i wouldn't trust someone who claimed to be hanging around that scene for a while and not know it was dodgy.
 
to be honest that entire thing is shot through with anti-semitism. if you believe that shite that all the talk of rothschilds, the gold standard, the federal reserve, 9/11, and that, that it's nothing to do with hatred for the Jews and that t's all about opening your mind man, that that's true, you're either an idiot not worth listening to or you're lying
 
Rutita1 said:
That is surely the point of the sign photographed above...to let people know what it means...it isn't that hard to understand, or why. :hmm:
Click to expand...
hmm.. according to a few folk that engaged in the GA's they found it a bit weird.... perhaps it may be something to bear in mind, so as prior to discussions that this was explained properly? Some folk i know that were there and still there, may have 'literacy issues'....
keep it simple imo... as i was getting complaints from those who found these communication processes confusing....
 
AKA pseudonym said:
hmm.. according to a few folk that engaged in the GA's they found it a bit weird.... perhaps it may be something to bear in mind, so as prior to discussions that this was explained properly? Some folk i know that were there and still there, may have 'literacy issues'....
keep it simple imo... as i was getting complaints from those who found these communication processes confusing....
Click to expand...

What does 'simple' mean? Surely not having people shout out and interupt in a large assembly is more effective? I don't think it's something to worry about TBH...sure if you are unfamiliar with it you might be thinking 'Hey, wtf?' But it isn't hard, and I don't think it should be feared, as it stands at the moment.

Anyway, apparently:

#OccupyLSX initial statement

Posted on October 16, 2011 by occupylsx

At today’s assembly on the steps of St Paul’s, #occupylsx agreed the initial statement below. Please note, it’s a draft statement at this stage and it will always be a work in progress.

1 The current system is unsustainable. It is undemocratic and unjust. We need alternatives; this is where we work towards them.
2 We are of all ethnicities, backgrounds, genders, generations, sexualities dis/abilities and faiths. We stand together with occupations all over the world.

3 We refuse to pay for the banks’ crisis.

4 We do not accept the cuts as either necessary or inevitable. We demand an end to global tax injustice and our democracy representing corporations instead of the people.

5 We want regulators to be genuinely independent of the industries they regulate.

6 We support the strike on the 30th November and the student action on the 9th November, and actions to defend our health services, welfare, education and employment and to stop wars and arms dealing.

7 We want structural change towards authentic global equality. The world’s resources must go towards caring for people and the planet, not the military, corporate profits or the rich.

8 We stand in solidarity with the global oppressed and we call for an end to the actions of our government and others in causing this oppression.

9 This is what democracy looks like. Come and join us!
Click to expand...
http://occupylsx.org/?p=221
 
have seen GA statement (believe it may have been posted here already)

imo... we need to recognise that people may not be used to these 'passing the stick' processes....
we alienate people by such 'discussion processes'... hence the global #occupy protests break up into smaller groups so as to explain the decision making process....
Remember the first protest you were involved with???...
. its all about learning from each other.. not disenfranchasing people who are new to the scene???
anyhows minor detail... Im just bored defending cliche activists....
:)
 
And an approval. I forget not everyone's on fbook. Sorry

It's lots of discussion videos etc (just like here really :D) Has 1,290 member so far
 
There is that!

I'm getting all my info off here. My mate who joined the Socialist Worker today just joined it, so I'd thought I'd take a shufty. Nothing new.
 
I think there is a lot of naievety within much of the 'occupy movement' - in the UK and US anyway.
Its very much at stage of - 'if we behave ourselves, and be reasonable then the force of the better argument will win out'.

But what many people invovled dont seem to realise is that in directly challenging the wealth and power the top '1%' they are making a very radical demand. If the movement grows to the point of having many thousands on the steets the resonse from the state will become far more aggressive. The 1% are not going to roll over - they will have to forced.

This may well become increasingly apparent to those now trying to have a fluffy love revolutuion by asking nicely.

For this reason I support the occupy movement. It has the potential to become a radical and radicalising force for change, to link up with workers movements and other progressive forces. People up and down the country - and throughout the previously affluent world - are just starting to see the brutal injustice of the economic social system. People who have worked all their lives are now finding out whats it like to be treated like shit by the benefits system, are seeing their kids unable to go to college, are starting to really struggle to provide a home for their families - this is not what people ever expected and they are getting very fucking angry. But that in itself is not going to get them stocking up on marxists tomes or setting up workers co-ops.

The 'occupy movement' offers a clear and simple outlet for that anger - and if the numbers swell the voices of the truther twats will hopefully be drowned out. The political radicalisation will happen out of peoples expericences.

No revolution started life with massed ranks of revolutionaries. They all start with ordinary, non political people making quite reasonalbe demands for reform - jobs, cheaper bread, an end to corruption or ruinous unjust laws and taxes. If the ruling class refuse to answer these demands - or answer them with violence - it can set off a spiral of radicalisation. And those who set out one day to demand that the king govern justly and remove his corrupt advisors can end up doing the governing themselves and removing the kings head from his shoulders.

(However I do really hope they leave out the jazz hands in meetings bollocks - it alienates people just as much as some trot barking down a megaphone).
 
treelover said:
Do these conspiracy theorists have an active hatred for jews or is it more abstract, they don't seem like C18 types or even the more 'gentile' League Of St George

There does seem to be lot of the latter (abstractions) on the OLSX facebook page, 'tentacles' and all that...
Click to expand...
could you answer the questions i posed here:
Pickman's model said:
it's back to the middle ages with the church providing sanctuary against the forces of law and order

how the fuck has yer man made st paul's 'relevant again'? eh? if the bloody movement needs some god-botherer, some sky pilot, to supply a safe space for the movement to grow, is it a movement which deserves to survive?
Click to expand...
 
Explicitly calling themselves anti-capitalist isn't going to do them any favours. It already segregates them from a lot of wider anger at what is happening because the vast majority of those affected and angry would not, yet, identify themselves as anti-capitalist.
 
Kaka Tim said:
..... But what many people invovled dont seem to realise is that in directly challenging the wealth and power the top '1%' they are making a very radical demand. If the movement grows to the point of having many thousands on the steets the resonse from the state will become far more aggressive. The 1% are not going to roll over - they will have to forced......
Click to expand...

This conversation, in essence I had with a mate quite some time ago and unfortunately I agree.
 
Rutita1 said:
What does 'simple' mean? Surely not having people shout out and interupt in a large assembly is more effective? I don't think it's something to worry about TBH...sure if you are unfamiliar with it you might be thinking 'Hey, wtf?' But it isn't hard, and I don't think it should be feared, as it stands at the moment.

Anyway, apparently:


http://occupylsx.org/?p=221
Click to expand...
Not a bad start actually
 
frogwoman said:
i hope a trot shoves a paper up that guy's arse, the anti-semitic twat.
Click to expand...
Conspiraloons are present at the Dublin one, according to a WSM chap.
On Saturday, I spoke to individuals who believe in everything from Rawlsian social democracy, to anarchism, to paranoid crypto-anti-Semitic conspiracy theories (the New World Order, etc.), to Stalinism.
Click to expand...
Meanwhile, "no party political or union literature or flags" allowed at the demo next saturday.

On the plus side, the 'inner peace workshop' seems to have vanished from today's schedule.
 
Kaka Tim said:
For this reason I support the occupy movement. It has the potential to become a radical and radicalising force for change, to link up with workers movements and other progressive forces.
Click to expand...
Sure it has the potential to link up with other movements but I can't say I'm hopeful. As butchers has said its just so politically empty that I find it hard to believe that it is going to be anything other than an excuse for some wankers to wear their Guy Fawkes masks.

I mean has any contact be made with any anti-cuts groups? What about linking this to last weeks library closures for example?
 
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