Nanothermite and the World Trade Center

[butchersapron]

Do yourself a favour jazzz, have a read of the replies to that jref piece.

 

[Jazzz]

That's a partial publication list showing he's a chemistry researcher, I'm not entirely sure if it proves anything other than, um, he researches chemistry stuff.

It does not address my point that we ask you for scientific evidence of your assertions on your vaccine propaganda threads - the ones where you claim vaccines cause autism and the like - and you refuse to post any links, yet here you are DEMANDING the same from us.

ETA: That's not an official site for Niels Harrit anyway. It's basically a conspiraloon fanboi site 'in his honour'.

If you were consistent, you wouldn't need me to demand the same standards that you yourself ask of others.

So there should be a site in Niels Harrit's honour.

 

[beesonthewhatnow]

from Why the Harrit Nano-thermite paper has not yet been debunked - JREF forums

You haven't read that thread, have you?

 

[equationgirl]

If you were consistent, you wouldn't need me to demand the same standards that you yourself ask of others.

So there should be a site in Niels Harrit's honour.

I am consistent in my postings. Ask anyone.

Can they say the same about you? Doubt it.

Post examples where I've been inconsistent.

 

[free spirit]

I am consistent in my postings. Ask anyone.

Can they say the same about you? Doubt it.

nah, tbf to Jazz I reckon he's one of the most consistent posters on Urban.

look back as far as you like and you'll still see him banging on about the same bollocks.

 

[Jazzz]

I am consistent in my postings. Ask anyone.

Can they say the same about you? Doubt it.

Post examples where I've been inconsistent.

You just posted to the effect that you ask for scientific references but object to being asked them (complaining that I was being inconsistent).

 

[existentialist]

Well I think it proves he is a scientist with many published papers. I would go as so far to suggest he clearly knows his stuff.

from Why the Harrit Nano-thermite paper has not yet been debunked - JREF forums

Most of those papers seemed to be about the effects of light on various organic molecules. My old man was something of an expert on eigenvectors and X-ray crystallography, but would be the first to admit that he's scratching his head when it comes to molecular biology.

What you are demonstrating is cargo-cult science, Jazzz - the idea that if you can make it look enough like real science (eg posting a great slew of impressive looking but totally irrelevant references), then by wearing the equivalent of coconut shell headphones and waving a few bamboo twigs, while speaking into the business end of a banana, you can make the Magic Aeroplanes come again.

 

[equationgirl]

You haven't read that thread, have you?

Oh come on you know he doesn't.

 

[equationgirl]

You just posted to the effect that you ask for scientific references but object to being asked them (complaining that I was being inconsistent).

No, I object to the fact that you bitch and moan when others ask YOU for references, yet have the temerity to ask for them here.

 

[free spirit]

Chemical reaction for thermite reaction

2 Al + Fe2O3 → Al2O3 + 2 Fe

chemical reaction for rust
Iron + water + oxygen

rust
4 Fe(s) + 6 H2O(l) + 3 O2(g)

4 Fe(OH)3(s)
Iron(III) hydroxide, Fe(OH)3 then dehydrates to produce Fe2O3.nH2O(s) or rust

So a thermite reaction requires rusty Iron, Aluminium and heat.

What the fuck makes anyone surprised to find thermite reactions having happened when all the required constituent parts of the reaction would have been present in huge volumes for a long period of time?

The high levels of iron and aluminum in the dust -- each ranging from 1.3 to 4.1 percent of the dust samples by weight

The presence of this Iron and Aluminium in this high proportion of the dust basically proves beyond any reasonable doubt that it has to have come from some other source then fucking thermite controlled demolition, as the WTC consisted of over 1 million tonnes of mostly concrete, steel and glass, so for it to be present at the 1% level there should have needed to have been around 10,000 tonnes of thermite in the buildings.

Personally I think someone might just have noticed 200 artic truckloads of thermite being dumped into the WTC prior to 911.

For example, the USGS data shows high levels of barium -- a fact that is difficult to explain, barring pyrotechnics.

Barium Sulphate is a fucking fireproofing spray used on the steel work of skyscrapers, so finding it in the dust when 3 skyscrapers collapse isn't exactly that hard to explain.


And that's as far as I'm going into that report, as it's as far as anyone should need to go before dismissing the entire thing as a load of bollocks.

[/thread]

 

[equationgirl]

free spirit : your post is pretty much the essence of the Debunking website. It's worth a look (it's counter-conspiraloon).

 

[mojo pixy]

I read the article, i even took in a few of the references linked at the end. I'm not convinced.

 

[free spirit]

free spirit : your post is pretty much the essence of the Debunking website. It's worth a look (it's counter-conspiraloon).

Sound like I don't need to tbh.

been there, done that anyway.

 

[equationgirl]

I read the article, i even took in a few of the references linked at the end. I'm not convinced.

Not convinced about what?

 

[mojo pixy]

Not convinced about what?

I'm not convinced that it proves anything.

 

[free spirit]

I'm not convinced that it proves anything.

which article?

The one in the first post?

 

[equationgirl]

I'm not convinced that it proves anything.

Not convinced what proves anything? Which article are you talking about?

 

[mojo pixy]

Yes, I meant the article from the OP.

 

[equationgirl]

Yes, I meant the article from the OP.

Ah, gotcha. I was confused there for a sec. Cheers

 

[Firky]

I'd love to see the world from Jazzz's eyes for a few minutes. Be like an acid trip. Or a paranoid hell.

 

[JimW]

More importantly, has this one paid his TV licence?

 

[DotCommunist]

its purim on sunday as well, so that just proves everything

 

[equationgirl]

Oh yes, this nanothermite paper Jazzz is so fond of? Guess what:

In the article "Active Thermitic Material Discovered in Dust from the 9/11 World Trade Center Catastrophe", which appeared in the Open Chemical Physics Journal, authors Niels Harrit of the University of Copenhagen's Department of Chemistry, Jeffrey Farrer of Brigham Young University's Department of Physics and Astronomy, Steven E. Jones, and others state that thermite and nanothermite composites in the dust and debris were found following the collapse of the three buildings, which they conclude to be proof that explosives brought down the buildings. The article contained no scientific rebuttal and the editor in chief of the publication subsequently resigned.[84][85][86][87]

From http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/9/11_conspiracy_theories

85^ a b cJim Dwyer (September 2, 2006). "2 U.S. Reports Seek to Counter Conspiracy Theories About 9/11". The New York Times. Archived from the original on 30 May 2009. Retrieved April 30, 2009.
86^Dean, Suzanne (April 10, 2006). "Physicist says heat substance felled WTC". Deseret Morning News.Archived from the original on 10 May 2009. Retrieved May 7, 2009.
87^Barber, Peter (June 7, 2008). "The truth is out there".Financial Times. Archived from the original on 3 June 2009. Retrieved May 23, 2009.

Ref 85 is the nanothermite paper.

 

[likesfish]

FFS to demolish a building with explosive even super nano explosives you would have to plant them all over the place thats how Demoltion works.
Plus you have to tamp them or the blast takes the easist route out.
A big enough bomb gets over that problem with brute force but isnt as precise.

 

[Jazzz]

Oh yes, this nanothermite paper Jazzz is so fond of? Guess what:

From http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/9/11_conspiracy_theories

85^ a b cJim Dwyer (September 2, 2006). "2 U.S. Reports Seek to Counter Conspiracy Theories About 9/11". The New York Times. Archived from the original on 30 May 2009. Retrieved April 30, 2009.
86^Dean, Suzanne (April 10, 2006). "Physicist says heat substance felled WTC". Deseret Morning News.Archived from the original on 10 May 2009. Retrieved May 7, 2009.
87^Barber, Peter (June 7, 2008). "The truth is out there".Financial Times. Archived from the original on 3 June 2009. Retrieved May 23, 2009.

Ref 85 is the nanothermite paper.

Indeed, despite no criticisms being made of the science in the paper:

Professor Pileni's Resignation as Editor-in-Chief of the Open Chemical Physics Journal
By Niels Harrit
After the paper entitled "Active Thermitic Material Discovered in Dust from the 9/11 World Trade Center Catastrophe," which I along with eight colleagues co-authored, was published in the Open Chemical Physics Journal, its editor-in-chief, Professor Marie-Paule Pileni, abruptly resigned. It has been suggested that this resignation casts doubt on the scientific soundness of our paper.
However, Professor Pileni did the only thing she could do, if she wanted to save her career. After resigning, she did not criticize our paper. Rather, she said that she could not read and evaluate it, because, she claimed, it lies outside the areas of her expertise.
But that is not true, as shown by information contained on her own website (http://www.sri.jussieu.fr/pileni.htm). Her List of Publications reveals that Professor Pileni has published hundreds of articles in the field of nanoscience and nanotechnology. She is, in fact, recognized as one of the leaders in the field. Her statement about her ”major advanced research” points out that, already by 2003, she was ”the 25th highest cited scientist on nanotechnology” (http://www.sri.jussieu.fr/pileni.htm).
Since the late 1980s, moreover, she has served as a consultant for the French Army and other military institutions. From 1990 to 1994, for example, she served as a consultant for the Société Nationale des Poudres et Explosifs (National Society for Powders and Explosives). She could, therefore, have easily read our paper, and she surely did. But by denying that she had read it, she avoided the question that would have inevitably been put to her: ”What do you think of it?”
Faced with that question, she would have had two options. She could have criticized it, but that would have been difficult without inventing some artificial criticism, which she as a good scientist with an excellent reputation surely would not have wanted to do. The only other option would have been to acknowledge the soundness of our work and its conclusions. But this would have threatened her career.
Professor Pileni’s resignation from the journal provides an insight into the conditions for free speech at our universities and other academic institutions in the aftermath of 9/11. This situation is a mirror of western society as a whole---even though our academic institutions should be havens in which research is evaluated by its intrinsic excellence, not its political correctness.
In Professor Pileni’s country, France, the drive to curb the civil rights of professors at the universities is especially strong, and the fight is fierce.
I will conclude with two points. First, the cause of 9/11 truth is not one that she has taken up, and the course of action she chose was what she had to do to save her career. I harbor no ill feelings toward Professor Pileni for the choice she made.
Second, her resignation from the journal because of the publication of our paper implied nothing negative about the paper.
Indeed, the very fact that she offered no criticisms of it provided, implicitly, a positive evaluation---an acknowledgment that its methodology and conclusions could not credibly be challenged.

http://scientistsfor911truth.org/docs/Harrit_PileniResignation.pdf

 

[existentialist]

Indeed, despite no criticisms being made of the science in the paper:

http://scientistsfor911truth.org/docs/Harrit_PileniResignation.pdf

Harrit's paper - in case anyone couldn't find it
Active Thermitic Material Discovered in Dust from the 9/11 World Trade Center Catastrophe
Niels H. Harrit, Jeffrey Farrer, Steven E. Jones Kevin R. Ryan, Frank M. Legge, Daniel Farnsworth, Gregg Roberts, James R. Gourley and Bradley R. Larsen

Sayin' it doesn't make it so, Jazzz.

Cargo cult. Coconut shells, twigs and bananas.

 

[editor]

Harrit's paper - in case anyone couldn't find it
Active Thermitic Material Discovered in Dust from the 9/11 World Trade Center Catastrophe
Niels H. Harrit, Jeffrey Farrer, Steven E. Jones Kevin R. Ryan, Frank M. Legge, Daniel Farnsworth, Gregg Roberts, James R. Gourley and Bradley R. Larsen

So we're back to Bentham Science again. Do you think they're a credible publisher, Jazzz?

 

[Jazzz]

Harrit's paper - in case anyone couldn't find it
Active Thermitic Material Discovered in Dust from the 9/11 World Trade Center Catastrophe
Niels H. Harrit, Jeffrey Farrer, Steven E. Jones Kevin R. Ryan, Frank M. Legge, Daniel Farnsworth, Gregg Roberts, James R. Gourley and Bradley R. Larsen


Rebuttal of the assertion made by armchair warriors that the red chips found were from the primer paint:

WHY THE RED/GRAY CHIPS ARE NOT PRIMER PAINT

 

[existentialist]

So we're back to Bentham Science again. Do you think they're a credible publisher, Jazzz?

They look like a credible publisher, editor!

Coconut shells look like headphones, twigs look like those wavy lamp things they direct planes with, and bananas look like microphones.

And Bentham looks like a publisher.

Easy!

 

[Jazzz]

So we're back to Bentham Science again. Do you think they're a credible publisher, Jazzz?

As noted in earlier post, Bentham publish some 200 papers, and they claim that they are peer-reviewed. Whilst there may have been a problem with one paper, I don't believe anyone has succeeded in submitting nonsense articles to the Open Chemical Physics Journal.

But in any case, the point is moot - the paper is open for the peer-review process of the entire world. If any scientist has a criticism to make of it, we're all ears. So far there's been nothing forthcoming.