Smokeandsteam
Working Class First
Have any of the various SP splinter factions folded back into Socialist Apology? I've found it impossible to get keep track of the various fragmentations.
Keir Starmer's time is up
- Thread starter agricola
- Start date
Have any of the various SP splinter factions folded back into Socialist Apology? I've found it impossible to get keep track of the various fragmentations.
little_legs
Поехали!
Leighsw2
strictly off the record
It's his analysis. But does seem eminently plausible for anyone with knowledge of the Labour Right. After all, these are the people who wanted Labour to lose in 2017 and then set up an entire astro-turf campaign (the ludicrous 'Peoples' Vote') to make sure of it in 2019!
charlie mowbray
The Enforcer
Socialist Appeal did well out of the Corbynista influx into Labour, and as others have noted, started recruiting a lot of young members. An indication of this was, before the Corbyn phenomenon, I used to see one old and sad looking seller of their paper on demos. Later there were sizeable numbers on demos behind Socialist Appeal banners, latest one being Kill the BIll demo that started in Russell Square. But as they are now proscribed, it will be difficult for them, as a parasite on the Labour Party, to survive. Will they decide to merge with their old comrades of the Socialist Party? Not likely, considering the past animosity. More likely to wither and die.
Flavour
hang the bankers
Not sure about that. I think it would take a while. They still have a fairly large number of committed activists. But recruitment will surely dry up, so long-term decline inevitable.
charlie mowbray
The Enforcer
Yes, that was what I was saying.
elbows
Well-Known Member
Self-isolation number 4 for him.
The39thStep
Urban critical thinker
Not a fan of Paul Mason but if he ever goes into sports tipping this is a good pointer of why you should back the other team rather than the one he favours.
brogdale
Coming to terms with late onset Anarchism
How would we tell?
elbows
Well-Known Member
Sir Steer Calmer rejects the accusation that he may as well be farting in a void.
He will soon demonstrate his dynamism by showing the world that he is the next Lionel Blair, not Tony Blair. He will tap dance on the graves of socialists without even spilling his pint.
Puddy_Tat
naturally fluffy
but the party is apparently hiring 30-50 temporary staff for the purging unit
labourlist.org
Labour moves to cut staff as party reserves down to one month's payroll - LabourList
Labour general secretary David Evans told staff in a meeting this morning that the poor financial situation of…
labourlist.org
belboid
Exasperated, not angry.
My god, the job ad for investigators is quite something. It’s a fantastic opportunity and you must bebut the party is apparently hiring 30-50 temporary staff for the purging unit
Labour moves to cut staff as party reserves down to one month's payroll - LabourList
Labour general secretary David Evans told staff in a meeting this morning that the poor financial situation of…
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Puddy_Tat
naturally fluffy
is 'bullshit bingo' the party's latest fund-raiser?
hitmouse
so defeated, thinks it's funny
Having done a bit of looking around, I guess it's a reference to this - less "shooting down the plane was good", more "what if it was a FALSE FLAG, eh?":
Flight MH17 – Imperialism and the art of hypocrisy | Ukraine | Europe
The death of almost 300 innocent men, women and children on a Malaysian airline flight has shocked the world. Flight MH17 from Amsterdam to Kuala Lumpur was travelling over the conflict-hit region when it disappeared from radar. A total of 283 passengers, including some 80 children, and 15 crew...
www.marxist.com
I'd never looked into their position on Syria before now, but it turns out they have some spicy takes on the White Helmets and related matters as well:
Syria: the barbarism of war and imperialist hypocrisy | The Communist
Alan Woods takes an in-depth look at the situation in Syria, where the ceasefire has broken down. The dire situation reveals the cynicism of the imperialists - and the horror without end that they have created.
www.socialist.net
Anyway, I suppose this raises some big questions: Will they come up with a new theory explaining that the Labour Party was the only correct place for socialists to be from its founding up until July 2021, but it's now bankrupt and must be smashed so a new workers party can be built, or will they continue to insist, Groucho Marx-style, that everyone should still be in Labour? Or split between the two options?
Also, does this mean that AWLers can be in Labour but SAers can't, and if so does that mean the AWL can now bully them ("oh, just off on my way to the CLP meeting, it's going to be so much fun, are you coming... oh wait, I forgot, you can't, can you?") or does it mean that they can now bully the AWL ("goody-two-shoes Schachtmanites, can't even get expelled!")?
steveseagull
Well-Known Member
Dawn Butler showing Starmer how it is done
hitmouse
so defeated, thinks it's funny
Thank you for your service.
belboid
Exasperated, not angry.
well found, I had only gone through the paper which strangely has absolutely no mention of the incident at all!Having done a bit of looking around, I guess it's a reference to this - less "shooting down the plane was good", more "what if it was a FALSE FLAG, eh?":
Flight MH17 – Imperialism and the art of hypocrisy | Ukraine | Europe
The death of almost 300 innocent men, women and children on a Malaysian airline flight has shocked the world. Flight MH17 from Amsterdam to Kuala Lumpur was travelling over the conflict-hit region when it disappeared from radar. A total of 283 passengers, including some 80 children, and 15 crew...
I'd never looked into their position on Syria before now, but it turns out they have some spicy takes on the White Helmets and related matters as well:
Syria: the barbarism of war and imperialist hypocrisy | The Communist
Alan Woods takes an in-depth look at the situation in Syria, where the ceasefire has broken down. The dire situation reveals the cynicism of the imperialists - and the horror without end that they have created.
Anyway, I suppose this raises some big questions: Will they come up with a new theory explaining that the Labour Party was the only correct place for socialists to be from its founding up until July 2021, but it's now bankrupt and must be smashed so a new workers party can be built, or will they continue to insist, Groucho Marx-style, that everyone should still be in Labour? Or split between the two options?
Also, does this mean that AWLers can be in Labour but SAers can't, and if so does that mean the AWL can now bully them ("oh, just off on my way to the CLP meeting, it's going to be so much fun, are you coming... oh wait, I forgot, you can't, can you?") or does it mean that they can now bully the AWL ("goody-two-shoes Schachtmanites, can't even get expelled!")?
Their awfulness on Syria flows from Comrade Grants' long-standing admiration for Assad Sr who led a 'transformation of social relations' and thus created a deformed workers state.
The AWL has long been a proscribed organisation.
RedRedRose
Well-Known Member
Outsourcing and downsizing. How Blairite of them!but the party is apparently hiring 30-50 temporary staff for the purging unit
Labour moves to cut staff as party reserves down to one month's payroll - LabourList
Labour general secretary David Evans told staff in a meeting this morning that the poor financial situation of…
charlie mowbray
The Enforcer
As others have said, both SA and AWL members were expelled back in 2015-2016. (Of course, that doesn't mean that AWL members are not operating inside Labour). As to gloating over the SA being expelled, the AWL has issued a statement condemning the ban. See here: No to Starmer's bans! | Workers' LibertyHaving done a bit of looking around, I guess it's a reference to this - less "shooting down the plane was good", more "what if it was a FALSE FLAG, eh?":
Flight MH17 – Imperialism and the art of hypocrisy | Ukraine | Europe
The death of almost 300 innocent men, women and children on a Malaysian airline flight has shocked the world. Flight MH17 from Amsterdam to Kuala Lumpur was travelling over the conflict-hit region when it disappeared from radar. A total of 283 passengers, including some 80 children, and 15 crew...
I'd never looked into their position on Syria before now, but it turns out they have some spicy takes on the White Helmets and related matters as well:
Syria: the barbarism of war and imperialist hypocrisy | The Communist
Alan Woods takes an in-depth look at the situation in Syria, where the ceasefire has broken down. The dire situation reveals the cynicism of the imperialists - and the horror without end that they have created.
Anyway, I suppose this raises some big questions: Will they come up with a new theory explaining that the Labour Party was the only correct place for socialists to be from its founding up until July 2021, but it's now bankrupt and must be smashed so a new workers party can be built, or will they continue to insist, Groucho Marx-style, that everyone should still be in Labour? Or split between the two options?
Also, does this mean that AWLers can be in Labour but SAers can't, and if so does that mean the AWL can now bully them ("oh, just off on my way to the CLP meeting, it's going to be so much fun, are you coming... oh wait, I forgot, you can't, can you?") or does it mean that they can now bully the AWL ("goody-two-shoes Schachtmanites, can't even get expelled!")?
brogdale
Coming to terms with late onset Anarchism
Wot, literally nothing about Motherhood or apple-pie?
TopCat
Putin fanboy
Something about ketchup. Yeah “slogans about ketchup are not much good”.
Smokeandsteam
Working Class First
When I was active in the Militant one of the most arduous tasks (there were a lot of arduous tasks) was explaining to new recruits why we invested so much time and energy in attacking everything the Labour Party said and did, whilst simultaneously spending even more time and energy attacking their attempts to expel us
Why, they’d ask, did we bother fighting attempts to boot us out by a party that hated us and which we condemned on every issue of significance. We’d patiently explain the ‘dialectic process’ to them and the Labour Party’s ineffable role as the only possible mass party of the working class. These naïve youngsters would either eventually come to realise the dubious benefits of entryism or clock that we were mad from the off and hopefully went and did something more useful with their youthful lives.
Until Taaffe decided that the Labour Party was no longer the mass party of the working class and a new one would need to be built. By us. Then we’d patiently explain to new recruits that the Labour Party was not the mass party of the working class etc etc
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