Idris2002
canadian girlfriend
But it won't be him who'll be got, with a bit of luck.
Jeremy Corbyn's time is up
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not-bono-ever
meh
coincidence with the Somme centenary - Eagle is the poor patsy that is being bullied by the NCO'S to get up that fucking ladder and be the first one to run across no man's land and sort out them irksome corbyns
Don't worry. We have been softening the decimated corbyn forces up with press releases for days.it will be a doddle. You don't even need a weapon. Just get over the top and you will be a hero. Go on . We are right behind you. Up you go. Don't worry about the rats. Over the top for you anna. Chop chop.
Don't worry. We have been softening the decimated corbyn forces up with press releases for days.it will be a doddle. You don't even need a weapon. Just get over the top and you will be a hero. Go on . We are right behind you. Up you go. Don't worry about the rats. Over the top for you anna. Chop chop.
DotCommunist
So many particulars. So many questions.
another day another round of bollocks and bullshit. Paranoia is when people aren't plotting against you. Where as these lot are, they've not even hidden it. Whetted thier knives in fucking public. For months now. Since before he even got the crown.
DotCommunist
So many particulars. So many questions.
mandleson with a webley 'get over or I'll shoot you myself coward!'
Casually Red
tomorrow belongs to me
Sooner he figures out a way to get these degenerate wretches deselected / expelled from the party the better . Cut out one massive festering tumour .
ViolentPanda
Hardly getting over it.
I'm trying to work out how Eagle, who has all the presence and charisma of an eagle that's been hit by a truck, will be better for Labour.
Or how they're going to try and reclaim the north by talking 'sensibly' about immigration to the working classes, while simultaneously hanging onto their metropolitan centres.
Not to mention they're either going to have to purge the membership or face their wrath, and their membership pre-Corbyn was already crap enough that their election efforts were hopeless.
Basically, everything's going to burn
Damn straight!!!
ViolentPanda
Hardly getting over it.
Mandelson would have someone else do the revolver-brandishing for him. He's that much of a coward.
DaveCinzano
WATCH OUT, GEORGE, HE'S GOT A SCREWDRIVER!
It's what Jo would have wanted, isn't it?
Treacle Toes
Time
J Ed
Follow Back Pro Expropriation
Wouldn't be surprised if they had done it to themselves to claim that they were being victimised by left-wingers. No doubt we will be hearing in the graunid v soon about how this heralds a dangerous new future in British politics
Wilf
Slouching towards Billingham
They've already claimed death threats.
nino_savatte
No pasaran!
Paranoia would suggest the absence of a plot. This is the same sort of shite they hurled at Harold Wilson, who wasn't all that left-wing tbh. He was also the victim of a right-wing plot to topple him. Cecil King? Gen. Walter Walker?
redsquirrel
This Machine Kills Progressives
Latest tactic seems to be talking up the idea of a split, press swallowing it uncritically of course.
billy_bob
Air of bewilderment model's own
If this was an Alan Bleasdale drama it would turn out that at least half of the anti-Corbyn forces in the PLP were actually on his side all along. The counterproductive ineptitude of their campaign so far seems to bear this out.
Are these people really the guardians of the tradition that got Tony fucking Blair re-elected twice even after the Iraq war? I expect them all to be terrible human beings, but not to display this level of basic incompetence at political machinations.
Are these people really the guardians of the tradition that got Tony fucking Blair re-elected twice even after the Iraq war? I expect them all to be terrible human beings, but not to display this level of basic incompetence at political machinations.
DotCommunist
So many particulars. So many questions.
whither now cambell? whither now mandelson? only lesser men remain, weep, weep for the dying of the blairite project
Lurdan
old wave
You know how it is. You wait months for a newspaper article urging the Labour Party to split and then along come two at once.
Labour breakaway could be in national interest - Financial Times (Paywalled)
Janan Ganesh
Labour breakaway could be in national interest - Financial Times (Paywalled)
Janan Ganesh
Voters who want to remain in EU have no party of stature to get behind
Limehouse: so much to answer for. When sensible people in Britain’s Labour party wonder what to do about Jeremy Corbyn, their fantastically unelectable leader, the idea of formal separation makes them shiver with memories of riverside east London. There, 35 years ago, a political quartet including Roy Jenkins, a liberal home secretary of the 1960s, left an increasingly strident Labour to form the Social Democratic party.
In the folklore of the left, this project was an act of desertion that fragmented the anti-Thatcher vote. Today, even MPs of a Jenkins-ite bent curse the infidelity and any prospect of a repetition.
Do not tell them that the bend in the Thames at Limehouse was for centuries called Cuckold’s Point. Their absolute commitment to togetherness would make sense if they had an internal solution to the Corbyn problem. They need to remove him, install someone much better and purge the zealots who have changed the texture of Labour’s grass roots for the worse over the past year. The first of these goals is do-able; the second is not because the third is so hard.
No confidence
Eighty per cent of his MPs expressed no confidence in Corbyn last week but, with an eye on those loyal activists, he is toughing it out. If MPs depose him, he or his treasury spokesman, John McDonnell, may be able to stand again and win. That could be enough to finish the party.
Even if the pair are locked out, the new leader will have to be a difference-splitter who squares the parliamentary party with the bolshie members and the conflicted trade unions. And so we are asked to summon enthusiasm for Angela Eagle, a smart and conscientious MP, but one whose 24 years in parliament may have been spent in cryogenic suspension for all the impact she has had on national consciousness. She would offer voters the kind of soft-left politics that earned Labour a beating 14 months ago.
The plot against Corbyn is not just creeping along pathetically, then, it is creeping along pathetically towards a mediocre destination. If the only victim were Labour itself, there would no pity in this. But the party’s retirement from serious politics allows a riven Conservative government on a rightwing trajectory to go unopposed.
It also leaves the 48 per cent of voters who wanted to remain in the EU without a UK-wide party of any stature to get behind. By all means, Labour MPs must try to remove Corbyn and replace him with a plausible prime minister. But if the mission fails, political logic and the national interest both argue for a breakaway, which might unfold as follows.
The 170-plus MPs who repudiated their leader last week would resign the Labour whip and sit as a new party of the pro-European centre left under leadership of their choosing. As the largest non-government group in the House of Commons, they would constitute the new official opposition, with all the privileges that entails. If Corbyn’s residual Labour had fewer MPs than the Scottish National party’s 54, its struggle for visibility would be hopeless.
From its parliamentary base the new party would try to recruit members. Since the referendum, the most dispossessed voters have been the 16 million who wanted continuity. If the party persuaded one in 100 of them to pay a nominal subscription, it would outnumber the Tories. Moderate Labour activists and staff would defect. Business donors, if not unions, would have an incentive to sustain the project in its precarious infancy.
Credible policies
The Liberal Democrats would be invited to merge or associate. With only eight MPs, they would be myopic churls to refuse. The hard left would keep the Labour name and infrastructure, but these earthly things matter less than credible policies and people. The new party would have those. Instead of 200 simultaneous byelections, it would stand at the next general election and ask the new prime minister, who will be chosen by just 150,000 Tories in the coming weeks, to hold it as soon as possible. The trauma of the Limehouse Declaration – under which Jenkins and his colleagues David Owen, Shirley Williams and Bill Rodgers signalled their intention to leave the party – has paralysed Labour moderates. But if they are going to be cowed by history, they should get that history right. In the end, the SDP won, and won big.
The past four prime ministers – John Major, Tony Blair, Gordon Brown and David Cameron – have tried to blend a free economy, a substantial state, cultural looseness and EU membership. Jenkins sensed where the country was going, just too early. Last month’s eruption has broken his consensus but it still commands half of Britons. A new party must speak for them.
Limehouse: so much to answer for. When sensible people in Britain’s Labour party wonder what to do about Jeremy Corbyn, their fantastically unelectable leader, the idea of formal separation makes them shiver with memories of riverside east London. There, 35 years ago, a political quartet including Roy Jenkins, a liberal home secretary of the 1960s, left an increasingly strident Labour to form the Social Democratic party.
In the folklore of the left, this project was an act of desertion that fragmented the anti-Thatcher vote. Today, even MPs of a Jenkins-ite bent curse the infidelity and any prospect of a repetition.
Do not tell them that the bend in the Thames at Limehouse was for centuries called Cuckold’s Point. Their absolute commitment to togetherness would make sense if they had an internal solution to the Corbyn problem. They need to remove him, install someone much better and purge the zealots who have changed the texture of Labour’s grass roots for the worse over the past year. The first of these goals is do-able; the second is not because the third is so hard.
No confidence
Eighty per cent of his MPs expressed no confidence in Corbyn last week but, with an eye on those loyal activists, he is toughing it out. If MPs depose him, he or his treasury spokesman, John McDonnell, may be able to stand again and win. That could be enough to finish the party.
Even if the pair are locked out, the new leader will have to be a difference-splitter who squares the parliamentary party with the bolshie members and the conflicted trade unions. And so we are asked to summon enthusiasm for Angela Eagle, a smart and conscientious MP, but one whose 24 years in parliament may have been spent in cryogenic suspension for all the impact she has had on national consciousness. She would offer voters the kind of soft-left politics that earned Labour a beating 14 months ago.
The plot against Corbyn is not just creeping along pathetically, then, it is creeping along pathetically towards a mediocre destination. If the only victim were Labour itself, there would no pity in this. But the party’s retirement from serious politics allows a riven Conservative government on a rightwing trajectory to go unopposed.
It also leaves the 48 per cent of voters who wanted to remain in the EU without a UK-wide party of any stature to get behind. By all means, Labour MPs must try to remove Corbyn and replace him with a plausible prime minister. But if the mission fails, political logic and the national interest both argue for a breakaway, which might unfold as follows.
The 170-plus MPs who repudiated their leader last week would resign the Labour whip and sit as a new party of the pro-European centre left under leadership of their choosing. As the largest non-government group in the House of Commons, they would constitute the new official opposition, with all the privileges that entails. If Corbyn’s residual Labour had fewer MPs than the Scottish National party’s 54, its struggle for visibility would be hopeless.
From its parliamentary base the new party would try to recruit members. Since the referendum, the most dispossessed voters have been the 16 million who wanted continuity. If the party persuaded one in 100 of them to pay a nominal subscription, it would outnumber the Tories. Moderate Labour activists and staff would defect. Business donors, if not unions, would have an incentive to sustain the project in its precarious infancy.
Credible policies
The Liberal Democrats would be invited to merge or associate. With only eight MPs, they would be myopic churls to refuse. The hard left would keep the Labour name and infrastructure, but these earthly things matter less than credible policies and people. The new party would have those. Instead of 200 simultaneous byelections, it would stand at the next general election and ask the new prime minister, who will be chosen by just 150,000 Tories in the coming weeks, to hold it as soon as possible. The trauma of the Limehouse Declaration – under which Jenkins and his colleagues David Owen, Shirley Williams and Bill Rodgers signalled their intention to leave the party – has paralysed Labour moderates. But if they are going to be cowed by history, they should get that history right. In the end, the SDP won, and won big.
The past four prime ministers – John Major, Tony Blair, Gordon Brown and David Cameron – have tried to blend a free economy, a substantial state, cultural looseness and EU membership. Jenkins sensed where the country was going, just too early. Last month’s eruption has broken his consensus but it still commands half of Britons. A new party must speak for them.
Lurdan
old wave
As Labour splits, a new party is emerging - Times (Paywalled)
Rachel Sylvester
Rachel Sylvester
Three months ago the idea of a fresh political grouping was seen as mad. Now the tectonic plates are beginning to move
Like the Fisher King in T S Eliot’s poem The Waste Land, Jeremy Corbyn presides over the Labour Party, impotent and unable to perform his task, while behind him his kingdom turns into an “arid plain”. “I was neither living nor dead, and I knew nothing,” says another voice in the poem. This Labour ordeal cannot — and will not — go on.
Yesterday, the leader posted a video message for members urging the party to “come together now”, but the mood of the moderates is hardening. The Unite union leader Len McCluskey may describe Mr Corbyn as a “man of steel” but he is up against MPs who are fighting for their political survival.
Once 172 MPs have declared no confidence in their leader it is hard to see how a deal can be struck.
This is not just about an individual, it’s a fundamental disagreement about the balance between ideological purity and pursuit of power. If Mr Corbyn somehow stays, or is replaced by another hard-left candidate, MPs are in no doubt about what will happen — as several told me: “The party will split.”
Already the possibilities are being explored. One option is for the rebels to make a “unilateral declaration of independence” in the House of Commons, setting up a separate grouping with their own leader.
As they would have more MPs, they could argue that they, and not Mr Corbyn’s rump, should be the official opposition. There would also be a legal fight for the Labour name, with the larger chunk of MPs pushing to retain the brand, funding and infrastructure. A former shadow cabinet minister describes this as a “Clause One rather than a Clause Four moment” because the first line of the party’s constitution defines its purpose as “to organise and maintain in parliament and in the country a political Labour Party”.
What is fascinating, though, is that a growing number of MPs, peers, candidates and advisers now believe that it is time to start again with a new party of the centre left. Three months ago it was seen as foolish, or even heretical, to suggest such a thing, but since the EU referendum the idea has become mainstream. The Brexit vote has changed everything, with a former cabinet minister talking of the exciting possibilities for a “party of the 48 per cent”.
Privately many senior figures — not just so-called Blairites, but also former Brownites and people who subscribe to the “Blue Labour” approach — are coming around to the idea of breaking away.
One MP says it’s a question of supply and demand: “There is clearly a market for a new party of the centre left because there are so many people who feel they have no one to vote for. Labour is veering to the left and the Tories to the right so that leaves a gap.”
A former Downing Street adviser argues that it will be impossible for moderates to win back control of the Labour Party because the membership is likely to remain dominated by leftwingers. The trade unions, which were once a force for moderation, have become part of the problem, encouraging the drift to the left. In his view: “Nobody wants a new party for the sake of it but it’s starting to look inevitable.”
Already, potential donors who could support such a venture are being discussed. “Money would not be a problem. You would need £8 million and you could raise that in a week,” says one of those involved behind the scenes. “If Corbyn stays then we have another organisation that isn’t called the Labour Party. That gets exciting because it doesn’t have all the baggage, the links to the unions; you could create a new constitution and policy programme. There’s a massive opportunity for a pro-business, socially liberal party in favour of the EU.”
It would also have a “pragmatic” approach to immigration and crime, in an attempt to win over some white working-class voters in Labour’s industrial heartlands.
As one strategist says: “What the referendum showed is that the Labour core vote is not a core vote. You have to reinvent the electoral coalition.”
Money would not be a problem. You would need £8 million and you could raise that in a week
Links forged across party divides in the Remain campaign have been maintained and are forming the basis of new alliances. Pro-European MPs from all parties have already met in the House of Commons to discuss co-operation as Brexit legislation goes through parliament. Lord Ashdown of Norton-sub-Hamdon, the former Liberal Democrats leader, has also been talking to Labour and Tory grandees about creating a cross-party movement for people with “modern progressive views”.
He argues that the two main parties are no longer capable of holding together the divergent views within them. “In the present crisis in which everything is incredibly fluid the old structures of politics seem to be breaking down.”
Those yearning for a new party have always been haunted by the failure of the SDP in the 1980s but the situation now is completely different. An overwhelming majority of MPs oppose Labour’s current direction of travel. More importantly, the country has changed socially, culturally and politically. The old tribal allegiances have gone: in the EU referendum, vast numbers of Labour voters in the northern industrial heartlands defied their party’s line to vote for Brexit.
The old saying that “a monkey with a red rosette could win” in safe Labour seats proved to be spectacularly out of date in Scotland. Politics is more fluid than ever. In 1966, only 13 per cent of voters changed their minds about who to support from the previous election. Last year, according to the British Election Study, 38 per cent of people switched parties between 2010 and 2015.
All over Europe new parties are using social media to capitalise on an insurgent mood. Last month the Five Star Movement, which has positioned itself as being beyond the ideological divisions of left and right, won a landslide victory against the prime minister Matteo Renzi’s Democratic Party in Rome. Podemos has shaken up Spanish politics. In Denmark, The Alternative, which broke away from the Social Liberal Party in 2013, has won seats by crowd-sourcing policies through “political laboratories”.
Although it is harder for new parties to flourish under the British first past the post voting system than with proportional representation, MPs believe that Labour is becoming so marginalised that it would be possible for a more sensible, modern, centre-left alternative to usurp it as the main opposition to the Conservatives.
With every threat comes an opportunity. Antonio Gramsci talked of the morbid symptoms that appear during a crisis when “the old is dying and the new cannot be born”. That is exactly what Labour is suffering now.
It is time for the new to emerge from the wasteland of the old.
Like the Fisher King in T S Eliot’s poem The Waste Land, Jeremy Corbyn presides over the Labour Party, impotent and unable to perform his task, while behind him his kingdom turns into an “arid plain”. “I was neither living nor dead, and I knew nothing,” says another voice in the poem. This Labour ordeal cannot — and will not — go on.
Yesterday, the leader posted a video message for members urging the party to “come together now”, but the mood of the moderates is hardening. The Unite union leader Len McCluskey may describe Mr Corbyn as a “man of steel” but he is up against MPs who are fighting for their political survival.
Once 172 MPs have declared no confidence in their leader it is hard to see how a deal can be struck.
This is not just about an individual, it’s a fundamental disagreement about the balance between ideological purity and pursuit of power. If Mr Corbyn somehow stays, or is replaced by another hard-left candidate, MPs are in no doubt about what will happen — as several told me: “The party will split.”
Already the possibilities are being explored. One option is for the rebels to make a “unilateral declaration of independence” in the House of Commons, setting up a separate grouping with their own leader.
As they would have more MPs, they could argue that they, and not Mr Corbyn’s rump, should be the official opposition. There would also be a legal fight for the Labour name, with the larger chunk of MPs pushing to retain the brand, funding and infrastructure. A former shadow cabinet minister describes this as a “Clause One rather than a Clause Four moment” because the first line of the party’s constitution defines its purpose as “to organise and maintain in parliament and in the country a political Labour Party”.
What is fascinating, though, is that a growing number of MPs, peers, candidates and advisers now believe that it is time to start again with a new party of the centre left. Three months ago it was seen as foolish, or even heretical, to suggest such a thing, but since the EU referendum the idea has become mainstream. The Brexit vote has changed everything, with a former cabinet minister talking of the exciting possibilities for a “party of the 48 per cent”.
Privately many senior figures — not just so-called Blairites, but also former Brownites and people who subscribe to the “Blue Labour” approach — are coming around to the idea of breaking away.
One MP says it’s a question of supply and demand: “There is clearly a market for a new party of the centre left because there are so many people who feel they have no one to vote for. Labour is veering to the left and the Tories to the right so that leaves a gap.”
A former Downing Street adviser argues that it will be impossible for moderates to win back control of the Labour Party because the membership is likely to remain dominated by leftwingers. The trade unions, which were once a force for moderation, have become part of the problem, encouraging the drift to the left. In his view: “Nobody wants a new party for the sake of it but it’s starting to look inevitable.”
Already, potential donors who could support such a venture are being discussed. “Money would not be a problem. You would need £8 million and you could raise that in a week,” says one of those involved behind the scenes. “If Corbyn stays then we have another organisation that isn’t called the Labour Party. That gets exciting because it doesn’t have all the baggage, the links to the unions; you could create a new constitution and policy programme. There’s a massive opportunity for a pro-business, socially liberal party in favour of the EU.”
It would also have a “pragmatic” approach to immigration and crime, in an attempt to win over some white working-class voters in Labour’s industrial heartlands.
As one strategist says: “What the referendum showed is that the Labour core vote is not a core vote. You have to reinvent the electoral coalition.”
Money would not be a problem. You would need £8 million and you could raise that in a week
Links forged across party divides in the Remain campaign have been maintained and are forming the basis of new alliances. Pro-European MPs from all parties have already met in the House of Commons to discuss co-operation as Brexit legislation goes through parliament. Lord Ashdown of Norton-sub-Hamdon, the former Liberal Democrats leader, has also been talking to Labour and Tory grandees about creating a cross-party movement for people with “modern progressive views”.
He argues that the two main parties are no longer capable of holding together the divergent views within them. “In the present crisis in which everything is incredibly fluid the old structures of politics seem to be breaking down.”
Those yearning for a new party have always been haunted by the failure of the SDP in the 1980s but the situation now is completely different. An overwhelming majority of MPs oppose Labour’s current direction of travel. More importantly, the country has changed socially, culturally and politically. The old tribal allegiances have gone: in the EU referendum, vast numbers of Labour voters in the northern industrial heartlands defied their party’s line to vote for Brexit.
The old saying that “a monkey with a red rosette could win” in safe Labour seats proved to be spectacularly out of date in Scotland. Politics is more fluid than ever. In 1966, only 13 per cent of voters changed their minds about who to support from the previous election. Last year, according to the British Election Study, 38 per cent of people switched parties between 2010 and 2015.
All over Europe new parties are using social media to capitalise on an insurgent mood. Last month the Five Star Movement, which has positioned itself as being beyond the ideological divisions of left and right, won a landslide victory against the prime minister Matteo Renzi’s Democratic Party in Rome. Podemos has shaken up Spanish politics. In Denmark, The Alternative, which broke away from the Social Liberal Party in 2013, has won seats by crowd-sourcing policies through “political laboratories”.
Although it is harder for new parties to flourish under the British first past the post voting system than with proportional representation, MPs believe that Labour is becoming so marginalised that it would be possible for a more sensible, modern, centre-left alternative to usurp it as the main opposition to the Conservatives.
With every threat comes an opportunity. Antonio Gramsci talked of the morbid symptoms that appear during a crisis when “the old is dying and the new cannot be born”. That is exactly what Labour is suffering now.
It is time for the new to emerge from the wasteland of the old.
danny la rouge
More like *fanny* la rouge!
Cheers.
redsquirrel
This Machine Kills Progressives
Ta for those Lurdan
Utter rubbish of course I particularly like the comparison of the 5 star movement with a bunch of professional politician wankers
Utter rubbish of course I particularly like the comparison of the 5 star movement with a bunch of professional politician wankers
DotCommunist
So many particulars. So many questions.
determined to make it a shit re run of the 80's, because thats what they grew up on
Pickman's model
Starry Wisdom
butchersapron
Bring back hanging
They are amateur politician wankers of course.
Treacle Toes
Time
Angela Eagle puts Labour leadership on temporary hold for last-ditch unions move
Breathe everyone... Angela is letting Tom handle it, for now.
Breathe everyone... Angela is letting Tom handle it, for now.
redsquirrel
This Machine Kills Progressives
It's like one of those "Closing Down Sales" that goes on for years.
DotCommunist
So many particulars. So many questions.
Tom Watsons acceptance speech was the most bombastic and humblebraggy at the same time speech I think I've ever seen. Even Sadiq managed to not look like a massive cunt with his. Watsons went on for hours. Empires rose and fell. Now he is clearly trying to be saviour of the party. If you can break the union menz tom, you fucking pinkerton, then the party is yours!
Bernie Gunther
Fundamentalist Druid
Some analysis of NEC nominations, which I'd guess is spun from Progress pov.
Luke Akehurst: NEC analysis shows Momentum thriving in unwinnable seats | LabourList
Luke Akehurst: NEC analysis shows Momentum thriving in unwinnable seats | LabourList
Last edited:
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