Macrons time is up

[Smokeandsteam]

I didn't say it wasn't.

I didn't say you did.

It's just odd to me that in the middle of a thread about a trade union general strike, millions of the organised working class on the streets and cities across France on fire that Urban wants to debate a book about the effete middle class and middle class people and their pensions.

 

[Smokeandsteam]

So the GJs were often rural , poor / retired / unemployed and reliant on diesel to function... (it was the vandalising of speed cameras that turned me off them at the time)

My advice on this is to think about the Gilets Jaunes as similar to the deindustrialised places of the UK. A movement from the forgotten towns and places. The research I linked to above demonstrates its class composition (working class) and its politics (left, against all mainstream politics).

The initial focus on diesel was indicative of the moral economy nature of the movement.

 

[Sue]

So the GJs were often rural , poor / retired / unemployed and reliant on diesel to function... (it was the vandalising of speed cameras that turned me off them at the time)

But what about those in the HLMs ?

So, instead of talking about those in HLMs, you'd talk about people in les banlieues. (While 'banlieue' means suburb, if people talk about les banlieues, they're generally referring to large housing estates outside major cities).

How do they fit into this political landscape ?
Do those on the streets feel solidarity with them ?

Well there's always a lot of lip service (especially from politicians) about les banlieues but not much ever seems to change. As to those demonstrating feeling solidarity with them, I've no idea. It does seem though that certainly some of the protests are more about Macron being shit rather than about pensions per se so...

 

[gentlegreen]

So, instead of talking about those in HLMs, you'd talk about people in les banlieues. (While 'banlieue' means suburb, if people talk about les banlieues, they're generally referring to large housing estates outside major cities).

Learning that those estates are actually called "cités" was a recent revelation to me...
The Le Corbusier dimension makes the housing blocks somewhat surreal ...

 

[Pickman's model]

Viva la French working class!

vive, i think you'll find: vive la classe ouvrière française

 

[gentlegreen]

vive, i think you'll find: vive la classe ouvrière française

/pédant

 

[Pickman's model]

/pédant

sur le pont d'avignon, rodney

 

[Sasaferrato]

You do realise who's getting elected after Macron though right...?

I don't think it is a given, not by any means, that Le Pen will be elected.

 

[Smokeandsteam]

vive, i think you'll find: vive la classe ouvrière française

Vive la French Working Class it is then!

 

[domestos]

Shame the same didn't happen here when our retirement age was raised. Could be the 1 year prison sentences for licking an ice cream and the like (when de Pfeffel was London Mayor) did the trick or is it because we are just more deferential here. This country is much more compliant than in the past
.

 

[Smokeandsteam]

Shame the same didn't happen here when our retirement age was raised. Could be the 1 year prison sentences for licking an ice cream and the like (when de Pfeffel was London Mayor) did the trick or is it because we are just more deferential here. This country is much more compliant than in the past which
.

In France there is a constitutional right to strike. Let’s remember the 10 days of general strike action and the millions of workers on the streets has been the propulsive force here. A stark contrast with the spineless reaction of Britain’s trade union leaders to years of austerity.

 

[domestos]

Thatcher and Ridley did for them. I was shop steward for a union that had 20% support for Communist Party candidates and was very active but within a few years was a poodle run by "moderates". Turned out it was being run by an MI6 stooge and I wonder if other unions were infiltrated. The English and especially the youth have been brainwashed to believe unions are the enemy It may be that we've finally turned the corner, the recent strikes have receive more support than they would have a few years ago..

Allons enfants de la Patrie!!

 

[Bingoman]

Just watched the news on the French protests and their is reports that Bordeaux town hall was torch

Bordeaux town hall set on fire in France pension protests

Fire engulfs the building's front as violence flares in several cities during pension reform protests.

www.bbc.co.uk

 

[pbsmooth]

A lot of the French people I know seem to think they've gone too far now. They're all against the change and all have lost any faith in Macron generally but these protests seem to have gone over the top. As someone said, there are bigger issues and people facing real hardship and discrimination still, and this doesn't feel like the issue to be setting fire to town halls. Especially à sentiment from black French people.

 

[wemakeyousoundb]

Meanwhile, even some filth have demobilised themselves

gendarmes so army but under home office control

 

[Bingoman]

gendarmes so army but under home office control

That could get bit messy if the police are siding with the protesters

 

[gentlegreen]

.

 

[Smokeandsteam]

A lot of the French people I know seem to think they've gone too far now. They're all against the change and all have lost any faith in Macron generally but these protests seem to have gone over the top. As someone said, there are bigger issues and people facing real hardship and discrimination still, and this doesn't feel like the issue to be setting fire to town halls. Especially à sentiment from black French people.

Presumably these black French people who think it’s all gone too far don’t include those black French people being forced to work until 64 and who are part of the protests?

 

[pbsmooth]

Well yes obviously.

 

[not-bono-ever]

Well impressed by the French getting on the streets here.

 

[Fairweather]

…………..

 

[gentlegreen]

 

[Bingoman]

Does that mean the police will not stand in their way then?

 

[gentlegreen]

Does that mean the police will not stand in their way then?

Did you actually watch the video
?

 

[Bingoman]

Did you actually watch the video
?

yes but not all of it

 

[Jeremiah18.17]

There were three sets of demos over the weekend- the continuing pensions/retirement ones, the ones against the racist “Darmanin” legislation that affects undocumented workers and ones against the mega-basin water storage projects that were subject to violent policing which met an angry and determined response. Many injuries and arrests - I have seen reports of police hitting people with explosive stun grenades at the water protest & two v seriously injured by this - some reports one of them is in a coma/brain dead? Govt is now trying to “dissolve” water protest activist group as all associations in France have to be registered. Calls for more mass protest on Saturday & Inter-union groups calling for another pensions/retirement day of action on April 6th and continuing blockades. UK ITV news showed images of violence in cities as though it were a unique thing in French demo history & interviewed someone who they claimed was a “member of the Black Bloc”…

 

[Jeremiah18.17]

Call, from protest group the government wants to dissolve, (supported here by one of anarchosyndicalist unions in France) for demos outside police prefectures on Thursday at 7 against police violence:

 

[Lurdan]

Front page of today's FT:

 

[frogwoman]

I don’t know anything about this woman, she might be a horrible person but this is disturbing and ridiculous. Also the fact that this law is even on the books

French woman faces trial, €12,000 fine for 'insulting' Macron on Facebook

A woman in northern France is to be put on trial on charges of insulting President Emmanuel Macron after describing him as 'filth' in a Facebook post, a prosecutor said on Wednesday. The woman risks…

www.france24.com

 

[gentlegreen]

The pension reform has been signed into law and Macron gave an allocution last night I couldn't bear to watch much of - and I fully understood why thousands took to the streets while it was on ...
The creepy Dussopt and the aggressive Borne have helped throw Macron into relief for me...
French Presidents have often seemed weird to me - Sarkozy selecting short people for photo opportunities, Hollande with his personal coiffeur ...

He's promised some sort of 100 day consultation about the state of employment in France in general - apparently rife with low pay and bad ergonomics with many struggling to satisfy the contributions necessary for the new full pension - a little lower than their minimum wage and a fair bit better than mine - some are making noises about a referendum ...

Looks like he will get no peace wherever he goes...
He's in St Denis for some unknown reason at the moment ...