Ok you’re lying and being a dick. You definitely have no clue about HSE law though.
London Anarchist bookfair 2020
- Thread starter Treacle Toes
- Start date
Ok you’re lying and being a dick. You definitely have no clue about HSE law though.
spitfire
Walty McWaltface
Hi vis is not mandatory on most small sites, I've been working in construction on small and big sites as a site manager, PM and on the tools for 20 years (till last August).
Will not wearing it possibly affect a claim? Maybe, maybe not.
No there probably isn't an induction, or decent welfare, or fire drills, or mandatory PPE of other sorts.
Now can you please go back to discussing the bookfair and I'll go back to lurking.
Hi vis is not mandatory on most small sites, I've been working in construction on small and big sites as a site manager, PM and on the tools for 20 years (till last August).
Will not wearing it possibly affect a claim? Maybe, maybe not.
No there probably isn't an induction, or decent welfare, or fire drills, or mandatory PPE of other sorts.
Now can you please go back to discussing the bookfair and I'll go back to lurking.
Just because you can say you’re not following rules doesn’t mean they don’t exist. No induction?
spitfire
Walty McWaltface
Toilets there. *points*
Kettle there. *points*
Sign here *points*
Induction done.
So a handyman puts up a shelf and has to wear hi viz?
Fair dos. It won’t help if you’re up for manslaughter but I agree, let’s get back to the book fair.
Read the regs.
Serge Forward
Just enjoyin' my coffee.
My money's on 30 pages on hi-viz. Could be the mother of all derails.
spitfire
Walty McWaltface
Dunno. There’s the bog, there’s the tea bags, there’s the safer space...
spitfire
Walty McWaltface
I asked about PPE in an anarchist utopia but deleted the post so Magnus' response makes sense.
They're actually quite vague and depend on employers risk assessments. The bigger the firm and the bigger the site the more rigourous those assessments are...
But yes Hi Viz is for the protection of soft bodies in the vicinity of big machines. Which doesn't apply to say, re roofing a bungalow.
Hi Vis Clothing Safety Regulations - Safety & Protection On The Work Site - Buying Guides
You'd be surprised how many gender neutral toilets you find on site. Even under capitalism.
Serge Forward
Just enjoyin' my coffee.
When I last worked on a building site (1986) no fucker had ppe apart from toe tectors. Management, mind, had the full gear. Twats.
Fuck it, you've drawn me in
Fuck it, you've drawn me in
It’s mostly a cunt when you have to wear a hard hat to work above a false ceiling in the middle of summer finishing snagging in a room that office types will work in a week later sans any protection at all. The mind boggles.
spitfire
Walty McWaltface
And then the "clients" walk in with an area manager sans any PPE whatsoever. Been there.
Someone, (not me), should start a thread about construction related whinges.
Oh shut up for fucks sake
Do we want a book fair or not? Since a group have stepped up and are willing to engage then maybe we should make an effort to do that. Even if tbh the posting style here and the twitter account of the organisers is kind of annoying.
And all they had to do is to do what none of us could be arsed to do and organise a book fair.
Rhyddical
May or may not look sexy in Hi Vis.
Yeah, our invite policy is pretty much Anarchist, Anarchist friendly and associated radicals and comrades. So we'll be hosting eco groups, animal rights groups and that kind of thing.
I guess somewhere along the line people might be inclined to have a more outlined policy or some such who knows, the nature of the collective we be down to whoever gets involved, if some of the LABC crew get involved we'll probably rely on much of their experiance.
This obviously doesn't extend to statists or those that like you say have to be "won over". RCG will be outside as usual ;p
Re; Why IWW etc arn't on the list.... we simply have not got round to sending out invites yet.
Those on the list are either involved in some way, close comrades who we've ran Bookfair 2020 by before hand or messaged us after reading the statement.
Even after we send invites there will probably be a delay so that they can review and discuss at their meetings and such but we've got plenty of time ^_^
Rhyddical
May or may not look sexy in Hi Vis.
Despite some people feeling we are not "Anarchist" because of our position on bigotry, we are an Anarchist Bookfair.
We didn't really want to call it Anarchist Bookfair / London Anarchist Bookfair quite yet incase the LABC forwhatever reason decided not to endorse or support us in taking them up on their offer from 2018. We would continue on simply as another Anarchist bookfair in london and felt it would be disingenuous to create further confusion with the name. Bookfair 2020 seemed like a reasonable leap.
Other bookfairs have used Radical / Autonomous and that's cool. Our decision not too is more to our own personal take and perhaps a degree of feeling that it implies we are an open space to other "radicals" such as the maoists or something or liberals like idk the Corbynistas. Tho honestly we didn't discuss it too much as at the end of the day Bookfair 2020 is perfectly servicable and it's just a name. If the LABC folk decided to give us support / join us, we can probably expect it to change back, if not, thats cool, no stresses or judgement on them.
Rhyddical
May or may not look sexy in Hi Vis.
We as individuals and by extention I suppose the collective, do not endorse cross class politics / IdPol. This doesn't mean we can willfully ignore or negate the inequalites in our society.
Fighting racism and sexism is essential to class struggle and tho this means sometimes organising based on these lines (such as anti fascist actions or kicking off with MRA fucks) at the end of the day what unites these struggles is the need to defeat capitalism and end the fucking poison of the state.
I reckon it's pretty bad form to negate the fucked up shit gay people go through by discounting any organsing along sexuality lines or banning homophobes from events as IdPol. (not saying anyone on thread is doing this but sadly fellow Anarchists sometimes do as I'm sure we're all aware)
If you see us inviting the Gay Police Association or some shit then yeah cuss us out as IdPol Liberals and take away our Anarchy badges.
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FabricLiveBaby!
Live Baby Fabric!
andysays
Love and solidarity
Can you confirm that the Bookfair will be totally HSE compliant? Rules, as we all know at heart, are actually there for everyone's benefit.
Maybe you could appoint an experienced person to be in charge of Health and Safety on the day, including issuing appropriate PPE. This person could also vet all stallholders and attendees by means of their clothing, speech and other lifestyle details to ensure that they are authentically working class.
Unfortunately I can't suggest anyone for the role, as they would need a pretty unique set of skills to do the job. Anyone else have any suggestions?
LDC
On est tous des pangolins
OK, I've got some other concerns outside the 'trans debate' that I'll try and address to you later as they'll be longer.
For the moment though reading the stuff you've put out so far I have a question for you. I'm an anarchist and have been for quite a few years. I don't think, however, that someone that was born male can 'become' female. I also think that in certain situations (very few tbh) a transwoman shouldn't expect or demand to be treated exactly the same as someone that is a woman.
Am I welcome at this Bookfair?
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Pickman's model
Starry Wisdom
2020, meet 2017
chilango
Hypothetical Wanker
Rhyddical
I know you've sort of addressed this, but I think it deserves further discussion.
What exactly are the grounds for invites vs. exclusion in the book fair?
There's a number of nin-anarchist groups on the list already.
Plan C, for example, who I quite like have put our pro-Labour Party stuff, and at a glance appear to be quite sympathetic to Kurdish nationalism.
Class War, who stand for election.
Animal rights groups? Why?
My own opinion is that I don't particularly mind. I don't especially identify as an Anarchist anymore, so it's cool with me....
...but then I'm not putting on an Anarchist Book fair. How are you you going to deal with groups who feel they have just as much a claim as say Plan C but who might be less welcome?
Be good to see some increased clarity.
Good luck, I look forward to coming along in 2020.
I know you've sort of addressed this, but I think it deserves further discussion.
What exactly are the grounds for invites vs. exclusion in the book fair?
There's a number of nin-anarchist groups on the list already.
Plan C, for example, who I quite like have put our pro-Labour Party stuff, and at a glance appear to be quite sympathetic to Kurdish nationalism.
Class War, who stand for election.
Animal rights groups? Why?
My own opinion is that I don't particularly mind. I don't especially identify as an Anarchist anymore, so it's cool with me....
...but then I'm not putting on an Anarchist Book fair. How are you you going to deal with groups who feel they have just as much a claim as say Plan C but who might be less welcome?
Be good to see some increased clarity.
Good luck, I look forward to coming along in 2020.
Pickman's model
Starry Wisdom
there's standing for election to take part in the political process should one win and standing for election as a stunt. and cw's very much the latter, from the time when cw stood in kensington in 1988 up to the present. being as cw have been prominent in organising against elections, as in the '92 anti-election alliance, it seems perverse to say they're not anarchists on the basis they occasionally put forward candidates for their own political as opposed to electoral goals.
chilango
Hypothetical Wanker
I've no problems with CW's electoral antics. But I wouldn't be surprised if some of the po-faced Anarchists did.
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