Is Brexit actually going to happen?

[NoXion]

I see it as the UK wanting a border, the brexit vote frequently being declared as a method of regaining control of the border.
Who are the UK voters to say what the Irish should accept?

Declared by whom?

 

[Winot]

So border checks aren't actually required.

Are you being so clever that I am missing the point or so stupid that you are?

Whilst we are in the SM and CU we are one market with the EU. Free movement of goods etc. Checks arise when we are in different markets.

 

[DotCommunist]

What was your previous activity as regards the UK Irish border?

he was in the border campaign obvs

So there will be checks.

and it'll be 1969 all over again, even the music.

 

[philosophical]

What was your previous activity as regards the UK Irish border?

You like to play the man not the ball quite a lot, for example asking about my age yesterday?
If it interests you I was born in Kent, but have an Irish passport, I have a brother and wider family living in the Republic, as a child, because of the obvious Irishness of my mother (accent) I and my family were subject to anti Irish racist abuse. I travel to and from the Republic frequently, and I have lived a lot of my life under the shadow of, and very close to, the Irish related terrorism generated from the late sixties to the mid nineties.
More specifically, I have raised the issues of the Irish border in debate before the referendum, and continually ever since. Including directly in hustings face to face before last years election, and in writing to my MP.
I don't know if that qualifies as activity, but it qualifies as a bit of experience.

 

[butchersapron]

No it isn't. People pay taxes long before their income rises to a liveable level.

Yet you talk of tax on income.

This is shameless.

 

[NoXion]

Are you being so clever that I am missing the point or so stupid that you are?

Whilst we are in the SM and CU we are one market with the EU. Free movement of goods etc. Checks arise when we are in different markets.

So there are arrangements in which checks are not required. You've almost got it.

 

[butchersapron]

You like to play the man not the ball quite a lot, for example asking about my age yesterday?
If it interests you I was born in Kent, but have an Irish passport, I have a brother and wider family living in the Republic, as a child, because of the obvious Irishness of my mother (accent) I and my family were subject to anti Irish racist abuse. I travel to and from the Republic frequently, and I have lived a lot of my life under the shadow of, and very close to, the Irish related terrorism generated from the late sixties to the mid nineties.
More specifically, I have raised the issues of the Irish border in debate before the referendum, and continually ever since. Including directly in hustings face to face before last years election, and in writing to my MP.
I don't know if that qualifies as activity, but it qualifies as a bit of experience.

So nothing. No activity. Yet suddenly sprung into action in the last year or so.

 

[sealion]

No it isn't. People pay taxes long before their income rises to a liveable level.

There are are thousands of low paid workers in full time employment claiming benefits to top up there wages.

 

[Winot]

So there are arrangements in which checks are not required. You've almost got it.

Oh do fuck off.

 

[NoXion]

Oh do fuck off.

Concession accepted.

 

[butchersapron]

Oh do fuck off.

There you go, knew we'd get the brixton gentrifier out of you before long.

 

[andysays]

Why does this keep getting repeated on here? It’s been pointed out multiple times that it is international trade rules (determined by the WTO) that requires border checks.

It's been claimed, but not sure it's actually been demonstrated.

As far as I can see, however, whatever the WTO says, it's the EU regs which would require a hard border to control what goods go into the EU and 'protect' all EU countries (not just Eire) from 'contamination'

 

[Winot]

Concession accepted.

Yes the great thing about U75 is that you can read the views of people who have a different perspective to you, learn new things and sometimes even change your own mind. It's a shame that in between there is patronising crap from people who mistake being unclear and gnomic for being smart.

 

[Winot]

It's been claimed, but not sure it's actually been demonstrated.

As far as I can see, however, whatever the WTO says, it's the EU regs which would require a hard border to control what goods go into the EU and 'protect' all EU countries (not just Eire) from 'contamination'

I'd be interested to hear more about this.

 

[philosophical]

You voted for them therefore you voted for more of the same.

More of the same structures certainly, with an opportunity to influence change from the 'same'.

 

[Pickman's model]

Yes the great thing about U75 is that you can read the views of people who have a different perspective to you, learn new things and sometimes even change your own mind. It's a shame that in between there is patronising crap from people who mistake being unclear and gnomic for being smart.

you can change people's minds. you did change mine, as once upon a time i thought you might occasionally post stuff worth reading. i know better now.

 

[sealion]

with an opportunity to influence change from the 'same'.

What influence do yo have ?

 

[philosophical]

Declared by whom?

Theresa may is one example. She repeated it last Friday, and last Sunday too. The brexiters friend Farage says it, they all say it. A cursory watch of question time, and other similar programmes you hear lots of people say it.
It is continually repeated that the British people voted brexit to regain control of it's borders.
This stuff may have passed you by, but I assure you it is true.

 

[NoXion]

Theresa may is one example. She repeated it last Friday, and last Sunday too. The brexiters friend Farage says it, they all say it. A cursory watch of question time, and other similar programmes you hear lots of people say it.
It is continually repeated that the British people voted brexit to regain control of it's borders.
This stuff may have passed you by, but I assure you it is true.

The word of right-wing politicians being of course totally unimpeachable.

 

[philosophical]

What influence do yo have ?

Participating in the EU democratic structures. About the same degree of influence as most people.

 

[philosophical]

The word of right-wing politicians being of course totally unimpeachable.

The right wing politicians and 17 million others who won the brexit vote. That is the problem. We are in the realm of action, action guided by the word of the Alt Right. It alarms me that those purporting to be of the left seem so sanguine about that.
Brexit has chained people to the right wing, even Corbyns Labour are going for it despite their chance to be an alternative.

 

[sealion]

Participating in the EU democratic structures. About the same degree of influence as most people.

What are these opportunities you speak of ? How are going you going to influence change and what changes are you on about here?

 

[philosophical]

Yet you talk of tax on income.

This is shameless.

I said people pay tax before their income is high enough, I didn't talk of income tax as such. There are other forms. I reckon income tax is fair enough for certain people though, even if you think that is shameless.

 

[NoXion]

The right wing politicians and 17 million others who won the brexit vote. That is the problem. We are in the realm of action, action guided by the word of the Alt Right. It alarms me that those purporting to be of the left seem so sanguine about that.
Brexit has chained people to the right wing, even Corbyns Labour are going for it despite their chance to be an alternative.

You're doing it again. On what basis do you assume that all 17 million people voted Brexit because of border issues? None. My Brexit vote certainly had nothing to do with it. Thanks for the smear of racism by the way.

 

[butchersapron]

I said people pay tax before their income is high enough, I didn't talk of income tax as such. There are other forms. I reckon income tax is fair enough for certain people though, even if you think that is shameless.

You were replying to a post about income tax. Pathetic shape-shifting.

 

[butchersapron]

Participating in the EU democratic structures. About the same degree of influence as most people.

Enumerate the many ways please.

Also, the people who aren't most people - companies who get direct un-elected representation on bodies above what 'most people' get - what of them? Isn't that akin to - or worse - than your dreaded House of Lords?

 

[philosophical]

What are these opportunities you speak of ? How are going you going to influence change and what changes are you on about here?

EU elections for one.
The same kind of opportunities UK voters have domestically, but without the contamination of a Monarchy and House of Lords, and a first past the post system.

 

[sealion]

 

[philosophical]

You were replying to a post about income tax. Pathetic shape-shifting.

You may wish to read back and get things right.
'Pathetic'?
As I said earlier playing the man not the ball.

 

[philosophical]

Enumerate the many ways please.

See 5953