Information on taking refugees into our homes

[ViolentPanda]

if it did there would be no rough sleepers or homeless families in b&bs.

So the state wouldn't find a way to frustrate public efforts? Personally, I'm pretty sure they would, just as they attempt to frustrate soup kitchens and blanket runs.

 

[Citizen66]

I've already had several rows with members of the "charity begins at home" mob. A lot of them don't "get" that compassion doesn't end at Dover.

The charity begins at home mob tend to not have much compassion generally.

 

[frogwoman]

Lebanon's been taking people in from Syria since the war started, and while I don't think the Turkish government has done anything official (apart from to try and queer the pitch for the Kurds) there's lots of Syrian refugees in Turkey.

1 in 4 people in Lebanon is now a Syrian refugee and when syria had 'elections' a couple years ago there was footage of many of them lining up to vote for assad. Not everyone is fleeing assad, many of them are fleeing the other parties in the conflict.

This is what the Syrian election looks like in Lebanon

Their views on the conflict/on social issues are likely to be very different to yours and i'd say that above anything else it's important to be able to offer financial stability of some sort (no good taking someone into your house who isnt allowed to work/receive benefits if you're on benefits/minimum wage and struggle to pay bills yourself) and above all be able to listen to them / be understanding

But this isn't enough, they will need people who have experience with the issues they're facing. sometimes good intentions really aren't enough

 

[frogwoman]

The charity begins at home mob tend to not have much compassion generally.

'What about all the unemployed british people that I don't give a shit about either'

 

[Pickman's model]

So the state wouldn't find a way to frustrate public efforts? Personally, I'm pretty sure they would, just as they attempt to frustrate soup kitchens and blanket runs.

if charity began with the most needy... but if course it doesn't

 

[Citizen66]

'What about all the unemployed british people that I don't give a shit about either'

Exactly. Aren't they just spongers?

 

[treelover]

I'm waiting for Rees and German to take people into their homes, both refugees and sanctioned claimants.

 

[Spymaster]

Are you going to answer my question?

The notion that C66 has made a comment based on your skin colour is ludicrous and unworthy of a response.

 

[ViolentPanda]

Apart from the perceived economic issues and the logistics of what to do with them, you can't just open the doors to tens thousands of folk that you know next to nothing about. Among their numbers will be criminals of all flavours, there may be medical issues, folk who want to do others harm, extremists, etc etc ...

There has to be some kind of vetting process. No borders is fucking stupid.

The problem being that the people who control who comes in, they're the same folks that let in Abu Hamza, "Sheikh" Omar Bakri and hundreds of other Islamist extremists when it was convenient to do so. I wouldn't trust them to vet the candidates for school milk monitor, let alone vet refugees.

 

[frogwoman]

I'm waiting for Rees and German to take people into their homes, both refugees and sanctioned claimants.

Not sure what they have to do with this thread.

 

[ddraig]

I'm waiting for Rees and German to take people into their homes, both refugees and sanctioned claimants.

Will you be doing either?? Presume you already have sanctioned claimants as no one else cares about the other than you..

 

[ViolentPanda]

Why can't we just let them in. They are stranded in makeshift camps with fuck all that they've risked their lives to get to. Many of these men are just teenage boys, not really men at all. Let them in.

Practically, because "just letting them in" would probably cause the refugees as many problems as it solved, sadly. "Streaming" them through camps allows a safe roof over their heads, while their needs (medical and physical) are assessed.
For example, on the medical side,one problem that springs to mind is that TB occurrence. While it isn't rife in the ME/NA, is still a problem, so refugees would need to be screened (and if necessary, treated), and it's simpler to do that at the outset, than when they've been in the UK a year or more, and start manifesting symptoms.
On the physical side, it's "easier" to disperse people from a central point to places where there are spaces, than to cross your fingers and hope for some kind of equilibrium. In the end it's about logistics and the need of the state to control.

 

[Buddy Bradley]

<Obligatory mention of Betjeman's work>

But spare the bald young clerks who add
The profits of the stinking cad;
It’s not their fault that they are mad,
They’ve tasted Hell.

 

[Fingers]

The charity begins at home mob tend to not have much compassion generally.

The 'charity begins at home' lot are probably the least likely to give to charity in my experience.

 

[Zabo]

I'm intrigued as to where Camoron will settle the refugees given they are only promising financial support for one year. No doubt these people will not be settled in communities where an increase in the Community Charge will have an impact on the Vermin Party vote.

Local Government Association

 

[gosub]

1 in 4 people in Lebanon is now a Syrian refugee and when syria had 'elections' a couple years ago there was footage of many of them lining up to vote for assad. Not everyone is fleeing assad, many of them are fleeing the other parties in the conflict.

This is what the Syrian election looks like in Lebanon

Their views on the conflict/on social issues are likely to be very different to yours and i'd say that above anything else it's important to be able to offer financial stability of some sort (no good taking someone into your house who isnt allowed to work/receive benefits if you're on benefits/minimum wage and struggle to pay bills yourself) and above all be able to listen to them / be understanding

But this isn't enough, they will need people who have experience with the issues they're facing. sometimes good intentions really aren't enough

Most the dispossessed have just moved to another part of Syria, about half the population. Fleeing the mayhem caused by 5% of the population trying to inflicts their will with guns, barrel bombs and the like.

 

[gosub]

I'm intrigued as to where Camoron will settle the refugees given they are only promising financial support for one year. No doubt these people will not be settled in communities where an increase in the Community Charge will have an impact on the Vermin Party vote.

Local Government Association

What would happen to house prices if we did something radically dangerous like build more housing stock. And the banks that exists on the back of those mortgages. Will no one think of the bankers

 

[weltweit]

When I was about 28, I picked up a young homeless hitch-hiker on the motorway and after discovering his story over the next hour, I decided to put him up in my bedsit. I basically said he could stay and that at the weekend I could help him get a job and a roof over his head. The next morning he was still asleep - so I left for work leaving him in my place.

When I returned at 6pm, there was no sign of him, my electric meter was smashed and all the money taken, some of my warmest clothes were missing, my best sleeping bag, many music cassettes, and quite a lot of my camping things were also missing.

I was incensed because I had thought I could trust him and because I had proven myself to be a mug of the highest order. I drove around all the local shelters trying to find him to get my stuff back, the thing was, if he had asked for most of the stuff to make his life easier I probably would have given most of it to him for free, what pissed me off most was that he had betrayed my trust and that I had been very gullible.

I am much more wary about how I go about helping people, since that episode.

 

[Maharani]

1 in 4 people in Lebanon is now a Syrian refugee and when syria had 'elections' a couple years ago there was footage of many of them lining up to vote for assad. Not everyone is fleeing assad, many of them are fleeing the other parties in the conflict.

This is what the Syrian election looks like in Lebanon

Their views on the conflict/on social issues are likely to be very different to yours and i'd say that above anything else it's important to be able to offer financial stability of some sort (no good taking someone into your house who isnt allowed to work/receive benefits if you're on benefits/minimum wage and struggle to pay bills yourself) and above all be able to listen to them / be understanding

But this isn't enough, they will need people who have experience with the issues they're facing. sometimes good intentions really aren't enough

Totally true and a great bit of advice, thank you frogwoman.

 

[Maharani]

Practically, because "just letting them in" would probably cause the refugees as many problems as it solved, sadly. "Streaming" them through camps allows a safe roof over their heads, while their needs (medical and physical) are assessed.
For example, on the medical side,one problem that springs to mind is that TB occurrence. While it isn't rife in the ME/NA, is still a problem, so refugees would need to be screened (and if necessary, treated), and it's simpler to do that at the outset, than when they've been in the UK a year or more, and start manifesting symptoms.
On the physical side, it's "easier" to disperse people from a central point to places where there are spaces, than to cross your fingers and hope for some kind of equilibrium. In the end it's about logistics and the need of the state to control.

And we do this already in the UK with some street homeless people:
WHAT WE DO?

It's not always favourable but it's a method that's used nowadays to get people through the system quickly. Whether or not they pass back through the revolving door again is often by the by. They say this system works for most people that use their service so they continue to drive it.

 

[Maharani]

When I was about 28, I picked up a young homeless hitch-hiker on the motorway and after discovering his story over the next hour, I decided to put him up in my bedsit. I basically said he could stay and that at the weekend I could help him get a job and a roof over his head. The next morning he was still asleep - so I left for work leaving him in my place.

When I returned at 6pm, there was no sign of him, my electric meter was smashed and all the money taken, some of my warmest clothes were missing, my best sleeping bag, many music cassettes, and quite a lot of my camping things were also missing.

I was incensed because I had thought I could trust him and because I had proven myself to be a mug of the highest order. I drove around all the local shelters trying to find him to get my stuff back, the thing was, if he had asked for most of the stuff to make his life easier I probably would have given most of it to him for free, what pissed me off most was that he had betrayed my trust and that I had been very gullible.

I am much more wary about how I go about helping people, since that episode.

This reminds me of an excellent film I watched recently:

Treacle Jr. (2010) - IMDb

 

[weltweit]

This reminds me of an excellent film I watched recently:
Treacle Jr. (2010) - IMDb

What they made a film about my naivety, I feel used .... twice

 

[ViolentPanda]

And we do this already in the UK with some street homeless people:
WHAT WE DO?

It's not always favourable but it's a method that's used nowadays to get people through the system quickly. Whether or not they pass back through the revolving door again is often by the by. They say this system works for most people that use their service so they continue to drive it.

Frankly, I think such systems work more fluidly for refugees and "emergency homeless" (whose interaction with such services are usually transient) than for hardcore homeless, many of whom are (through no fault of their own) classed as "chaotic" and "hard to help", and are pretty much the definition of someone using a revolving door.
IIRC another poster mentioned that social services etc like "No Second Night" because it takes some of the weight off of local authority shoulders.

 

[Pickman's model]

I'm waiting for Rees and German to take people into their homes, both refugees and sanctioned claimants.

i think what you mean is you're still eaiting for anyone to take them up on their offer of shelter: neither you nor i would willingly live with them, and dolees or migrants no different.

 

[crossthebreeze]

The only way I can see this working is through collective action - ie if already-existing groups such as a local church or mosque, a community group, a trade union branch, or even a football supporters group - decided to house and support one or two households of refugees - that way you might have one person providing housing whilst many people provide financial support and material goods, and other people who have good listening skills, or experience/knowledge of some of the things the refugees have been through, or have common interests or are similar ages to the refugees could also be involved. But then that brings up further problems - would someone who is muslim or atheist or not christian feel comfortable being supported by and surronded by a community surrounding a church? would someone who is right wing, anti trade union feel comfortable being supported by trade unionists? would someone who is used to living in a city deal with being supported by a village community association? in general would there be a lack of privacy for the refugees - and the sense they are "collective property"?

 

[frogwoman]

Excellent post. ^^^^

 

[frogwoman]

Indeed, some syrians might feel quite uneasy at living with people who are keen on going on demos all the time and chanting slogans against the government, they might see it as the sort of thing that helped to lead to the situation their in. Kind of goes without saying not to try and force politics or (especially) religion onto people, although that may be difficult if the only support available is through religious organisations, especially if they belong to a minority religion like yezidi where there's no established community nearby.

 

[Citizen66]

Whilst valid points, I think if you're prepared to cross continents risking life and limb escaping a place where you also risked life and limb, you might be hesitant to quibble over who was offering you safety and sanctuary, initially at least.

 

[ItWillNeverWork]

Whilst valid points, I think if you're prepared to cross continents risking life and limb escaping a place where you also risked life and limb, you might be hesitant to quibble over who was offering you safety and sanctuary, initially at least.

Or maybe more hesitant because of an understandable mistrust of other human beings and the terrible things they are capable of.

 

[q_w_e_r_t_y]

I'm slightly worried about some of these schemes.

I have taken in women refugees before (through a charity). I stopped for a while after a very traumatised woman was placed with me. I was in no place to cope with her. I had picked her up off the street as I couldnt get to the charity offices before it was closed and she became convinced that I was secretly trying to take her to Dungavel. Her experiences were way, way beyond anything that I could relate to or was prepared for.

Also, people's intentions are not always noble. For many, the motivation will be altruism and companionship - which is I guess what motivated me to do it - but I know from the stories of the people that I've taken in that many have ended up in living situations where they were basically exploited - either as childcarers, domestic labourers or for "sexual company".