philosophical
Well-Known Member
Here come de judge
Is Brexit actually going to happen?
- Thread starter Kaka Tim
- Start date
Bahnhof Strasse
Met up with Hannah Courtoy a week next Tuesday
£4 - that included onward travel to America, which what what the vast majority of people fleeing Russia at that time did.
binka
!!!!!!!!!
I don't find it at all difficult to imagine millions of people wanting to move to the UK if it were possible
Jeremiah18.17
Well-Known Member
The elephant in the room is that with climate change of catastrophic proportions nailed on without significant social and economic change - revolution even - then mass migration of a scale never seen before is also nailed on. The only questions at the moment are the size, extent, speed and culpability for the genocides we are staring down the barrel of.
Supine
Newt Member
As opposed to what? A Tory hard Brexit that creates an island prison state that nobody can enter unless they have two million quid to invest ?
teuchter
je suis teuchter
Yes, it is self interest to reject truly open borders but it is not inconsistent with preferring to remain in the EU.
Who's doing that?
DexterTCN
Troy and Abed in the morning
It's generally you and your mates who shout about Greece.
But you never say how brexit helps Greece...or what brexiteers plans are to help Greece after brexit. I've never heard anything about helping Greece or Greeks.
Are Greek immigrants welcome, for instance?
sealion
Conformity is the last refuge of the unimaginitive
I don't expect you, a remainer to be highlighting the shit they've been served up.
Here comes the predictable guilt trip shit again
What the fuck are you on about now ??
Are you asking me personally or do you think i'm the spokesman for government ?
sealion
Conformity is the last refuge of the unimaginitive
Yay! you win, fuck all. Whats you and your mates view on Greece? It's swerved and met with stoney silence when mentioned here. Its generally you and your sneering mate/s that ignore this. How will voting remain help Greece ?
toblerone3
Grrrrr
Open borders is almost certainly where we're heading we just don't know the path we will take to get there. I cant imagine a world where the most dynamic economic sectors are knowledge industries and service sectors, where information flows freely across via the internet and where international travel is increasingly easy and cheap ever really being able to put up strong borders if it is to prosper. Of course i accept that many things could slow or even temporarily reverse the tide of history and war or environmental catastrophe are threats as always, but these are just temporary wobbles. The direction of travel is clear IMHO.
Pickman's model
Starry Wisdom
Yeh we're on the highway to hell
Borders are big business I think. Hence their importance. Sorry I lack sources for this.
Not that huge actually if this article is right.
What the 2014 Border Security Expo Can Teach Us About Our Securitized Nation
What the 2014 Border Security Expo Can Teach Us About Our Securitized Nation
NoXion
Craicy the Squirrel
Isn't globalisation still increasing?
toblerone3
Grrrrr
Trotskyist hell maybe.
Yeah but globalisation depend on borders. Ie a worker in a low paid country can't leave.
MickiQ
In My Defence I was left Unsupervised
Borders exist for two reasons in the case of repressive regimes they exist to keep the population in, there aren't all that many countries left in the world now that use them for that purpose, the other reason is to keep rhe riff-raff out. Who the riff-raff are varies from country to country, In the case of places like Saudi or Iran it's to keep out people with ideas the regime finds dangerous, In the case of the USA it's largely to keep out non-Americans.
In the case of Western Europe it's largely to keep out people from places whose average living standards are lower than ours like Africa, the Middle East or South America, mostly because we're selfish bastards and don't want to share. It's not that people from low paid countries can't leave it's that they have nowhere to go.
I use to work for a large American company that had loads of staff in 3rd world coutnries and use to deal with colleagues from India, the Philippines, Romania and Mexico on a regular basis, they didn't consider themselves exploited they may have been paid less than me but they were paid much better than the people around them and thought globalisation was great.
The people in places like that who might went to leave are the peasant farmers and their ilk and the global economy hasn't really touched those people.
Pickman's model
Starry Wisdom
All regimes are repressive
NoXion
Craicy the Squirrel
Including anarchist ones.
This is a bad argument. The category of illegal immigrant enables exploitation in rich countries as well as poor. People forced to live in the shadows easily exploitable by criminal gangs and criminal employers with no recourse to the law. Legal but precarious immigrants at risk of expulsion if convicted of a crime or their paperwork gets messed up. People who look or sound like they don't belong penalised daily by jobsworths and haters in ways large and small. Low income families split up if they fail the wrong tests. The nativist rhetoric feeds scrounger rhetoric and a surveillance imperative which penalises low income citizens too.
Workers are undermined by borders whether they want to move across them or not. In a state where workers are easily exploited open borders undermine them too. I don't know all the answers but a strong labour movement is the place to start.
philosophical
Well-Known Member
I think I read today that it is proposed to move Marmite production to Holland.
People will either love or hate that news I suppose.
People will either love or hate that news I suppose.
philosophical
Well-Known Member
Perhaps post Brexit UK will strike a free trade deal with Australia for Vegemite.
Ranbay
The same rules apply
We sell them Marmite they sell us Vegemite.... i like it.
not-bono-ever
meh
a point that disucssions of globalism often miss- it isnt free movement for everyone,it cannot be, otherwise globalism begins to get all ouroboros
gentlegreen
I hummus, therefore I am ...
Apparently they sell one jar of marmite every 3 seconds.
I was going to say the unique taste relies on specific beer dregs from a brewery across the road, but it seems they have to buy it in from all over these days ...
Google Maps
I was going to say the unique taste relies on specific beer dregs from a brewery across the road, but it seems they have to buy it in from all over these days ...
Google Maps
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